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      11-16-2007, 10:36 AM   #13
mikem
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bumps View Post
But that's more power than a 330d. And the 330d has about 80lb/ft more torque, which will be across a similar rev range. And with 325ds at about £2.5K cheaper than 330ds at list price, then factor in a remap, the savvy buyer may well buy a 325d and remap it, all for about £2K less than the cost of a new 330d. That gives him/her leather and Nav with a discount thrown in. You're effectively getting the 3.0 litre d engine in the 325d, just in a lower state of tune. The newer engines are resistant to remapping, as has been discussed elsewhere. BMW can therefore introduce the "23d" and be surer that nobody can map it easily, whereas the "25d" can be, and it's thirstier and emits more CO2. So, I reckon the "23d" engine is paving the way for getting rid of the "25d", as the new engine will not be able to be mapped easily, and even if it can, most likely not past the 230bhp ish of the "30d", and it wil be considerably more economical. The "25d" is hardly any more economical than the "30d" anyway (probably none more so in the real world where you will rev it harder that the "30d" to get the same result, and use more fuel). The mapping issue clearly matters to BMW, or why would they go to so much trouble to make it so hard to remap their new engines? I think the "30d" will become the 'lower end' 6cyl diesel, as the 320d is already not too far off the 325d in real terms. The 323d would be a bit cheaper and would open up a whole new set of buyers I reckon.

The only people really potentially losing out on the 325d are BMW at the moment, and that won't happen for long IMHO.

BMW have made the new d`s so much more difficult to crack for one reason only. They`re bringing out their own performance tuning products.
......and lets be honest, who cares if its a 323d or 325d, it`ll be shit even when tuned as its a diesel. The only diesel worth having is the 335d and only then if your old and lazy.



Quote:
Originally Posted by scotw

Is it as simple as that? At cruising speeds I think there is not much in it, so for most people its not that big of a deal. However, with the EU breathing down their neck and making noises about average CO2, BMW need more low CO2 engines in their range.

I think we could see 318D,320D,323D as 4 cly engines, with the 330D & 335D toping the range as 6.

Of the other advanges as someone said is that the 325D can no longer be used as a cheap 330D with a remap, a 323D will be more resistant to remaping than the 325D







If the 323d is geared the same as a the 123d, there`ll be a big difference. 123d is out of puff in 4th at 100mph, whereas the 325d will go to 120mph in 4th, even before its mapped.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulrikgm

Whatever you say - but Hartge and ESS are doing it so I willtrust them instead. It is very close to being the same engine as found in the 330d even the gearbox is the same. I think BMW are saying that the 330d has variable turbo geometry and the 325d does not but I am starting to doubt that.

http://www.esstuning.com/default.asp...&subcat2=265&i d=

http://www.hartge.de/e/bmw_motor_4344.html

Ulrik.





Your link to ESS shows exactly what I said, theirs is running at 238 PS.
Trust who you want lad, I spent 11 hrs in a tuning shop with my 325d, trying all sorts of different settings, it wont go anymore than 240 without over stressing things. This is the same reason why the 118d can`t be tuned to produce the same power as a mapped 120d. The turbos are much smaller, so only so much extra air can be added. Sure you can over fuel it to fuck and with a particle filter you wont get any smoke, but what happens when your PF dies at 20K miles ?

I would urge anyone thinking about aggresively tuning a 325d, to trade the car in for a 330/335d as it`ll not only be cheaper overall but yuo`ll see much greater results. This was part of the reason I binned mine off, A 320d in a high state of tune, was just as quick all the way to 140.

Last edited by mikem; 11-16-2007 at 10:56 AM..
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