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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > AUDIO/VIDEO + BLUETOOTH + Electronics/Alarm/Software > Hybrid Legatia L3 vs Morel Hybrid Ovation II vs Focal 100KRS



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      01-29-2013, 07:49 AM   #1
makkan00
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Hybrid Legatia L3 vs Morel Hybrid Ovation II vs Focal 100KRS

Hi
I am looking for comparison of these three drivers in E9x series.
I have seen that Kaigoss tried Legatia L3 SE but on his thread there are no comments on comparison to other drivers.
I have read few thread where people favoured Legatia L3 over morels, and is that true? What about Focals?

I am considering these three drivers. If I go down the route of L3 (cannot afford se) then they will be fitted with L1 tweeters.

My preference is 150hz and above and a balance between SQ and SPL.

Any comments / feedback?
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      01-29-2013, 03:37 PM   #2
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EDITED with updated snapshot
DLS has launched DLS ultimate UP4 for BMW cars.

So considering above three drivers and DLS, I have put their specifications all together.



Now looking at these and considering that I will be powering my front mids at 75W @ 4 ohm xoverd HP @ 150Hz from Xd 600/6, which of these will work best?
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      01-29-2013, 05:58 PM   #3
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Legatia only goes to 10k hz and will only handle 25 watts, so I think
I would rule that one out right away.

New DLS goes to 200kz.

I think these specs are a little off .

Also there is a personality associated with these that aren't described by
the specs that are normaly offered.
Morels are described as warm whereas focals are described as
harsher. Don't know what flavor DLS's are.
If you had enough specs I think it could be described but nobody gets
that multidimensional.
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      01-29-2013, 06:31 PM   #4
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Don't know why people keep saying Focals are harsh. I've installed and demo plenty focal equip cars and they never sounded harsh to me.
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      01-29-2013, 06:38 PM   #5
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You have incorrectly read the spec sheet for the L3. The numbers you have there assume no crossover. In real life, an L3 will handle more than 50W.

Then again, power handling is probably one of the last specs I would ever use to select a speaker.
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      01-29-2013, 07:29 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctuna View Post
Legatia only goes to 10k hz and will only handle 25 watts, so I think
I would rule that one out right away.

New DLS goes to 200kz.

I think these specs are a little off .

Also there is a personality associated with these that aren't described by
the specs that are normaly offered.
Morels are described as warm whereas focals are described as
harsher. Don't know what flavor DLS's are.
If you had enough specs I think it could be described but nobody gets
that multidimensional.
DLS is my typo error. That is actually 20Khz.

I've sent email to DLS for further figures.

I am really struggling to choose one.
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      01-29-2013, 07:32 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcurley55 View Post
You have incorrectly read the spec sheet for the L3. The numbers you have there assume no crossover. In real life, an L3 will handle more than 50W.

I wrote 50W as I am going active. Though I will be using xover actively (>150Hz), I'd assume that they will still be 50W.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcurley55 View Post
Then again, power handling is probably one of the last specs I would ever use to select a speaker.
I guess you are thinking with your SQ hat on.
How about having a balance b/w SQ and SPL?
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      01-29-2013, 07:54 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
I wrote 50W as I am going active. Though I will be using xover actively (>150Hz), I'd assume that they will still be 50W.
If you use an L3 within its intended range, it will handle much more than 50W. Scott has a JL HD750/1 on each of his L3SEs.

Quote:
I guess you are thinking with your SQ hat on.
How about having a balance b/w SQ and SPL?
If I wanted a balance between SQ and SPL, I would never suggest a 150 Hz highpass on a 3" driver, either. The L3's will get loud, but you need to use them correctly.
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      01-29-2013, 08:59 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
I wrote 50W as I am going active. Though I will be using xover actively (>150Hz), I'd assume that they will still be 50W.
You still have a crossover, it is your amp high-pass. The Hybrid will take 100W plus but it is a little smaller than the others, hence the 185Hz HP recommendation. Like has been said, power ratings should not fall heavily into your decision.

I am partial to the HAT midrange, although I have not heard the regular L3.

However, one crucial consideration should be midrange/tweeter crossover point. The midrange on the side you're sitting is 60 or more degrees off-axis which means you're affected by cone beaming and some of the higher frequencies just won't reach your ears directly. Therefore, you want to pass off the signal to the tweeters as low as possible. I don't know where you got those crossover figures but the Morel HO II from what I remember has a crossover point of around 2200 Hz which is as low as I've seen.

I personally would not go any higher than 3500 Hz (My Rainbow crossovers are 3400 Hz), and 5000 is definitely way too high for my liking.

Edit: Why are you not looking at Rainbow?
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Last edited by kaigoss69; 01-29-2013 at 09:05 PM.
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      01-29-2013, 10:07 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
DLS has launched DLS ultimate UP4 for BMW cars.

So considering above three drivers and DLS, I have put their specifications all together.


