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      12-15-2005, 01:30 PM   #45
cosmosblau
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Originally Posted by SiR
Thats a terrible plan. In the end, the higher insurance segment will be higher permium, and 21 year olds will not as experience be as current 21 year olds. The day that happens is when American drinking limit is lower to 18 and drafting to the military is lower to 16. (thats for the high school drop outs since we hate the young and future of our country)

Whaat?
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      12-15-2005, 01:33 PM   #46
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well, before 17 year olds get all mad and all, my post topic said 17 year old drivers....THAT SUCK AT DRIVING, if you are 17 and you do NOT suck at driving then i do not hate you, so calm yourself and stop getting so defensive, it is specifically targeted at those that suck at driving but the truth of the matter is, IS that most 17 year olds are inexperienced and are more cocky about recently getting their license, so more often than not i am wary of teenage drivers.

btw, i appreciate all your support and all, i need to get an estimate and the insurance guy said pending a police report, it appears that i will be getting 100% reimbursed for the accident, i guess the bright side of things are 1) no one got hurt, and 2) i get a free car wash at least and a new clear coat applied
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      12-15-2005, 02:08 PM   #47
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What is BFE?

Beyond F---ing Egypt
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      12-15-2005, 02:54 PM   #48
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I fail to see what relevance the finance source of a car is to this discussion
I was given a nice car at 17, and 2 years on, I'm accident-free, so the generalisation you were attempting to make is falsified, cosmosblau

You would be singing a different tune if you were younger. I can hardly see the manager of an insurance firm saying "the driving age should be 21" when he's raking in millions of dollars on premiums for under 21 policies.
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      12-15-2005, 09:26 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by RR
I fail to see what relevance the finance source of a car is to this discussion
I was given a nice car at 17, and 2 years on, I'm accident-free, so the generalisation you were attempting to make is falsified, cosmosblau

You would be singing a different tune if you were younger. I can hardly see the manager of an insurance firm saying "the driving age should be 21" when he's raking in millions of dollars on premiums for under 21 policies.

I believe that the financial provider of the car is relavant in this discussion because there is no way that a child who is given a car by daddy would be as responsible as someone who has earned the money for it themselves. When you know daddy will swoop in and fix all your dents, hire your lawyer, and buy you another $40,000 toy if needed, how can your actions have the same weight as someone who is fiscally responsible?

Nothing has any value unless you earn it yourself.
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      12-15-2005, 09:28 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmosblau
Nothing has any value unless you earn it yourself.
Totally agree!!
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      12-15-2005, 09:42 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmosblau
I believe that the financial provider of the car is relavant in this discussion because there is no way that a child who is given a car by daddy would be as responsible as someone who has earned the money for it themselves. When you know daddy will swoop in and fix all your dents, hire your lawyer, and buy you another $40,000 toy if needed, how can your actions have the same weight as someone who is fiscally responsible?

Nothing has any value unless you earn it yourself.
Well said!
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      12-15-2005, 11:02 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmosblau
I believe that the financial provider of the car is relavant in this discussion because there is no way that a child who is given a car by daddy would be as responsible as someone who has earned the money for it themselves. When you know daddy will swoop in and fix all your dents, hire your lawyer, and buy you another $40,000 toy if needed, how can your actions have the same weight as someone who is fiscally responsible?

Nothing has any value unless you earn it yourself.
Actually, the fact that my car was a gift makes it all the more valuable to me. Wasting my parents' hard earned money is worse than wasting my own.
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      12-16-2005, 03:54 AM   #53
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Same remark as shimshimhada
Couldn't really give a damn what I do with my own money, because I know I got more of it coming in at the next pay check

But wasting the hard earned money that some other pour soul, especially my parents, have struggled to save up and buy me a '40K toy' is something I would feel very guilty about
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      12-16-2005, 04:15 AM   #54
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Beyond F---ing Egypt
ROFL
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      12-17-2005, 02:49 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RR
Same remark as shimshimhada
Couldn't really give a damn what I do with my own money, because I know I got more of it coming in at the next pay check

