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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > BMW N54 AccessPORT Beta Race Fuel and E-30 Maps



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      08-31-2012, 03:07 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster335 View Post
I have e85 and 91oct gas (can get 100oct, but prefer not to) can i run the new race map?
you need to achieve 98 octane AKI

so you probably need to increase scalar value to run higher % of E85 in order to not max out fuel trims
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Last edited by enrita; 08-31-2012 at 08:20 AM.
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      08-31-2012, 03:12 AM   #46
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Don't you need a special sensor to run e85?
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      08-31-2012, 03:27 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil///M View Post
Don't you need a special sensor to run e85?
no...
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      08-31-2012, 03:51 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by farb View Post
niceeee.

For the guys in GTA, get your e85 @ 7060 Wellington Rd 124, Guelph, ON N1H 6J3 (UPI Guelph Gas Bar)

Can't wait to try this

Last I checked they only sell to FF approved vehicles.
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      08-31-2012, 05:04 AM   #49
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Which would be the better map to run E-30 or race if you have an E85 blend and running meth?
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      08-31-2012, 05:52 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deltalima0 View Post
Which would be the better map to run E-30 or race if you have an E85 blend and running meth?
E30 and log, there may be some room for more timing in your case
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      08-31-2012, 07:02 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by farb View Post
niceeee.

For the guys in GTA, get your e85 @ 7060 Wellington Rd 124, Guelph, ON N1H 6J3 (UPI Guelph Gas Bar)

Can't wait to try this
I was told they no longer offer E85. I'll let you confirm either way .
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      08-31-2012, 08:00 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enrita View Post
you need to achieve 98 octane:
http://www.intercepteft.com/calc.html
so you probably need to increase scalar value to run higher % of E85 in order to not max out fuel trims
Enrita,

I think you need to stop quoting this online calculator! There is ONE MAJOR error in it: it assumes that the octane rating of E85 is 105. This is the RON rating and it can be very misleading since the gasolene in the USA is rated using AKI (Anti Knock Index).

So, just to be clear here: E85 has AKI index of 94-96. Premuim gasolene has AKI rating of 91-93 depending on the state you get it. That number is written on the pump!

DO NOT confuse RON ratings with AKI ratings when you are blending fuels!


EDIT:
To get 14 gallons of E30, one needs to blend 4 gallons of E85 and 10 gallons of AKI 93 fuel. This will end up achieving 14 gallons of E31 and the AKI rating would be 93.3 which is just 0.3 bump in AKI from what you normally get out of the pump
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      08-31-2012, 08:20 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasillalov View Post
Enrita,

I think you need to stop quoting this online calculator! There is ONE MAJOR error in it: it assumes that the octane rating of E85 is 105. This is the RON rating and it can be very misleading since the gasolene in the USA is rated using AKI (Anti Knock Index).

So, just to be clear here: E85 has AKI index of 94-96. Premuim gasolene has AKI rating of 91-93 depending on the state you get it. That number is written on the pump!

DO NOT confuse RON ratings with AKI ratings when you are blending fuels!


EDIT:
To get 14 gallons of E30, one needs to blend 4 gallons of E85 and 10 gallons of AKI 93 fuel. This will end up achieving 14 gallons of E31 and the AKI rating would be 93.3 which is just 0.3 bump in AKI from what you normally get out of the pump
good catch, edited my post. why the hell are they stating a RON rating on a US AKI calculator?
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      08-31-2012, 08:21 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dfv2 View Post
Looking at the mapping, there's NO way in hell...
Again this is just based off my butt dyno. I'll take it to the dragstrip when it cools down a bit and do a comparison between the old v301 Stage 2+ which netted me a 12.3@117mph in the 1/4 mile and this new v402 E30 map. Don't get me wrong, the car is definitely faster especially up top.
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      08-31-2012, 08:28 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enrita View Post
good catch, edited my post. why the hell are they stating a RON rating on a US AKI calculator?
No idea honestly, but people must be careful.
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      08-31-2012, 09:30 AM   #56
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So the mixture for E85 (depending on gas) would be about 4 gallons e85 and the rest 93.

Anybody know what the calculation for MS109 race gas would be?

How does the race map compare to E85 map in terms of power?
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      08-31-2012, 09:47 AM   #57
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Quote:
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Why would he be? Im looking for stage 1+ support too as i still have a warranty and dont want to go FBO
X2!
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      08-31-2012, 10:12 AM   #58
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Quote:
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Why would he be? Im looking for stage 1+ support too as i still have a warranty and dont want to go FBO
Easy, just get pro tuned

PTF (pro tuning freaks) are on this forum. Jake and Dzenno do an amazing job customizing the tune to your mods and octane and on my car with just an intake and dps even with pump gas they pulled off considerably more power and response out of the car. I was really impressed.
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      08-31-2012, 10:20 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasillalov View Post
Enrita,

I think you need to stop quoting this online calculator! There is ONE MAJOR error in it: it assumes that the octane rating of E85 is 105. This is the RON rating and it can be very misleading since the gasolene in the USA is rated using AKI (Anti Knock Index).