Now looking at these and considering that I will be powering my front mids at 75W @ 4 ohm xoverd HP @ 150Hz from Xd 600/6, which of these will work best?
DLS seems to be reading these forums... a lot.
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      01-29-2013, 11:10 PM   #11
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Any idea how much the new DLS UP4i are going to cost?
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      01-30-2013, 02:50 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcurley55 View Post
If you use an L3 within its intended range, it will handle much more than 50W. Scott has a JL HD750/1 on each of his L3SEs.
Simply impressive. Is there a link where I can read his build.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rcurley55 View Post
If I wanted a balance between SQ and SPL, I would never suggest a 150 Hz highpass on a 3" driver, either. The L3's will get loud, but you need to use them correctly.
What would be your HP point then?
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      01-30-2013, 02:53 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
You still have a crossover, it is your amp high-pass. The Hybrid will take 100W plus but it is a little smaller than the others, hence the 185Hz HP recommendation. Like has been said, power ratings should not fall heavily into your decision.

I am partial to the HAT midrange, although I have not heard the regular L3.

However, one crucial consideration should be midrange/tweeter crossover point. The midrange on the side you're sitting is 60 or more degrees off-axis which means you're affected by cone beaming and some of the higher frequencies just won't reach your ears directly. Therefore, you want to pass off the signal to the tweeters as low as possible. I don't know where you got those crossover figures but the Morel HO II from what I remember has a crossover point of around 2200 Hz which is as low as I've seen.

I personally would not go any higher than 3500 Hz (My Rainbow crossovers are 3400 Hz), and 5000 is definitely way too high for my liking.

Edit: Why are you not looking at Rainbow?
Kaigoss
Can I kindly ask, why did you change your legatia drivers?

I get you what you are saying on crossover points. Values have been taken from Morel's catalogue (where it gives you all details), and stand correct as per Morel's specifications.

One benefit of going active would be having more control on crossover points.


What Rainbows are you talking about?

I started this thread inclined toward L3 but after discussion with few others, I am getting inclined toward Morels.
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      01-30-2013, 02:55 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
DLS seems to be reading these forums... a lot.
Yet, they have not learned the lesson and reasons are;

1- 4 screw mountings on their woofer and not three.
2- overpriced!
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      01-30-2013, 02:58 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YOYO42 View Post
Any idea how much the new DLS UP4i are going to cost?


I've been told by UK distributor 339.99 including delivery.

Ouch!
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      01-30-2013, 07:06 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
Kaigoss
Can I kindly ask, why did you change your legatia drivers?

I get you what you are saying on crossover points. Values have been taken from Morel's catalogue (where it gives you all details), and stand correct as per Morel's specifications.

One benefit of going active would be having more control on crossover points.


What Rainbows are you talking about?

I started this thread inclied toward L3 but after discussion with few others, I am getting inclied toward Morels.
I didn't change the L3SEs, I'm using Rainbow Crossovers and tweeters. Look again, the x-over point of 5000 for the Morels is surely wrong!
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      01-30-2013, 07:30 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
I didn't change the L3SEs, I'm using Rainbow Crossovers and tweeters. Look again, the x-over point of 5000 for the Morels is surely wrong!
Sorry my bad!

Yes, the correct xover point is 1800Hz. I will update the snap shot later.

Kaigoss how much power is going to your Legatia SE?

Also, have you or anybody tried
Morels VS Legatia?

And if yes, which one are better considering SPL /SQ balance?

Thanks.
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      01-30-2013, 08:23 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
Sorry my bad!

Yes, the correct xover point is 1800Hz. I will update the snap shot later.

Kaigoss how much power is going to your Legatia SE?

Also, have you or anybody tried
Morels VS Legatia?

And if yes, which one are better considering SPL /SQ balance?

Thanks.
If you want to go all Hybrid, then you would need to choose between L1V2, and the L1 Pro tweeters. Problem is, the L1V2s are 3/4" and you need a high crossover point, and the L1 Pros are monsters that don't fit into the sails... Guess why I have the Rainbow tweeters?
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      01-30-2013, 08:24 AM   #19
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BTW, I would change out my tweeters and crossovers to the Morels in a heartbeat!
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      01-30-2013, 11:57 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makkan00 View Post
Simply impressive. Is there a link where I can read his build.
It's a lot of propaganda IMO, but Scott is one of only guys who will show the goods and how he prepares an install log:

http://nobodybeatshybrid.net/scott-buwalda/

Quote:
What would be your HP point then?
First I wouldn't put a 3" where a 4" would fit. If you are convinced you want the L3, start at 200 and see how it reacts. I just don't know why you would want to use an ultra wideband driver in this application.

FWIW, I have the 4" HO IIs in my E60 - they have been great off of a JL HD600/4 and off of an Arc 125.4 mini. The car got (what I would consider to be) stupid loud with the JL amps and a 200 Hz HP.
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      01-30-2013, 12:05 PM   #21
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Got the response from DLS and here it is:

Hi Sam,


Thank you for your email,

We expect first shipment of UP-4 to arrive first week of March, I will then test the x-max.

Fs raw (not broken in) 94Hz
Fs broken in 85Hz
Voice coil diameter 30mm

I good guess of the x-max would be 3 or 4mm one way.



Best regards

Peter Flodkvist/DLS
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      01-30-2013, 12:06 PM   #22
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So snapshot updated accordingly.
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