Originally Posted by late apex
Any car M division makes is a "real M car". Successful companies cannot live in the past, they have to continue with product development and keep up with modern trends. Not to mention be innovative and first to the market with certain things. If you like older BMWs, they're still around to be bought! Don't expect the company to stop progressing and move backwards... with the new regulations in place they couldn't do it even if they wanted. Porsche is known for producing driver's cars as well, yet they also have noise generators and automated gear boxes. Hell, some people are upset the new GT3 doesn't come with a manual. I like one Porsche's engineer response "Yes, we love manuals too, but we love winning even more!). No company is investing money in manual transmissions anymore... it's outdated technology. That would be like IT companies spending money on coax cable instead of fiber optic.
The new M cars are not out of place on a track! You're just not paying attention to them because they're not what they used to be (but they're faster than ever). Some people are slow to accept change, there's nothing wrong with that.
Pretty sure the car I suggested (carbon fiber tub sedan with N52) would get better fuel economy than an F30 335i-- much less bulk to drag around. And it would certainly be moving forward. My suggestion was not that they should live in the past, so much as it was that I wish they would continue to build cars to the same ideals they did 10 years ago. Either way, I don't expect BMW to do it-- they make more money selling more cars to non enthusiasts with their plan.
I am among the people very sad about the loss of 6mt in the GT3. The ultimate 911 for me is the 997.2 GT3 for sure. I am hoping they'll make a Cayman R(S?) with 6mt, as the cayman is a much better starting place than the 911 anyway. The 911 has gone soft/GT enough that they could probably justify the case for another segment for it these days.
Certainly there's still used BMW to be bought. Ten years from now, that's going to be a trickier situation. I wanted to get my wife an e46 3 series wagon, but they're all already pretty beat... so we're going to getting her an e91 instead. It's just not possible to get a used e46 in the condition I want anymore (at least in non Ms, plenty of M3 bubble cars around still). The hunt for a no idrive, no automatic, no awd, post facelift wagon is not a short one, however.
I don't even know how to respond to someone thinking an M6 is in its element on track. A video of it on the ring in no way proves anything (for that matter, the ring is a track unlike any other-- large/heavy/high power cars are way more in there element there than any other track).
Originally Posted by Jamesons Viggen
What are you disagreeing with in my statement?
I said nothing about old vs new. I said I like both, having BOTH in my stable for their specific strengths.
I feel like your statement is just exaggeration and lacks proper first hand experience, something I get every day by driving each of the two cars. Manuals suck to shift? What? Engines that lag? What?
I war responding to "But what you said today, about the F30 vs IS and ATS, well it's less about BMW and more about the competency of the competition."
I have lots of experience with the new cars. I've had them as loaners and have a friend that works at the local dealership, so I routinely borrow all of their new cars to play with.