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      11-09-2012, 12:47 AM   #1
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e85 question

hello i have been looking for some info but no luck.

i will like to knw a bit more how this work you just put some e 85 mix w gas ?? u need injectors ??? how is this ??? what mods do u need???

thanks and sorry if this is a stupid question
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      11-09-2012, 12:51 AM   #2
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Start here,

Essentially you need a proper tune to run a higher ethanol blends. On some aggressive MAPs, you can mix a bit of E85 pump (3 gallons) with 91 octane to run, if 93 isn't available. But realistically you need a proper tune.

Read the tunes, they have specific mods required when blending higher ethanol percentages.
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      11-09-2012, 12:58 AM   #3
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The stock injectors are able to handle E85. So far, there have been no known issues with corrosion.

The safest and most effective way to run E85 in your car is to buy a PROcede with their Flex-Fuel kit. It measures real-time ethanol content and adjusts the tune accordingly:
http://procedetuning.com/BMW/n54/styled-19/index.html
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      11-09-2012, 12:31 PM   #4
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Keeping unbiased & not dragging tunes into this (*cough*^^*cough*), essentially E85 gives us the ability to run very aggressive timing due to it's octane rating in our direction injection motors.

More Timing = More Power

There's a variety of blends that you can run (depending on which specific tune you want to go with ), but anything greater than 3 gals of E85 to a full tank of 91/93 will yield VERY noticeable gains. ALL the tunes work with E85 & at this time there is no officially proven upgrade for the Fuel Pump or Injectors, so don't even concern yourself with those headaches.
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      11-09-2012, 07:29 PM   #5
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Seriously? This rodeo again? Benzy, welcome back, but there is no need to beat a dead horse.

The JB4 doesn't have the ability to advance timing, and Cobb isn't able to get close to the horsepower numbers on E85 (even with a whole list of supporting mods). Most importantly, as I mentioned in my first post, the PROcede is the only tune that incorporates a flex fuel sensor, so your car is running optimally for whatever fuel blend is running through the system. It's been proven that its impossible to predict the exact ethanol concentration reaching your engine at any given moment, so manually adjusting your tune is borderline dangerous.

Right now, Vishnu offers the only complete solution to running E85 in your car. OP asked a question and these are the facts.
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      11-09-2012, 08:01 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benzy89 View Post
Keeping unbiased & not dragging tunes into this (*cough*^^*cough*), essentially E85 gives us the ability to run very aggressive timing due to it's octane rating in our direction injection motors.

More Timing = More Power

There's a variety of blends that you can run (depending on which specific tune you want to go with ), but anything greater than 3 gals of E85 to a full tank of 91/93 will yield VERY noticeable gains. ALL the tunes work with E85 & at this time there is no officially proven upgrade for the Fuel Pump or Injectors, so don't even concern yourself with those headaches.
There is a proven fuel pump, and it is in probably around 5 cars so far, it just hasn't been announced on the forums yet, so stay tuned.

It also sounds cool when you press the unlock button on your key and its primes
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      11-09-2012, 09:12 PM   #7
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There is a proven fuel pump, and it is in probably around 5 cars so far, it just hasn't been announced on the forums yet, so stay tuned.

It also sounds cool when you press the unlock button on your key and its primes
We talking about the Walbro that Terry's been testing? Cause that's just not been announced on THIS forum
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      11-09-2012, 09:21 PM   #8
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Cobb isn't able to get close to the horsepower numbers on E85 (even with a whole list of supporting mods).
My car's not a dyno queen (it's actually never been on a dyno) & I welcome a challenge from ANY PROcede tuned car that wants to run E85 against me. So until you have video supporting your claims, let Vishnu do the marketing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laguna Seca Blue View Post
Most importantly, as I mentioned in my first post, the PROcede is the only tune that incorporates a flex fuel sensor, so your car is running optimally for whatever fuel blend is running through the system. It's been proven that its impossible to predict the exact ethanol concentration reaching your engine at any given moment, so manually adjusting your tune is borderline dangerous.
Yes it incorporates a sensor, but we both agreed that responsible tuning can avoid any potential problems. It's also important that if the user wants to dabble with E85 (even with a sensor) that they data log the car & make sure that the tune is working appropriately (from both a performance & safety perspective). Modding the cars to the level a lot of us have taken them (~3 times the stock boost, increased timing, etc), the owner should take some degree of interest & data log the car to make sure it's running "happy". Even all pump gas isn't "created equally", so to even just keep pumping X octane in the car & forget about it isn't the "safest" approach either.
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      11-09-2012, 09:38 PM   #9
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FACT: most, if not all flex-fueled vehicles built after 2005 no longer use a flex-fuel sensor unit

FACT: Vishnu's system is the only dummy-proof system

FACT: It's not hard to measure ethanol content of gasoline

FACT: It's not hard to figure out how to run at least 30% ethanol content to clean up ignition timing up to stock timing curves.

