Originally Posted by StevenY.
Would it be too much to offer 5k less than what they want?
Are you afraid they'll throw you out of the showroom if you offer too little?
If your first offer is accepted, you offered too much. Some might say if you haven't stormed out of the dealership at least once, you've left money on the table.
I can't comment on the listed cars, but recommend surveying all the other cars for sale in the region and compare pricing. That'll tell you if these are in line or above/below other comparables (matched for mileage/options/age, and factor in history, condition, and color). Then negotiate away.