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      01-27-2013, 07:23 PM   #1
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***4" component set and under seat sub prototypes***

Hey guys i been designing some 4" component sets that will fit in our cars, i am also designing a under seat sub as well. I should have some prototypes in to test around late march. I want to know what you guys feel about this and how many of you would be interested in purchasing these speakers. If i get a high enough demand i will set up a vendor account and set up pre-orders at a discounted price.

Just a heads up i will be testing multiple 4" mids, tweeters and under seat subs before i choose the final product. I will post up all specification when i decide on the final product is chosen, i will also keep you guys updated with pictures and videos as i test these prototypes. I will be testing these in my personal e90 with a dsp (digital sound processor) for persist tuning for crossover designing.

I do not mind any ideas you might have and i will take them into consideration. I am not a professional at designing speakers but i do know enough and i also have help from a speaker engineer. So this being said comment away with ideas guys
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      01-27-2013, 09:32 PM   #2
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Have you ever designed speakers before?

Have you ever designed speakers before?
A 5 inch speaker that goes in a 4 inch hole would be nice.
Seriously not kidding.

Things to consider
of the three sound system's that BMW offers only the L7 has
close to enough power to make a quality speaker sound good.
So you need to offer and amp or amp processor solution to.

A low cost or lower cost lower panel that would allow the mounting
of bigger or deeper speakers in the useless map area might get
some interest. Jehnert makes them but they pretty are expensive.

I might choose a different name for your comapny.
I can see the marketing line now
Do want a Scar in your Car.
Not trying to be offensive but I think I would try to choose a name
that was a little more ethereal.

Have you done any marketing research to see if you have a viable
market. Like most of the company's that are in this space have to appeal
to multiple brands of cars and I don't think its to easy .

I applaud you for trying to be inventive.

Last edited by ctuna; 01-27-2013 at 10:09 PM.
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      01-27-2013, 10:01 PM   #3
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I doubt you would do better than Morel, Focal, Hybrid Audio etc... you should reconsider this venture.
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      01-27-2013, 11:10 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdgatti View Post
I doubt you would do better than Morel, Focal, Hybrid Audio etc... you should reconsider this venture.
There's always room for improvement so I wouldn't discourage anyone from trying to do something different. Hybrid Audio is a fairly new company and started out very small. I'm sure people told Scott Buwalda "why do you think you can do better than the big companies that are already out there" and it's a good thing he didn't listen.

To the OP, your comment about testing multiple drivers leads me to believe that you are trying to put together a component set using readily available raw drivers and trying to build or specify custom passive crossovers for them. If that is the case, then I agree with cdgatti that you will find it very difficult to make this work better than what's already available. If you are actually attempting to design a new driver in conjunction with a build house then hats off to you for the effort.
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      01-27-2013, 11:54 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
Have you ever designed speakers before?
A 5 inch speaker that goes in a 4 inch hole would be nice.
Seriously not kidding.

Things to consider
of the three sound system's that BMW offers only the L7 has
close to enough power to make a quality speaker sound good.
So you need to offer and amp or amp processor solution to.

A low cost or lower cost lower panel that would allow the mounting
of bigger or deeper speakers in the useless map area might get
some interest. Jehnert makes them but they pretty are expensive.

I might choose a different name for your comapny.
I can see the marketing line now
Do want a Scar in your Car.
Not trying to be offensive but I think I would try to choose a name
that was a little more ethereal.

Have you done any marketing research to see if you have a viable
market. Like most of the company's that are in this space have to appeal
to multiple brands of cars and I don't think its to easy .

I applaud you for trying to be inventive.
Thing is i have connections with a couple of build houses and wanted to give a shot at having something built so i figured the need for a 4" component set that doesn't cost $400-600 a set would be a nice start. I have never built a speaker but i do know whats needed and whats the best materials for a great sounding set. I also been talking with a couple of engineers that gave me a lot of info and told me that the idea i have should work and Im in the right path but i just need to do a lot of testing.

Ps. Skar audio is not the name brand lol..... Its another brand that Im representing
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      01-27-2013, 11:59 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdgatti View Post
I doubt you would do better than Morel, Focal, Hybrid Audio etc... you should reconsider this venture.
I never said i wanted to do better than any other company out but i just want to give the people another choice if they don't want to spend so much money on a 4" component set. I am designing something that's not gonna break the bank but still be worth every cent.
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      01-28-2013, 12:08 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 808MGuy View Post
There's always room for improvement so I wouldn't discourage anyone from trying to do something different. Hybrid Audio is a fairly new company and started out very small. I'm sure people told Scott Buwalda "why do you think you can do better than the big companies that are already out there" and it's a good think he didn't listen.

