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      10-01-2012, 04:02 PM   #23
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The JL will sound much better, just needs running in a bit. Got a bass test disc? You can download them but cant remember where from,basically you put the sub on "soak".
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      10-01-2012, 04:09 PM   #24
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Sam2,

Loving the credits

Re: the Sub, sounds quite crackly, but guess that's most probably my monitor speakers so this comment can be dicarded.

I do feel that JL products are overpriced and overrated - sometimes. A lot of people say FI subs or RE subs are better pound for pound but because JL have marketed their products better they seem to really have the word spread. Its like you say, the major player, i.e Apple.

I am sure there is a better sub that ticks the box for better SQ or SPL etc like for like, compared tot he JL W7 but is just not as well known to the mainstream audience.

I'm guilty of mainstream as I also plan on a JL however I think if you can time align, phase correctly and tune the entire system to run smoothly, almost any sub will deliver similar notes whether it be from JL or FI or Orion.

Nonetheless, looking good! A great video and some good asian moojik
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      10-01-2012, 04:27 PM   #25
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Just a thought have you tried moving the box around in the boot to see difference?
back in my audio days (I am sounding old lol) have you tried putting cotton wadding/foam inside the box to help lessen the boomy'ness of the sub?

great vid btw, as above you will need to run the sub in before you make a final review
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      10-01-2012, 04:42 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AWBimmer View Post
Sam2,

Loving the credits

Re: the Sub, sounds quite crackly, but guess that's most probably my monitor speakers so this comment can be dicarded.
You are correct there. If you wacth the video again, you will see some screws on the left hand side tray which are dancing there and hence cracking sound.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AWBimmer View Post
I do feel that JL products are overpriced and overrated - sometimes. A lot of people say FI subs or RE subs are better pound for pound but because JL have marketed their products better they seem to really have the word spread. Its like you say, the major player, i.e Apple.
Funny enough, I have been offered FI, RE and Hifonic subs today. I am already looking to replace it as I have heard better SQ subs than this.
He is one of my frined and he insisted that FI subs are far better than JL subs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mistryn View Post
Just a thought have you tried moving the box around in the boot to see difference?
back in my audio days (I am sounding old lol) have you tried putting cotton wadding/foam inside the box to help lessen the boomy'ness of the sub?

great vid btw, as above you will need to run the sub in before you make a final review
I have moved the sub in different directions. Best sound for driver is, when you head the sub toward the front.

I will try to stick cotton sheet to rear wall of the box and hope that helps.
Thanks for the idea
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      10-01-2012, 04:47 PM   #27
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You're already looking into changing the sub? Hifonics are damn cool man I love them, courtesy of Sumil Lol. Some guy I know is offering me a 12" FI SSD or something sub for around 180 barely used! That's a lot cheaper than a 12w7 so it'll be interesting to see which route I eventually take but very keen to hear an FI / RE compared to JL w7.

If you could fire thr sub through the skit hatch / rear arm rest, into the cabin, the SQ you get will be outstanding! The other thing you could do is dynamat the boot lid.
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      10-01-2012, 05:02 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AWBimmer View Post
You're already looking into changing the sub? Hifonics are damn cool man I love them, courtesy of Sumil Lol. Some guy I know is offering me a 12" FI SSD or something sub for around 180 barely used! That's a lot cheaper than a 12w7 so it'll be interesting to see which route I eventually take but very keen to hear an FI / RE compared to JL w7.

If you could fire thr sub through the skit hatch / rear arm rest, into the cabin, the SQ you get will be outstanding! The other thing you could do is dynamat the boot lid.

Sam,
180 is good price for FI sub. If I am not wrong, you already have secured JL 12W7.

12" sub which I looked was 1000W RMS @ 2 ohms and if I go for that, I will be underpowering it with this amp at 850W RMS @ 2 ohms. But worth of looking into it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AWBimmer View Post
If you could fire thr sub through the skit hatch / rear arm rest, into the cabin, the SQ you get will be outstanding! The other thing you could do is dynamat the boot lid.
Going to add dynamat at later stage, once I am settled with this. I may just get rid of it. In all honesty, this is surplus to my music system. These two are most expensive components in my sound system (or at least, one is equivalent to 2 SWS-8s) and yet they are creating lots of noise.
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      10-01-2012, 05:08 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
Finally installed it.
First impression, very loud.
Reviewed it again, plenty of rattling from the car. Rear boot lid rattles like hell and number plate holder keep vibrating.

Quick Review:
I have SWS-8s and after that very little difference that this sub makes in terms of sound quality (SQ).