So, just to be clear here: E85 has AKI index of 94-96. Premuim gasolene has AKI rating of 91-93 depending on the state you get it. That number is written on the pump!

DO NOT confuse RON ratings with AKI ratings when you are blending fuels!


EDIT:
To get 14 gallons of E30, one needs to blend 4 gallons of E85 and 10 gallons of AKI 93 fuel. This will end up achieving 14 gallons of E31 and the AKI rating would be 93.3 which is just 0.3 bump in AKI from what you normally get out of the pump
I suspect you cannot compare or calculate octane rating of E85 the same as gasoline. The resistance to detonation is comparable to race fuel like c116.
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      08-31-2012, 10:20 AM   #60
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Just in time for me to go on vacation for a week

Guess I have something to look forward to.
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      08-31-2012, 10:22 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joshboody View Post
I suspect you cannot compare or calculate octane rating of E85 the same as gasoline. The resistance to detonation is comparable to race fuel like c116.
+1
Not to mention when used in DI e85 has MUCH greater benefits
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      08-31-2012, 11:08 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joshboody View Post
I suspect you cannot compare or calculate octane rating of E85 the same as gasoline. The resistance to detonation is comparable to race fuel like c116.
+1

C16 may be a bit of an exaggeration, but E85 works very well in a mixture. Much better than what's implied above in this thread. Try it with an aggressive map and log, your butt dyno and your logs will both be happy. And that's all that matters...
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      08-31-2012, 11:12 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. G View Post
Last I checked they only sell to FF approved vehicles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nitehawk View Post
I was told they no longer offer E85. I'll let you confirm either way .

F#$%!I just called them. They don't carry it anymore
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      08-31-2012, 11:41 AM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joshboody View Post
I suspect you cannot compare or calculate octane rating of E85 the same as gasoline. The resistance to detonation is comparable to race fuel like c116.
Well not exactly. Resistance to detonation = AKI -> Anti-knock index. So that's your unit of measurement.

Yes, E85 has additional benefits when it comes to cooling the combustion chamber, but technically, that's different than anti-knock index.

Plain and simple:

USA 91 fuel = 91 AKI
USA 93 fuel = 93 AKI
USA E85 = 94-96 AKI
PURE ETHANOL = 99.15 AKI

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating

Do not confuse E85 and pure ethanol. Totally different things.


EDIT:

Take a look here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85

Second paragraph in Octane and Performance Section:
Quote:
The Renewable Fuels Foundation states in its Changes in Gasoline IV manual, "There is no requirement to post octane on an E85 dispenser. If a retailer chooses to post octane, they should be aware that the often cited 105 octane is incorrect. This number was derived by using ethanol’s blending octane value in gasoline. This is not the proper way to calculate the octane of E85. Ethanol’s true octane value should be used to calculate E85’s octane value. This results in an octane range of 94-96 (R+M)/2. These calculations have been confirmed by actual-octane engine tests." [18]
Examples of this mis-citation can be found at the Iowa Renewable Fuels Association titled "E85 Facts"[19] which cites a range of 100-105, and a document at the Texas State Energy Conservation Office titled "Ethanol"[20], which cites a 113 rating.
So guys, stop propagating a lie! E85 does NOT have such a high octane rating as you think it does.
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      08-31-2012, 12:03 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasillalov View Post
Well not exactly. Resistance to detonation = AKI -> Anti-knock index. So that's your unit of measurement.

Yes, E85 has additional benefits when it comes to cooling the combustion chamber, but technically, that's different than anti-knock index.

Plain and simple:

USA 91 fuel = 91 AKI
USA 93 fuel = 93 AKI
USA E85 = 94-96 AKI
PURE ETHANOL = 99.15 AKI

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating

Do not confuse E85 and pure ethanol. Totally different things.


EDIT:

Take a look here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85

Second paragraph in Octane and Performance Section:


So guys, stop propagating a lie! E85 does NOT have such a high octane rating as you think it does.
Accusing folks of "propagating a lie" does not encourage informed discussion of any topic, but.... the subject of ethanol's "effective octane" (which is far higher than you suggest), at least in a direct injection motor, is far more complicated.

Take a look at these articles:

http://web.mit.edu/mitei/lfee/progra...2008-01-rp.pdf

http://web.mit.edu/mitei/lfee/progra...2008-01-rp.pdf

dspace.mit.edu/bitstream/handle/1721.1/69496/775670245.pdf

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      08-31-2012, 12:31 PM   #66
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These maps feel amazing so happy! Thanks cobb!
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