But wasting the hard earned money that some other pour soul, especially my parents, have struggled to save up and buy me a '40K toy' is something I would feel very guilty about
That's a rare attitude here in the US. Kudos to you!
I suspect the parents aren't 'struggling' to buy the toy, and the kids appreciate it even less.
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      12-17-2005, 03:02 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shimshimhada
Actually, the fact that my car was a gift makes it all the more valuable to me. Wasting my parents' hard earned money is worse than wasting my own.
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      12-17-2005, 03:08 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shimshimhada
Actually, the fact that my car was a gift makes it all the more valuable to me. Wasting my parents' hard earned money is worse than wasting my own.

agreed.
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      12-17-2005, 03:11 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmosblau
I believe that the financial provider of the car is relavant in this discussion because there is no way that a child who is given a car by daddy would be as responsible as someone who has earned the money for it themselves. When you know daddy will swoop in and fix all your dents, hire your lawyer, and buy you another $40,000 toy if needed, how can your actions have the same weight as someone who is fiscally responsible?

Nothing has any value unless you earn it yourself.

not totally true. my friend henry got a toyota highlander with everyyy upgrade imaginable and it came out to 40k-ish and he has neverrr been in an accident. not only that-- but he alsotakes care of his car more than anyone i know.

most kids who buy their car at 17 cant afford nice cars anyway so they buy ugly cars and ram it into random objects and not car ebecause its ugly in the first place..


so if i were you, id rather be driving near a kid who had their parents buy them a car over a kid who bought himself a car he could care less about
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      12-17-2005, 03:26 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enroutte
not totally true. my friend henry got a toyota highlander with everyyy upgrade imaginable and it came out to 40k-ish and he has neverrr been in an accident. not only that-- but he alsotakes care of his car more than anyone i know.

most kids who buy their car at 17 cant afford nice cars anyway so they buy ugly cars and ram it into random objects and not car ebecause its ugly in the first place..


so if i were you, id rather be driving near a kid who had their parents buy them a car over a kid who bought himself a car he could care less about
"but he alsotakes care of his car more than anyone i know."
Vanity polishing, no? I'm sure he polishes a BRAND NEW CAR. That doesn't make him a responsible driver.

"most kids who buy their car at 17 cant afford nice cars anyway so they buy ugly cars and ram it into random objects "
This proves the title of the thread exactly.


edit:Sorry to rant Enroutte. Nothing personal. I just have a daughter that is growing up fast and my fatherly instincts are going crazy...
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      12-17-2005, 03:47 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Compos Mentis
"but he alsotakes care of his car more than anyone i know."
Vanity polishing, no? I'm sure he polishes a BRAND NEW CAR. That doesn't make him a responsible driver.
He's had his car for almost two years now and he's never hit anything at all not even little bumps in parking lots. Even after two years, he's still careful when he goes out, where he parks etc. He's just an overall careful driver. I think it really also depends on teh person though. Some people are just more careful than others. I;m sure there are 30 year olds who are shitty drivers. waittt what am i talking about? i live in san jose. there are shitty drivers everywhere.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Compos Mentis
[i]"
edit:Sorry to rant Enroutte. Nothing personal. I just have a daughter that is growing up fast and my fatherly instincts are going crazy...
My parents were freaked out when I got into high school.. and then on the day i got my license, i went home with my dad after i passed. and then i took his car to school and he watched me the WHOLE time i backed out of the garage.. otu of the driveway.. and onto the street. I was like, dad, you can go inside im only driving to school which is liek 5 minutees away. parents are funny
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      12-17-2005, 05:36 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enroutte
I was like, dad, you can go inside im only driving to school which is liek 5 minutees away. parents are funny
Most accidents occur relatively close to one's home. Never underestimate the irresponsibility of OTHER drivers.
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      12-17-2005, 09:37 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enroutte
My parents were freaked out when I got into high school.. and then on the day i got my license, i went home with my dad after i passed. and then i took his car to school and he watched me the WHOLE time i backed out of the garage.. otu of the driveway.. and onto the street. I was like, dad, you can go inside im only driving to school which is liek 5 minutees away. parents are funny
They only do things like that because they care and worry about you. You should be happy about this, there are way too many kids out there that don't have parents that care about them. Some day you will understand why your parents do things like that.
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      12-17-2005, 11:44 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enroutte
not totally true. my friend henry got a toyota highlander with everyyy upgrade imaginable and it came out to 40k-ish and he has neverrr been in an accident. not only that-- but he alsotakes care of his car more than anyone i know.