The difference is that
1- My headrest vibrates.
2- I can feel low frequencies in my ribs.
3- Rear view mirror shakes
4- Rear seats are massager seats now.

Other than these non-significant difference, I don't feel that it justifies its price tag. It is more sort of loud sound but hardly matches the bass of SWS-8.
Hang on! What did I just say?
Yes, you read it correctly, however don't get me wrong, as there is no comparison of JL W7 and SWS-8s but the bass from JL W7 is coming from a distance and I can feel SWS-8s closer to me.
I have also tweaked the phase and results are better if sound waves are coming at 180 degress and they are more in phase with SWS-8s and mids.

I feel the presense of JL W7, if I am sitting in the rear cabin or by punchy feeling behind my ribs.

Well, JL W7 is lost in the trunk. If there was a way of opening the sub into cabin, that would justify its presence.
The problem with most BMW boots is that they are sealed. Putting a box in the boot is not a great idea, its like putting a box in a bigger box. Sound waves will just reflect and bounce back off the sides and cancel each other out (maybe explains your lack of perceived output). This will also cause a lot of rattle.

To minimise rattle and get an improved output the best 2 options are:

1) For a sub that requires a larger enclosure volume than what's available in the corner, an IB installl through the ski hatch will work well.
2) For a sub that requires an enclosure volume that is available in the corner, and if you can be bothered to make one/buy one, then a corner enclosure would work well. Apparently this method doubles the perceived output of the sub. Not sure why but that's what Kaigoss says.

Having said that I hope your issue is a configuration one and you manage to sort it out. If not try another sub!

Edit: No matter how much you Dynamat the boot, the rattle will still be there unfortunately with your set up
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      10-01-2012, 05:39 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
The problem with most BMW boots is that they are sealed. Putting a box in the boot is not a great idea, its like putting a box in a bigger box. Sound waves will just reflect and bounce back off the sides and cancel each other out (maybe explains your lack of perceived output). This will also cause a lot of rattle.
Very well said. That is whats happening here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
To minimise rattle and get an improved output the best 2 options are:

1) For a sub that requires a larger enclosure volume than what's available in the corner, an IB installl through the ski hatch will work well.
Not applicable in saloons, I guess. And I don't want to go down the Dubai's route of fitting it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
2) For a sub that requires an enclosure volume that is available in the corner, and if you can be bothered to make one/buy one, then a corner enclosure would work well. Apparently this method doubles the perceived output of the sub. Not sure why but that's what Kaigoss says.
Not possible to have corner enclosure for this sub. Depth alone is 8.5-9.5 inches and that means I have to build corner enclosre which is protruding out from the rest of the corner. (2 inch gap behind the magnet)

Also the amount of air it dissipates, I can see that theoretically corner enclosure would be a total failure. Unless if I want to see my fuel filler door mechanism failing soon.

I guess corner enclosure is better for those having W6 or W3.

And other people on states side are using underseat as mid bass drivers and hence their perception of trunk sub is clearer to mine. I have SWS-8s which can play as low as 40-50Hz. So bass from those are much clearer and closer compared to the trunk sub.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post

Having said that I hope your issue is a configuration one and you manage to sort it out.
You may be correct there. I have not played with equiliser settings on the amp, and TBH do not want to play with that.



Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
If not try another sub!
I may be able to get better SQ with different sub, but sound waves will be bouncing back more in the trunk, leaving distorted sound.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
Edit: No matter how much you Dynamat the boot, the rattle will still be there unfortunately with your set up
Cannot comment on this unless I try that. Least it can reduce the vibration of rear number plate.
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      10-01-2012, 05:42 PM   #31
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Although many will start objecting on JL RTA monitor and how rubbish iphone's mic is, yet it is a quick way of checking RTA of your sound system.

A quick glance:

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      10-01-2012, 06:04 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mob17 View Post
The problem with most BMW boots is that they are sealed. Putting a box in the boot is not a great idea, its like putting a box in a bigger box. Sound waves will just reflect and bounce back off the sides and cancel each other out (maybe explains your lack of perceived output). This will also cause a lot of rattle.

To minimise rattle and get an improved output the best 2 options are:

1) For a sub that requires a larger enclosure volume than what's available in the corner, an IB installl through the ski hatch will work well.
2) For a sub that requires an enclosure volume that is available in the corner, and if you can be bothered to make one/buy one, then a corner enclosure would work well. Apparently this method doubles the perceived output of the sub. Not sure why but that's what Kaigoss says.

Having said that I hope your issue is a configuration one and you manage to sort it out. If not try another sub!