FACT: all tunes now have some form of ignition control (whether optional or standard) to advance and retard timing.

FACT: COBB, BMS, VISHNU all have some form of E85 maps. If you're in doubt of running E85, just do it I've been running e50-e60 since January of this year and I can't go back to running 93 octane, It's addicting!

Take it for what it's worth, I can name a large number of vehicle's that use Lambda feedback to calculate the amount of ethanol content.
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      11-09-2012, 09:59 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Laguna Seca Blue View Post
Seriously? This rodeo again? Benzy, welcome back, but there is no need to beat a dead horse.

The JB4 doesn't have the ability to advance timing, and Cobb isn't able to get close to the horsepower numbers on E85 (even with a whole list of supporting mods). Most importantly, as I mentioned in my first post, the PROcede is the only tune that incorporates a flex fuel sensor, so your car is running optimally for whatever fuel blend is running through the system. It's been proven that its impossible to predict the exact ethanol concentration reaching your engine at any given moment, so manually adjusting your tune is borderline dangerous.

Right now, Vishnu offers the only complete solution to running E85 in your car. OP asked a question and these are the facts.
http://www.jibjab.com/view/o-c2mp2hQhW9lWHv9PFAVA
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      11-10-2012, 02:57 AM   #11
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Also the guys at FFTEC turned me on to this stuff:

https://www.duralube.com/Galleries/S...20Enhancer.pdf

Can be found at Walmart and one bottle will treat 2 of our tanks (30 gallons). After I used half a bottle and swapped injectors, they were super clean. Before I treated the fuel, when I pulled out an injector, there was this brown sticky substance at the tip of the injector. It appears to be almost a caramelization of the sugars in the ethanol to the fuel system. one tank and the other injector I pulled was completely cleaned. It's probably worth half a bottle every 2-3 tanks. Super cheap at Walmart.
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      11-10-2012, 11:56 AM   #12
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Quote:
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Also the guys at FFTEC turned me on to this stuff:

https://www.duralube.com/Galleries/S...20Enhancer.pdf
I'm gonna keep my eyes open for this green stuff, but I've been running Chevron Injection Cleaner to flush out any gunk after running E85 blended tanks of gas.
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      11-10-2012, 01:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benzy89
Quote:
Originally Posted by joec500 View Post
Also the guys at FFTEC turned me on to this stuff:

https://www.duralube.com/Galleries/S...20Enhancer.pdf
I'm gonna keep my eyes open for this green stuff, but I've been running Chevron Injection Cleaner to flush out any gunk after running E85 blended tanks of gas.
I ran techron 2 tanks prior to changing one injector and it was covered in the black sticky stuff. One tank of the duralube and the other injector I replaced was spotless. Not sure if techron is as good as the green stuff from duralube for ethanol. I am also running 100%E85.
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      11-10-2012, 08:37 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spool twice View Post
FACT: most, if not all flex-fueled vehicles built after 2005 no longer use a flex-fuel sensor unit
Yes, but that's only because their DME's are now advanced enough to make big corrections instantaneously. Our Siemens DME's have the provision to do so slightly, but Octane levels in petrol do not vary that much until you add E85 into the mix, so a standalone sensor combined with the PROcede aids the DME tremendously. Also,You are not comparing apples to apples here. Do regular flexfuel vehicles run like raped apes who you substitute gasoline with E85? No because they run much more conservative tunes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spool twice View Post
FACT: Vishnu's system is the only dummy-proof system
I would call it the only "complete solution." Even a genius would benefit from it. I'll explain below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spool twice View Post
FACT: It's not hard to measure ethanol content of gasoline
Incorrect. E85 blends change throughout the year and Shiv did some testing that proved that its very difficult to predict when and how you fuel blend is mixing. He started a thread about it, I'll look it up for you if you missed it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by spool twice View Post
FACT: all tunes now have some form of ignition control (whether optional or standard) to advance and retard timing.
Incorrect. PROcede and Cobb have full ignition control. JB4 cannot advance timing it can only retard it, and that's only if you have the latest G5 board. Previous versions rely on the factory knock sensor to retard timing

Quote:
Originally Posted by spool twice View Post
FACT: COBB, BMS, VISHNU all have some form of E85 maps. If you're in doubt of running E85, just do it I've been running e50-e60 since January of this year and I can't go back to running 93 octane, It's addicting!
Awesome man! I wish we had E85 here.

Benzy - You are I have had this discussion before. I'm not really sure how anything you said refutes my previous post. My takeaway is that you haven't dynoed your car and you believe in logging. Who doesn't?
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      11-10-2012, 09:00 PM   #15
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E-85 is definitely addicting because of how much power our N54's/N55's make on it. My 335i is a completely different beast with E-85. I had my doubts about using E-85 as well but after I tried it I won't ever stop...

