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      01-08-2012, 03:12 PM   #51
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Drives: 2003.5 BMW M3
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Originally Posted by TUNEDM3 View Post
If the 911 is a true sports your AUTOMATIC AWD 911 more of a sports car then my manual only 1M? I could care less about labeling a car a sports car or not, but how can you argue the 1M is not the purest form of BMW since the E30? Have you tracked it or let alone driven one?

1M is by no means a luxury coupe, unless you classify having leather as luxurious. I have no options, manual seats, no sunroof or any electronic gadgetry. So where do you get the basis of it being a luxury coupe?

M division is still alive and just have to find the most focused models they produce. Instead of posting bullshit on the forums you should have used some of your ingenius automotive foresight and placed a deposit on one of the best M cars ever made.

Now go ahead and make up some bullshit response and contradict yourself yet again.
oh t-neck.

i never said MY 911 was the purest form of what a sports car is, but you can't say to me that the 1M is a uncompromised sports car. my 911 has compromises. i admit it. i did say that porsche still offers the option for people to have a real sports car. and by that i am referring to the gt3 and the gt3 rs and if you want to go by your motto - you can order a carrera s stripped. those cars can be equipped with all sorts of luxury items, but thats usually the case with porsche - they allow you to make a 50k boxster into a 100k entry level convertible. but at the end of the day, the gt3 is the purest 911 they make and it has to be since its a homologated model. no m car that bmw makes does that, for me at least.

my basis for the 1m being a luxury coupe is pretty much the way i think of bmw. u know it and i know it, the m3 used to be a sports car first and a daily driver second. due to cafe regulations and more importantly competition with Audi and Mercedes, now wants their cars to be more efficient and fuel economical than performance based. i.e. why bmw is bringing turbos to the m line and there are only a few v8s and v12s in the line up and NO MORE INLINE 6 motors - that was what BMW was based on, remember?

the 1m is more of a daily driver than an uncompromised car. i remember a video of you talking about what the ideal bmw sports car was. size of the 1 series, lighter car, with a different motor - dunno if you said v8 or v10 - definitely not a twin turbo motor. bmw has the ability to give the 1m an adjustable suspension like the gt3. bmw has the ability to give the 1m brembo brakes, like the gt3. bmw has the ability to give the 1m proper under car aerodynamics, like the gt3. but it doesn't, because its not a sports car. its a car that you can drive on a daily basis, but also is sporty. not a true sports car. a true sports car kind of takes practicality out of the situation. its more focused. i.e. cayman r or gt3. but thats what makes BMW great. they take cars that are practical and make them a bit more focused, but still they have compromises (build quality, mechanical problems, weight, etc.)

how many of the 3000 1m"s were ordered as stripper cars like yours? not many. most of the 1Ms that dealers sourced, I've checked, all have navigation. bmw is in the business, as they should be, of making profit vs. making the best car they can make. not saying porsche doesn't do that as well, but porsche does offer those kind of models for the us. if BMW brought the GTS or the E46 M3 CSL here, like they made the e36 ltw, then i'd say, yeah thats the bmw sports car. otherwise, they are all compromised.

i didn't put an order on the 1M because, in my 335xi i have the same motor, and i wouldn't trust that motor as a track car motor. as a daily driver sure, but not a track car motor. i also would have preferred the v8 m3 over the 1M. + if i had 50k to spend, i would buy a 996 GT3 for that price. i think that coil overs, intake, exhaust, tune, tires, brakes, will all add up to the cost of a used 996 GT3.

so in conclusion, the term sports car is too broad. what a sports car for one person, may not be a sports car to another. to me, i don't think bmw makes ANY sports cars for US sales. the only sports car they make is the GTS, but even then its more money than a GT3 and doesn't perform nearly as well.

so no, bmw makes NO sports cars and the 1M, in my eyes, is a luxury coupe. obviously more focused than a 135 or a 335, but still not a sports car.

edit: saw this on wikipedia

"Sports car versus sporting models

A car may be a sporting automobile without being a sports car. Performance modifications of regular, production cars, such as sport compacts, sports sedans, muscle cars, hot hatches and the like, generally are not considered sports cars, yet share traits common to sports cars. They are sometimes called "sports cars" for marketing purposes for increased advertising and promotional purposes.[5] Performance cars of all configurations are grouped as Sports and Grand tourer cars or, occasionally, as performance cars."

that sounds like what BMW makes. sporting automobile.

-Crossa, Robert G. and Dixit, Ashutosh. "Customer-centric pricing: The surprising secret for profitability" Business Horizons, Volume 48, Issue 6, November-December 2005, pages 483–491.-

2012 BMW 128i

Last edited by PKumarM3; 01-08-2012 at 03:19 PM.