Edit: No matter how much you Dynamat the boot, the rattle will still be there unfortunately with your set up
I can only agree with you, all coupe's, saloon's and especially convertibles have always been difficult to get bass into the cabin you only get a deformed wave which is completely different to the one in the boot, theres not a easy solution unfortunately, our best results was to always try to fire the base through the ski hatch if fitted or to remove a section of metal from the rear shelf, this is not to everyones taste as its a lot of work, whatever way you must also make sure there is a good seal so the pressure is on the cabin and not the boot.
I will try to did some photos out.

One thing I can say, the sub is not at fault and does require substantial running in, we used to leave them on for days at a low level in the showroom before installing in the car

Last edited by Bomber; 10-01-2012 at 06:10 PM.
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      10-01-2012, 06:12 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
Not applicable in saloons, I guess. And I don't want to go down the Dubai's route of fitting it.

It is applicable in saloons, just requires more work, especially if there's no ski hole present.

Not possible to have corner enclosure for this sub. Depth alone is 8.5-9.5 inches and that means I have to build corner enclosre which is protruding out from the rest of the corner. (2 inch gap behind the magnet)

Also the amount of air it dissipates, I can see that theoretically corner enclosure would be a total failure. Unless if I want to see my fuel filler door mechanism failing soon.

I guess corner enclosure is better for those having W6 or W3.

Wasn't suggesting a corner enclosure for a W7. Was just recommending what types of enclosures would work well with certain enclosure volume requirements.

I may be able to get better SQ with different sub, but sound waves will be bouncing back more in the trunk, leaving distorted sound.

Learning quick!

Cannot comment on this unless I try that. Least it can reduce the vibration of rear number plate.
Try it. Unfortunately its a well known fact
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      10-01-2012, 06:19 PM   #34
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Not one of ours but it gives you the idea,
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Last edited by Bomber; 10-01-2012 at 06:25 PM.
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      10-02-2012, 12:10 AM   #35
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from what I have read

SPL: W7 > FI Q seriies
SQ: FI Q > W7

The Fi Q people claim easily keeps up to the W7
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      10-02-2012, 12:57 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudz
from what I have read

SPL: W7 > FI Q seriies
SQ: FI Q > W7

The Fi Q people claim easily keeps up to the W7
Thanks Rudz.
Any comments on FI SSD?
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      10-02-2012, 12:59 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bomber
Not one of ours but it gives you the idea,
Looks promising.
Will look into it.
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      10-02-2012, 01:24 AM   #38
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I came across that 5 series on youtube last nigh funnily enough and the build looks awesome!
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      10-02-2012, 04:12 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
Thanks Rudz.
Any comments on FI SSD?
Here you go Mak, straight from the horses mouth

If you are wanting deep clean hard hitting bass, with 1000W, I would look to a standard Q15. Since you have the space, a ported Q tuned to 30Hz in 4 cuft would work well. An SSD is normally rated at 800W, and the copper coil allows things to drop deeper and cleaner for an SSD, but it doesnt increase thermal capacity. If you are easy on things, saving $$$ with the SSD and copper coil would work. If you are tougher on things, then the Q15 standard would do great.

Please let me know if I can help with anything else.

Thanks,
Scott
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Apparently there is a copper coil mod for a Fi SSD that allows deeper bass ? I've not researched this though
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      10-03-2012, 12:40 PM   #40
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Ok,
No offence to any JL fans.
I bought an alpine Type R sub (350 RMS) from a friend on a reasonable price and compared it to JLW7.

Not a lot of difference in terms of SPL (both of them are shaking my car), however I felt that sound quality on type R is better than W7.

I wonder what is the point of spending 500 on W7 (or 300 for used one) if any other decent sub on a 1/3 - 1/5 price can do nearly the same job.
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      10-03-2012, 01:52 PM   #41
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Wow, really! That's very interesting! Wish we could go somewhere to hear before buying n a similar environment, ie a car!!!
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      10-03-2012, 04:03 PM   #42
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Mak, hope to come to you with a few more subs to test, Type R's are cracking subs, good result me thinks, time to sell the W7 u reckon?
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      10-03-2012, 04:38 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudz View Post
Mak, hope to come to you with a few more subs to test, Type R's are cracking subs, good result me thinks, time to sell the W7 u reckon?
I will be using mine as bowl or paper weight.

I suggest you to keep it. Listen to it and then decide.

Other challenge is to decrease the rattling from number plate, which is real task.
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      10-03-2012, 04:39 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
I will be using mine as bowl or paper weight.

I suggest you to keep it. Listen to it and then decide.

Other challenge is to decrease the rattling from number plate, which is real task.
Door draught excluder.
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