I still disagree. You see, my point of view is based on experience. I was a rich kid who's daddy bought him a nice car (not a BMW, but a new Jeep.) And I thought it had great value to me. I thought I was grateful. After I smacked it up a few times, and daddy paid of course, I moved on to sneaking out in his Porsches, despite his forbidding me to do so.

Since college, I have not received a dime from my family, and everything I own I have earned myself. I had no idea! There is a HUGE difference in how I value my possessions now.

You must try it some time!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Enroutte
most kids who buy their car at 17 cant afford nice cars anyway so they buy ugly cars and ram it into random objects and not car ebecause its ugly in the first place..

so if i were you, id rather be driving near a kid who had their parents buy them a car over a kid who bought himself a car he could care less about
This statement is obviously based on conjecture, and is largely false. I grew up in a very wealthy town and know that rich kids have very little respect for material value and generally view themselves as 'Better Than" poor people.

Poor people may not be well educated or even very bright, but they generally know the value of money. They know that the heap they bought to get them from A to B is a BIG DEAL, and that they feel fortunate to even have any car at all. Of couse, there are exceptions, but I believe these points to be generally true.

I know this forum is largely populated by spoiled little rich kids, and they feel the need to justify their bourgeois guilt- I understand. They certainly do not want to hear about how their brains aren't even fully developed enough to be good drivers. When I was a teen, I thought that I was the greatest driver this side of Juan Fangio. I thought I knew everything, and my point of view was the only possible correct view- what more could adults know? Since then, I have learned with time comes experience, that life is precious, and everyone experiences life differently.
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      12-17-2005, 12:18 PM   #64
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Cosmoblau - great words of wisdom!

I don't have anything personal against young people who are privileged, but I then the odds are stacked against them being able to develop into responsible adults with grounded values.

Just like growing up poor and underprivileged is no excuse for criminal behavior (and you can all leave right now if you think it is), growing up rich is no excuse for being an asshole. At some point you must take responsibility for your life and they way you interact with others.
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      12-17-2005, 12:21 PM   #65
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I agree to an extent with all of you guys, but i really thikn the bad/good driver also plays a role in where you live. Everyone at my school has nice cars and hardly anyone ever gets into an accident. And you gusy are right, some kids arent thankful for anything because their parents buy them everything but there are definitely still kids with shitty cars who drive horrible. there's this guy at my school who drives like an 88 civic and the thing SMOKESSSS when you start up the engine and back out. he doesnt brake when he drives over speedbumps and just drives recklessly in general.

from what I HAVE seen i still believe kids with uglier cars are less careful in
general. my best friend has like a 98 mustang and shes NOT careful with it at all. she figures its so old anyway that its not going to matter.

maybe the kids i hang out with who have old cars all had a uncaring mentality to begin with - even before they got the cars.
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      12-17-2005, 05:23 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enroutte
I agree to an extent with all of you guys, but i really thikn the bad/good driver also plays a role in where you live. Everyone at my school has nice cars and hardly anyone ever gets into an accident. And you gusy are right, some kids arent thankful for anything because their parents buy them everything but there are definitely still kids with shitty cars who drive horrible. there's this guy at my school who drives like an 88 civic and the thing SMOKESSSS when you start up the engine and back out. he doesnt brake when he drives over speedbumps and just drives recklessly in general.

from what I HAVE seen i still believe kids with uglier cars are less careful in
general. my best friend has like a 98 mustang and shes NOT careful with it at all. she figures its so old anyway that its not going to matter.

maybe the kids i hang out with who have old cars all had a uncaring mentality to begin with - even before they got the cars.
My first car was a VERY old car. I paid for it, insured it, and was responsible for its maintenance. I took care of it. Your point, while I understand what you're saying is really just re-enforcing our points. I'm sure the girl with the Mustang isn't going to have to fix it if it breaks. In fact, she probably thinks 'the sooner I break this car, the sooner Daddy can get me a better one'.
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