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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Wheels and Tires Forum Sponsored by The Tire Rack > Winter driving with RWD - snow tires / wheels discussion



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      11-07-2012, 04:30 PM   #67
Kolyan2k
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
There is no law here in the US because its not needed. Most accidents in the winter are from people who is stupid enough to buy a RWD car and drive it in the snow without winter tires. I have been driving AWD cars or SUV with AS tires for 20 years and never had a problem with any Boston winter. As far as performance and safety, RWD do not perform better than AWD in everyday driving, unless you track your car, 99% of the drivers cannot tell the difference. As far as safety, AWD is a great safety feature in the snow, rain or any type of slippery consition.
Tirerack article proves you wrong. Its pretty much tirerack test results vs you.....a wise person would most likely trust tirerack and common knowledge

I bet many stupid people drive for 20 years and on 21st kill someone because AS tires are junk and they couldn't stop in emergency situation.
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      11-07-2012, 04:42 PM   #68
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For me it looks like this (being from Austria - you know, mountains, snow and shit):

AWD certainly helps while cornering, accelerating and a hillclimb WHEN you have good tires. It doesn't make you brake faster.

And whoever says he is doing good with AS tires on an AWD in winter clearly hasn't tried driving on WINTER TIRES on an AWD.

/Thread
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      11-07-2012, 04:46 PM   #69
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Today was my first time drivin in the snow with my 335.

I have Dunlop winter sort 3d's which I highly recommend and I had 0 worries.

As long as you don't drive like a douche and have proper tires... You should be fine.
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      11-07-2012, 05:01 PM   #70
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I put my winter set on this past weekend.

I feel a difference in wet conditions for sure. So much better at water evacuation that previous tyres. Hydroplaning is a challenge for the winter tyres.

I can't wait for the first snow to see how they feel. I'm already impressed over the previous All-seasons.

Granted, I came from All-season, run-flat, practically bald tires (2/32nds left before replacing), so my driving experience should be very dramatically different.

edit: I almost crashed twice last winter with my previous tires. I didn't care though because I wanted my moneys worth out of those stupid ass tires that came on the car, but looking back I wish I would've upgraded sooner. Just something to think about.
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      11-07-2012, 05:03 PM   #71
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Meh, I purchased my car late this past summer and it came with a send of brand new AS tires. I planned on buying a second set of dedicated wheels/tires for the summer and swapping the stock tires for winters but that after thinking about it more it seems like a waste of money to me. I'm gonna run these until it's time to change them, then I'll put a set of winters on.
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      11-07-2012, 06:02 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolyan2k View Post
Tirerack article proves you wrong. Its pretty much tirerack test results vs you.....a wise person would most likely trust tirerack and common knowledge

I bet many stupid people drive for 20 years and on 21st kill someone because AS tires are junk and they couldn't stop in emergency situation.
The problem with people like you is that you believe everything you read on the internet. While RWD with snow tires do stop shorter, they do not accelarate and climb hills as well as AWD with a good set of AS. AWD and snow tires each have their advantage and disadvantage in the snow. Having both would be ideal. Anyone who knows how to drive in the snow knows to keep extra distance from the car in front when its slippery. The people who are the most dangerious are the drivers without AWD or snow tires.

Last edited by The X Men; 11-07-2012 at 06:11 PM.
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      11-07-2012, 07:27 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
The problem with people like you is that you believe everything you read on the internet. While RWD with snow tires do stop shorter, they do not accelarate and climb hills as well as AWD with a good set of AS. AWD and snow tires each have their advantage and disadvantage in the snow. Having both would be ideal. Anyone who knows how to drive in the snow knows to keep extra distance from the car in front when its slippery. The people who are the most dangerious are the drivers without AWD or snow tires.
Wrong.....I had FWD, AWD, and RWD cars with AS tires, with summer tires, and with winters.

My AWD car with pretty bad high performance winter tires was not as good as my RWD car with snow/ice tires.

Its RWD car that was like a tank in snow. After that I would never buy another AWD car in Mass, unless its a high performance AWD. Not a fan of carrying extra weight for no reason.
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      11-07-2012, 07:44 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
The problem with people like you is that you believe everything you read on the internet. While RWD with snow tires do stop shorter, they do not accelarate and climb hills as well as AWD with a good set of AS. AWD and snow tires each have their advantage and disadvantage in the snow. Having both would be ideal. Anyone who knows how to drive in the snow knows to keep extra distance from the car in front when its slippery. The people who are the most dangerious are the drivers without AWD or snow tires.
All Season tires should be called No Season tires. They are a compromise for every season.

