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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N57 / M57 Turbo Diesel Discussions - 335d > Intake Snorkel/Tube what is it for??



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      08-30-2012, 06:01 AM   #23
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Good assumption and info but when I had the AMSOIL Cone filter on the car DID respond a lot smoother and had more revving than before, I had to remove the filter cause it was to large for the area and was damaging the paint job. Sorry amigos will not use a K&N cuase of the oil issue plus I had a previous problem with my 02 MCS where the oil ran thru the tubes and MESSED up my MASS Flow Sensor, luckily the MINI mechanic was a fellow Puerto Rican and let me slide, he put down in the system that my MASS flow sensor was defective!!!
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      08-30-2012, 09:49 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EPOS View Post
Sorry, but that's just flat out wrong.

1. diesel engines have higher thermal efficiency compared to gas engines
2. has nothing to do with cooling

It is a dual stage intake, essentially there are 2 chambers to control the air velocity. I know it's hard to believe, but it is to improve torque at low RPM and help with higher RPM power as well, that's when that valve opens up and air is now being sucked in through that snorkel and into the secondary chamber, combining the 2 to make one big intake box.

Motorcycles incorporate intakes like this all the time and same goes for most race cars. The IS-F uses a dual stage intake box and I believe the NSX did as well.
If it were only about motor thermal efficiency, the dual stage intake snorkel would be directed to pull air from the same location that the main air filter feed air comes from. Compressing hot air is not how thermal efficiency is achieved as for every BTU you add from compressing the hot air, you need to remove it to a degree to achieve your combustion goals. Lowering charge temperatures are important.
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      08-30-2012, 10:25 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vreimann View Post
If it were only about motor thermal efficiency, the dual stage intake snorkel would be directed to pull air from the same location that the main air filter feed air comes from. Compressing hot air is not how thermal efficiency is achieved as for every BTU you add from compressing the hot air, you need to remove it to a degree to achieve your combustion goals. Lowering charge temperatures are important.
I'm not stating that the snorkel is for efficiency, as someone else was saying it was for cooling by sucking in the hot air to "cool" off the engine bay.
My point is diesel engines are by far more thermal efficient so sucking out hot air is not needed.

PR - I too have used a cone filter and have noticed noticeable lag once heat soaking has occurred (waiting for light to turn green).
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      09-01-2012, 04:30 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EPOS View Post
I'm not stating that the snorkel is for efficiency, as someone else was saying it was for cooling by sucking in the hot air to "cool" off the engine bay.
My point is diesel engines are by far more thermal efficient so sucking out hot air is not needed.

PR - I too have used a cone filter and have noticed noticeable lag once heat soaking has occurred (waiting for light to turn green).
The other person making the comment about removing the heat is a co-worker who used to develop components for BMW, Mercedes, VW. One of the things he designed in our car is the radiator fan which I thought was pretty cool. I just asked him his input on this topic as I saw an assortment of answers, and he threw his in too. The only person who truly knows why it is there would be the person who designed the air box snorkel assembly. We are all just guessing, but somewhere in our guesses, there must be one close to correct answer.
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      09-01-2012, 05:37 PM   #27
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It's a dual stage intake by design. Tuned for lowend torque and high end power. Once again the IS-F uses a similar design. The only reason I can see why a hose is attached is to prevent water from entering the box. Without the hose it is exposed.
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      09-04-2012, 06:42 AM   #28
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hey guys we are getting TOO technical here, lets pressume something triggered Limp mode as we might assume the hose was the fault, yet I am still dumb that it did so , my question is why then did it not trigger limp mode when I added my AMSOIL filter? Please make the answers simple for all of us. I understand Cx Racing owner from the german boost site said he's planning in making a CAI for our cars he has an X5d, we'll see what happens then
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      09-04-2012, 08:51 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puerto Rican 335d View Post
hey guys we are getting TOO technical here, lets pressume something triggered Limp mode as we might assume the hose was the fault, yet I am still dumb that it did so , my question is why then did it not trigger limp mode when I added my AMSOIL filter? Please make the answers simple for all of us. I understand Cx Racing owner from the german boost site said he's planning in making a CAI for our cars he has an X5d, we'll see what happens then
The only thing that comes to mind is that when you run the cone filter, you would be getting a consistent temperature/ pressure into engine without any serious fluctuations over the sensors. Running the box with a cold and warm intake and no vacuum control could result in variations across the sensors to produce a signal out of the limits set by BMW and trip to limp mode.
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      09-05-2012, 06:28 AM   #30
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@ VReiman I tend to differ on this I drove the car for 2 weeks and NEVER did the car go either on limp or safe mode, sorry to bust your bubble on this one, but it is good assumption that it can, I live in Puerto Rico so I can attest to weather changes either hot/humid/cool temp used with AMSOIL Cone Filter. The problem I had, like you state is the engine compartment on the DIESELS are closed and the only ventilation would be from the radiator fan(not good) the problem with AMSOIL is that the only filter to fit is the EaAU4070 if not mistaken and that one is to long 7" we need a cone no longer than 5 1/2 to 6" long, otherwise it will scratch your paint
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      09-05-2012, 09:58 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puerto Rican 335d View Post
@ VReiman I tend to differ on this I drove the car for 2 weeks and NEVER did the car go either on limp or safe mode, sorry to bust your bubble on this one, but it is good assumption that it can, I live in Puerto Rico so I can attest to weather changes either hot/humid/cool temp used with AMSOIL Cone Filter. The problem I had, like you state is the engine compartment on the DIESELS are closed and the only ventilation would be from the radiator fan(not good) the problem with AMSOIL is that the only filter to fit is the EaAU4070 if not mistaken and that one is to long 7" we need a cone no longer than 5 1/2 to 6" long, otherwise it will scratch your paint
I am saying that the Amsoil filter shouldn't be throwing codes, but taking out the snorkel has the possibility to throw a code. In every vehicle I've owned except the diesel, I have always heavily modified the motors and none of them threw codes, but they did have some quirks because of the open element cone intakes. I found that if the weather is windy and you are off throttle and a gust hits the front of the car it can cause slight fluctuations in the revs, but in every case during WOT or even at moderate throttle, the open element never caused any issues.

Just curious, but when you ran the cone filter, did you leave the plumbing in place that directs the cool air from the front of the car into the filter area or did you remove it?
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      09-07-2012, 02:06 AM   #32
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I left my pluming in place when I tried it on my D. Made great noise, but threw codes every now and then. Put stock box back on for now. Hopefully someone will figure out the correct way we can run piping from the brake ducts for a true cai system. By the looks of it there seems like there is just enough room for something to be fabricated in that area. :-)
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      09-07-2012, 06:22 AM   #33
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Amigo Vreiman I removed the whole thing, I placed the cone air filter in place of the box
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      09-14-2012, 06:30 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Julesandtrish View Post
I left my pluming in place when I tried it on my D. Made great noise, but threw codes every now and then. Put stock box back on for now. Hopefully someone will figure out the correct way we can run piping from the brake ducts for a true cai system. By the looks of it there seems like there is just enough room for something to be fabricated in that area. :-)
I spent some time looking around that area, and there is even extra air capacity available to make it through the brake ducting hole and up through the fender liner. The connecting and routing would be non standard but if someone took the time to model up something to be injection moulded, it could be done. I would want to be able to remove it in the winter cause the snow/ ice would probably rip it out.

With your warm weather you would be fine.
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