To the OP, your comment about testing multiple drivers leads me to believe that you are trying to put together a component set using readily available raw drivers and trying to build or specify custom passive crossovers for them. If that is the case, then I agree with cdgatti that you will find it very difficult to make this work better than what's already available. If you are actually attempting to design a new driver in conjunction with a build house then hats off to you for the effort.
Thanks a lot man. Variety is always nice lol. Just to clear things up Im not just buying raw drivers and building them into a component set. Im actually having a couple of 4" midrange drivers built to my specifications and testing them individually till i find the right one and than Im going to match up some tweeters and build a passive crossover that will utilize the two in a great smooth frequency response.
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      01-28-2013, 12:11 AM   #8
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Heres a lil teaser..... One of the companies Im dealing with built for some well known companies. Memphis audio bein one of them.

So build quality shouldn't be a problem
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      01-28-2013, 12:55 AM   #9
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What is Your background ?
What are Your skills ?
What is your opinion to be the 'best material' ?
What is your reference point for subjective 'testing' ?
Is it just you or a group evaluating these 'sets' ?
Do you have the coin and time to take on this venture ? It is much more than one may think.


Not all sets that work very well and fit cost in the $400-$600 range. Just an FYI.
Engineers are known for designing and building, to an extent, not listening, in a vehicle.
Using Memphis as a reference to a 'quality buildhouse' is less than stellar.

Not trying to pee in your cheerios, just being realistic, out loud.
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      01-28-2013, 04:36 AM   #10
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Really interesting.

From a UK perspective there is lots of choice for 4" Speakers. They can easily be made to fit with adapters. However for the 8" Underseats there is basically no choice. Earthquakes are very expensive and Jehurts and MB Quart's can only be bought as a complete set. The subs / mid basses can't be bought separately. Thus in my opinion you would have a far great market if you concentrated on this option.
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      01-28-2013, 05:10 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sohlman View Post
Really interesting.

From a UK perspective there is lots of choice for 4" Speakers. They can easily be made to fit with adapters. However for the 8" Underseats there is basically no choice. Earthquakes are very expensive and Jehurts and MB Quart's can only be bought as a complete set. The subs / mid basses can't be bought separately. Thus in my opinion you would have a far great market if you concentrated on this option.
The jehnert xe200 can be bought seperately.Just go to jehnert direct .
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      01-28-2013, 05:14 AM   #12
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I love the fact you have the balls to give it a go and who knows if you do enough research you WILL be successful, after a few prototypes of course. Dont get disheartened by any comments on here, but take constructive criticism.

It'll be an amazing learning curve for you, i would be very interested for you to post up progress of your project(s) .

Everyday is a school day!! Go for it.

EDIT: Just to add, most of the best made speakers (certainly for home cinema) are hand made!! Naim & BK are brands that instantly spring to mind.
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      01-28-2013, 06:47 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sohlman View Post
Really interesting.

From a UK perspective there is lots of choice for 4" Speakers. They can easily be made to fit with adapters. However for the 8" Underseats there is basically no choice. Earthquakes are very expensive and Jehurts and MB Quart's can only be bought as a complete set. The subs / mid basses can't be bought separately. Thus in my opinion you would have a far great market if you concentrated on this option.
And there is Gladen one kit as well. (tweeters / mids / under seats) and they are 100W and very affordable.

James, If you have not bought MB Quarts, I would suggest you to consider Gladen one kit.
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      01-28-2013, 06:58 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyraw215 View Post
Hey guys i been designing some 4" component sets that will fit in our cars, i am also designing a under seat sub as well. I should have some prototypes in to test around late march. I want to know what you guys feel about this and how many of you would be interested in purchasing these speakers. If i get a high enough demand i will set up a vendor account and set up pre-orders at a discounted price.

Just a heads up i will be testing multiple 4" mids, tweeters and under seat subs before i choose the final product. I will post up all specification when i decide on the final product is chosen, i will also keep you guys updated with pictures and videos as i test these prototypes. I will be testing these in my personal e90 with a dsp (digital sound processor) for persist tuning for crossover designing.

I do not mind any ideas you might have and i will take them into consideration. I am not a professional at designing speakers but i do know enough and i also have help from a speaker engineer. So this being said comment away with ideas guys

Here is a suggestion for you...

Try to work on 3 ways kit with passive xovers (optional) as well.