I'm sorry but you are out to lunch X Man. I've got a xDrive and it is terrible in the snow with the AS tires. My old RWD e46 with winters was way better to drive. First thing I did was switch to a set of winters and it has made a huge difference on the 335.

AWD does NOTHING in the snow to help you avoid an accident. Sure I could drive like a pansy all winter too, but winter tires can protect you from other people's bad mistakes by giving you the ability to avoid an accident.

Winter is not about who can accelerate the fastest. It's about who can stop the fastest, and keep the car under control. That's going to be the car with winter tires every time, whether it is AWD or not.

What you are saying is simply wrong.
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      11-07-2012, 07:52 PM   #75
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yup what everyone else is saying. An AWD car still has two wheel steering and four wheel braking just like a RWD (or FWD car for that matter) if you want to improve steering and braking you have to improve the tires. AWD just means when you stuff it in the weeds you'll be going faster :/

My old 944 went from undriveable to a beast with winter tires. I'm hoping for the same effect with the 335i. I already put the Blizzaks on it on Saturday, wish me luck!
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      11-07-2012, 08:39 PM   #76
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      11-08-2012, 06:53 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braumin View Post
All Season tires should be called No Season tires. They are a compromise for every season.

I'm sorry but you are out to lunch X Man. I've got a xDrive and it is terrible in the snow with the AS tires. My old RWD e46 with winters was way better to drive. First thing I did was switch to a set of winters and it has made a huge difference on the 335.

AWD does NOTHING in the snow to help you avoid an accident. Sure I could drive like a pansy all winter too, but winter tires can protect you from other people's bad mistakes by giving you the ability to avoid an accident.

Winter is not about who can accelerate the fastest. It's about who can stop the fastest, and keep the car under control. That's going to be the car with winter tires every time, whether it is AWD or not.

What you are saying is simply wrong.
I'm sorry, but I need to chime in here. I'll agree winter tires are obviously better in snow than All-Season tires (as that is what they are designed for), as All-Season tires are better in snow than summer performance tires. But there is more to it than just tires. You write like All-seasons are no better for snow traction than summer tires, which is just not true. The main safety factor in any type of inclement weather driving is the DRIVER. Either you know how to drive in snow or you don't.

I got caught in a snow storm in my E90 in December 2010 in Washington, DC. I had a meeting downtown and my truck, which I usually drive in snow conditions, wouldn't fit in the building's garage. I had to drive my E90 knowing that I could get out of the meeting before the snow hit. Well the snow came early. The problem I had was my tires, which were Yokohama AVID WS4 that were into the wearbars already and in serious need of replacement. I was maximizing tread life with the tires (I buy a new set of tires about every 11 months) and was going to replace them within a week. It wasn't the best situation, I'll agree, but I made it back to my office 15 miles West in Virginia in the snow storm, in very slow traffic, on almost bald tires, because I didn't panic, planned my route to avoid large hills, and drove in a way that didn't overtax the very limited amount of grip I did have.

If you live in Calgary, yes, run winter tires all winter long, if you live in the USA mid-Atlantic like I do, where it occasionally snows, All-seasons are a reasonable choice.

And learn how to drive in snow.
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      11-08-2012, 07:24 AM   #78
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^ you say plan your trip and learn how to drive in snow....but the fact is accidents are not planned and even the best drivers get in to them, and by running AS tires you increase that chance greatly.

I would understand if AS were great in summer and so so in winter ......but another fact is that they are no good in summer or in winter. So it basically comes down to 2 things .....1 you cannot afford another set or 2 you are to lazy to switch for your own safety and safety of others
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      11-08-2012, 08:30 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolyan2k View Post
Wrong.....I had FWD, AWD, and RWD cars with AS tires, with summer tires, and with winters.

My AWD car with pretty bad high performance winter tires was not as good as my RWD car with snow/ice tires.

Its RWD car that was like a tank in snow. After that I would never buy another AWD car in Mass, unless its a high performance AWD. Not a fan of carrying extra weight for no reason.
WRONG, I can see that you fail physics in high school. Its better to pull a car thru snow than to push it, push and pull would be the best senserio as in AWD. If a AWD and RWD car have the same snow tires, the AWD will out perform the RWD in the snow.
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      11-08-2012, 09:04 AM   #80
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man you are a joke.....who said anything about AWD and RWD with same snow tires ? wtf ?
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      11-08-2012, 09:18 AM   #81
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I haven't put my snows on yet and this Nor'easter that struck NJ yesterday put down about 4 inches in my area. I left my car in the street til my wife got home, I am the first one out so I don't like to do the car shuffle in the morning. Unplowed surface, I simply pulled up, backed in but went sideways. pulled straight out, went back in, went sideways toward the curbing along the driveway. Pulled out and did it again, and went straight in. Each time I pulled out and stopped, the car just kept sliding forward and to the side.
Keep in mind I have summer performance tires on.