Get a JB4 and DCI then put about 5-7 gallons of E-85 then top off your tank with 91/93. I'd go with Map 2 but that's personal preference. I know you don't have downpipes but I used to run Map 2 all the time without DP's and my car ran strong. Go either with Map 1, 2, or 5. I'm honestly not a big fan of Map 5 tho compared to Map 2.

Good luck!

And FYI, your car might run a little sloppy at first but give it time to adjust. Maybe a few hours, maybe a few days.
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      11-10-2012, 09:05 PM   #16
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      11-10-2012, 09:08 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laguna Seca Blue View Post
Yes, but that's only because their DME's are now advanced enough to make big corrections instantaneously. Our Siemens DME's have the provision to do so slightly, but Octane levels in petrol do not vary that much until you add E85 into the mix, so a standalone sensor combined with the PROcede aids the DME tremendously. Also,You are not comparing apples to apples here. Do regular flexfuel vehicles run like raped apes who you substitute gasoline with E85? No because they run much more conservative tunes.



I would call it the only "complete solution." Even a genius would benefit from it. I'll explain below.



Incorrect. E85 blends change throughout the year and Shiv did some testing that proved that its very difficult to predict when and how you fuel blend is mixing. He started a thread about it, I'll look it up for you if you missed it.




Incorrect. PROcede and Cobb have full ignition control. JB4 cannot advance timing it can only retard it, and that's only if you have the latest G5 board. Previous versions rely on the factory knock sensor to retard timing



Awesome man! I wish we had E85 here.

Benzy - You are I have had this discussion before. I'm not really sure how anything you said refutes my previous post. My takeaway is that you haven't dynoed your car and you believe in logging. Who doesn't?
such a fanboy, are you actually running the e85 sensor? logs?
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      11-10-2012, 09:14 PM   #18
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      11-10-2012, 09:16 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laguna Seca Blue View Post
Seriously? This rodeo again? Benzy, welcome back, but there is no need to beat a dead horse.

The JB4 doesn't have the ability to advance timing, and Cobb isn't able to get close to the horsepower numbers on E85 (even with a whole list of supporting mods). Most importantly, as I mentioned in my first post, the PROcede is the only tune that incorporates a flex fuel sensor, so your car is running optimally for whatever fuel blend is running through the system. It's been proven that its impossible to predict the exact ethanol concentration reaching your engine at any given moment, so manually adjusting your tune is borderline dangerous.

Right now, Vishnu offers the only complete solution to running E85 in your car. OP asked a question and these are the facts.
i want to see some proceeds running E85 run with me. Its about results, i have nothing against proceed. But with the JB4 (G4 18ohm lol) i consistently run 11s in full street trim and weight, street tires with a 45% ethanol ratio. No meth either, just FMIC, exhaust, intake and tune. Im sure the flex fuel sensor stuff is good times, but to say JB4 doesnt do great with E85 is a long shot.
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      11-11-2012, 09:01 AM   #20
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i want to see some proceeds running E85 run with me. Its about results, i have nothing against proceed. But with the JB4 (G4 18ohm lol) i consistently run 11s in full street trim and weight, street tires with a 45% ethanol ratio. No meth either, just FMIC, exhaust, intake and tune. Im sure the flex fuel sensor stuff is good times, but to say JB4 doesnt do great with E85 is a long shot.
I agree 100 % ..
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      11-11-2012, 09:06 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PR3CI5N View Post
E-85 is definitely addicting because of how much power our N54's/N55's make on it. My 335i is a completely different beast with E-85. I had my doubts about using E-85 as well but after I tried it I won't ever stop...

Get a JB4 and DCI then put about 5-7 gallons of E-85 then top off your tank with 91/93. I'd go with Map 2 but that's personal preference. I know you don't have downpipes but I used to run Map 2 all the time without DP's and my car ran strong. Go either with Map 1, 2, or 5. I'm honestly not a big fan of Map 5 tho compared to Map 2.

Good luck!

And FYI, your car might run a little sloppy at first but give it time to adjust. Maybe a few hours, maybe a few days.
So true .. Same here but I actually love Map 5, especially in the cold weather .
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      11-11-2012, 09:17 AM   #22
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i want to see some proceeds running E85 run with me. Its about results, i have nothing against proceed. But with the JB4 (G4 18ohm lol) i consistently run 11s in full street trim and weight, street tires with a 45% ethanol ratio. No meth either, just FMIC, exhaust, intake and tune. Im sure the flex fuel sensor stuff is good times, but to say JB4 doesnt do great with E85 is a long shot.
I don't think anyone said that you cannot achieve impressive results on a jb4 with E85...there was just a discussion about whether or not jb4 advances timing or not. Yes I have a procede but I'm not a fanboy.
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