Package A
Tweeters
Mids (which can work ideally from 100Hz on).
Tweeters and mids should be at least 100W quality products.
underseat mid bass drivers (70-200HZ range).
Underseats should be at least 150-200W as they have to work hard to go through seats / your cheeks and all the way up to your ears.

This package will work for those who will have sub in their cars.

Package B
And your second package should be similar to above except underseats should go low to 40Hz while retaining the upper 200Hz range (for those without subs)

Also remember that
-Depth of mids should be less than what can be fitted in E92s.
-Depth of 8 inch drivers should be slightly less than earthquakes.

I am no expert by any means but I see these as flaws in other drivers available in the market. If one brand can cover these, then you do not have to mix and match stuff and upgrading BMW sound system would be a lot easier.
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      01-28-2013, 08:59 AM   #15
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If you can make some money by selling a nice sounding 4" component set -E90 and F30 Sedan and Coupe fitment, meaning 40mm or less, with the matching OEM 3-hole mounting frame- for less than $200 then this will be a great effort.

Otherwise, good luck fighting your way into a well established and great sounding 4" component market.
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      01-28-2013, 09:21 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macck View Post
The jehnert xe200 can be bought seperately.Just go to jehnert direct .
Thanks for that i will check it out, but the main point is there is very little options.

This is a great project
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      01-28-2013, 03:06 PM   #17
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Sounds like your target market is basically the BSW niche. You should be able to find info on their market size and considering you will be starting with a small fraction of that, you can assess this venture. I applaud your entrepreneurial spirit, just think you have chosen a bad idea. I hope I am wrong.
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      01-29-2013, 12:08 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdgatti View Post
Sounds like your target market is basically the BSW niche. You should be able to find info on their market size and considering you will be starting with a small fraction of that, you can assess this venture. I applaud your entrepreneurial spirit, just think you have chosen a bad idea. I hope I am wrong.
BS, BSW is selling paper woofers, if this guy can sell the same product at a lower cost he can be successful.
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      02-14-2013, 10:21 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyraw215 View Post
Hey guys i been designing some 4" component sets that will fit in our cars, i am also designing a under seat sub as well. I should have some prototypes in to test around late march. I want to know what you guys feel about this and how many of you would be interested in purchasing these speakers. If i get a high enough demand i will set up a vendor account and set up pre-orders at a discounted price.

Just a heads up i will be testing multiple 4" mids, tweeters and under seat subs before i choose the final product. I will post up all specification when i decide on the final product is chosen, i will also keep you guys updated with pictures and videos as i test these prototypes. I will be testing these in my personal e90 with a dsp (digital sound processor) for persist tuning for crossover designing.

I do not mind any ideas you might have and i will take them into consideration. I am not a professional at designing speakers but i do know enough and i also have help from a speaker engineer. So this being said comment away with ideas guys
I think this is a great idea. I was thinking the same business model. Something totally turnkey for each style of E90 stereo. People that lease or those afraid to ruin their warranty would sure go for a simple, affordable solution. Go for it!
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      02-15-2013, 12:21 PM   #20
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You know Mikey what might be a better businees model would be one offering a plug and play product the casual hobbyist could replace his non-idrive head unit with an aftermarket, single or double din, and retain all the abilities the car had including chimes, pdc, sw controls etc and still allow BMW coding and software updates at the dealer. Without having to relocate the original head unit to the trunk, which many believe to be just stupid.

ANother variant of this would be to make a dash insert with controls resembling somewhat factory oem like the Dynavin head units, but used a modern good head unit like the pioneer/alpine/kenwood.
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      02-15-2013, 01:44 PM   #21
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That would be hard

That would be hard
Major reverse Engineering.
How about a device that translates analog inputs to something
the BMW Logic 7 unit can understand for those that don't want
to retrofit there L7 amp and speakers.

There was a guy in Berkely Ca that was repairing L7 amps for 7 Series
who would put larger power devices in to upgrade the wattage over on the
bimmerfest board 7 series forum at one point.

The aftermarket bezels commonly available for aftermarket Head Units are ugly is part of the problem.

Last edited by ctuna; 02-15-2013 at 01:56 PM.
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      03-12-2013, 08:05 PM   #22
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I know it's been a while but I have tested 2 different prototype 4" midrange drivers and they both sounded great although I noticed that the speaker I'm currently testing has less mid bass but sounds a lot more cleaner and gets pretty damn loud.

I have been talking and getting some help from someone who is very well known in the car audio world. I won't put his name out there yet but most of u guys who are really into the non mainstream car audio companies know who he is and know his products are very well better than most of these mainstream companies out here, for example JL Audio and kicker.
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