So I will be swapping the tires at the next sign of snow in the forecast.
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      11-08-2012, 10:00 AM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolyan2k View Post
man you are a joke.....who said anything about AWD and RWD with same snow tires ? wtf ?
Its almost like I am talking to the mentally challenged here , Just to get you up to speed, you are the one that said your AWD with snow did not perform as well as your RWD with snow in the winter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolyan2k View Post
My AWD car with pretty bad high performance winter tires was not as good as my RWD car with snow/ice tires.

Its RWD car that was like a tank in snow. After that I would never buy another AWD car in Mass.
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      11-08-2012, 10:38 AM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolyan2k View Post
^ there is no law in USA because people are too stupid, thats why you see so many accidents w/ fatal results during winter storms. It can all be easily avoided.

Quite a lot of people here go with AS tires because they are broke as fucks due to their BMW purchase. It make no sense to buy BMW and dramatically decrease your performance and safety during summer and winter.....365 days a year.
EXACTLY. Endless posts here about "I've never had a problem" and "you'll be fine" but the FACT is that winter tires are FAR more effective than A/S when it comes to stopping and cornering.
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      11-08-2012, 10:45 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
I'm sorry, but I need to chime in here. I'll agree winter tires are obviously better in snow than All-Season tires (as that is what they are designed for), as All-Season tires are better in snow than summer performance tires. But there is more to it than just tires. You write like All-seasons are no better for snow traction than summer tires, which is just not true. The main safety factor in any type of inclement weather driving is the DRIVER. Either you know how to drive in snow or you don't.

I got caught in a snow storm in my E90 in December 2010 in Washington, DC. I had a meeting downtown and my truck, which I usually drive in snow conditions, wouldn't fit in the building's garage. I had to drive my E90 knowing that I could get out of the meeting before the snow hit. Well the snow came early. The problem I had was my tires, which were Yokohama AVID WS4 that were into the wearbars already and in serious need of replacement. I was maximizing tread life with the tires (I buy a new set of tires about every 11 months) and was going to replace them within a week. It wasn't the best situation, I'll agree, but I made it back to my office 15 miles West in Virginia in the snow storm, in very slow traffic, on almost bald tires, because I didn't panic, planned my route to avoid large hills, and drove in a way that didn't overtax the very limited amount of grip I did have.

If you live in Calgary, yes, run winter tires all winter long, if you live in the USA mid-Atlantic like I do, where it occasionally snows, All-seasons are a reasonable choice.

And learn how to drive in snow.
Reasonable? Winter tires WILL help you stop faster in winter ...dry or snow covered. FACT.
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      11-08-2012, 10:46 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
Its almost like I am talking to the mentally challenged here , Just to get you up to speed, you are the one that said your AWD with snow did not perform as well as your RWD with snow in the winter.
Educate yourself first before making retarded comments. High Performance winter tires and especially bad ones cannot compare to good Ice/Snow tires. Thats why RWD with good Ice/Snow tires was better then AWD with bad High Performance winter tires. 2 different tire categories and 2 very different tires.
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      11-08-2012, 10:58 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
The problem with people like you is that you believe everything you read on the internet. While RWD with snow tires do stop shorter, they do not accelarate and climb hills as well as AWD with a good set of AS. AWD and snow tires each have their advantage and disadvantage in the snow. Having both would be ideal. Anyone who knows how to drive in the snow knows to keep extra distance from the car in front when its slippery. The people who are the most dangerious are the drivers without AWD or snow tires.
Its a VIDEO!!. How much more conclusive can you get?
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      11-08-2012, 11:12 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolyan2k View Post
Educate yourself first before making retarded comments. High Performance winter tires and especially bad ones cannot compare to good Ice/Snow tires. Thats why RWD with good Ice/Snow tires was better then AWD with bad High Performance winter tires. 2 different tire categories and 2 very different tires.
You sir are an idiot, you are simply talking out of your ass. You know nothing about physic and AWD. If you think you RWD is better than AWD in the snow, then you are as stupid as your post. Just like snow tires have different tire categories, so does AWD vehicles. Reading all your post tells me that you know nothing about AWD cars and from all your uneducated comments, you also know nothing about the laws physics.
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      11-08-2012, 11:15 AM   #88
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lol, i suppose everyone in this thread talks out of their asses...including tirerack....those tirerack bastards must be lying to sell more tires !
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