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      04-15-2013, 12:56 PM   #133
Alpina_B3_Lux
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doughboy View Post
At last - it's all here and I've got round to taking some pics.

New steel SMFW arrived and it's WAY heavier than the ally one that I returned, which is good from a noise perspective.

This is the SPEC non SAC full kit of FW and Clutch, not to be confused with the separately available OE compatible clutches and flywheels.

These full kits are lighter than the SPEC OE FW kits and have a lighter pressure plate too, and are way more powerful - this one is proven to 545lbft or 738nm!!!

I've had the hybrid stage2+/3 friction plate, Interestingly this has 1 side (FWside) with a single face kevlar lining and the other side is a 6-puck carbon semi-metallic plate.

This is supposed to give soft initial pickup using the organic pad then lock up with 6puck force as the clutch pressure increases.

Booked in at Darren Wood on Monday for fitment....
Looks good! Let us know how it goes and how it drives. There's someone not too far from me who has just had a similar setup installed in his 335i, so I'll hopefully be able to test drive one soon.

738 Nm is ok, but you can get there easily with upgraded turbos. On the dyno mine already pushed 720Nm with a beta map from PTF/COBB.

Has someone been able to find out whether one of their single mass FW works with an OEM style clutch (e.g. my HPF Feramic clutch)?

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      04-15-2013, 01:21 PM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux View Post
738 Nm is ok, but you can get there easily with upgraded turbos. On the dyno mine already pushed 720Nm with a beta map from PTF/COBB.
Yes, you're right, but I won't be getting near that for a while! I'm just FBO+Meth at present.

And the standard clutch is only rated at about 400nm or so?

I can upgrade to stage 3+ clutch rated at 671lbft / 909nm with just a new friction plate, as the pressure plate & FW is the same as stage 2+ / 3.

But you loose a chunk of road driveability with a lot less smooth engagement.
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      04-15-2013, 02:09 PM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux View Post
Looks good! Let us know how it goes and how it drives. There's someone not too far from me who has just had a similar setup installed in his 335i, so I'll hopefully be able to test drive one soon.

738 Nm is ok, but you can get there easily with upgraded turbos. On the dyno mine already pushed 720Nm with a beta map from PTF/COBB.

Has someone been able to find out whether one of their single mass FW works with an OEM style clutch (e.g. my HPF Feramic clutch)?

Alpina_B3_Lux
Mine welded to the single mass flywheel after just a week It worked but was so noisy and rattly whilst under load.

Just do what I'm doing and switch over to the Spec Steel SMFW and Stage 3+ setup. That one is rated to above 900nm.
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      04-15-2013, 03:04 PM   #136
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Idnan, are you sorted yet with a new setup?

Waiting for more packages from the US?
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      04-15-2013, 03:14 PM   #137
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Yup ordered it and I'm just patiently waiting for it arrive. Wanted UPS/Fedex but it had to come directly from Spec who were only willing to use USPS so it might be a bit longer. It will be installed the first weekend after it arrives. I've got it sussed now and should be done in about 5-6 hours which isn't bad for a DIY'er and no air tools. I have a plan this time which should hopefully speed it up a bit more.

I'm actually looking forward to it as my last two clutches have been really heavy and I've heard these Spec ones feel closer to OEM in terms of pedal pressure.
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      04-15-2013, 04:27 PM   #138
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Awesome mate, you are the DIY geezer!

Have you gone for a full SPEC kit this time i.e non SAC clutch and flywheel, instead of your previus mix and match methods?

I've read, and David at SPEC said to me, they have a much more factory like pedal force, but are WAY more powerful than the OE compatible versions that have a heavier pedal.

Darren Wood quoted me 3 hours, i'm in first thing on Monday, should be done by lunch time with any luck...
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      04-15-2013, 04:53 PM   #139
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Yep full spec stage 3+ with their steel SMFW and it is non-sac. Just hoping it is third time lucky for a decent clutch for my car.

If this fails I'm selling up and buying a Noble
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      04-22-2013, 08:34 AM   #140
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Doughboy - Still all set for the clutch to be done today?
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      04-22-2013, 08:54 AM   #141
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Ha yes, in Darren Woods now, 'box just going back on...

A few problems though, first the friction plate was labelled back to front, that wasted over an hour as the box wouldn't push home.

Second the splines are v tight, again the box wouldn't push home.

Third the box is so heavy it takes 3 of them to handle it. Mike says it's the heaviest manual he's handled.

Oh, it took 3 tonnes on the press to remove the flywheel bearing stub ... The instructions say to use a rubber mallet!!

Watch this space.
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      04-22-2013, 09:07 AM   #142
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Haha the box is stupidly heavy. We tried it with two of us but is wasn't happening and as you say, the splines are super tight.

Out of interest, did they change the pilot bearing inside of the gearbox?

Mine is being delivered tomorrow and fitted on the weekend.
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      04-22-2013, 09:18 AM   #143
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No, mainly because they've no idea how to get it out, and we're pushed for time.

It is in great condition, no signs of heating or wear, so left it.

Can't say the same for The original thrust bearing, dry and rattly with masses of play.
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      04-22-2013, 09:22 AM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doughboy View Post
No, mainly because they've no idea how to get it out, and we're pushed for time.

It is in great condition, no signs of heating or wear, so left it.

Can't say the same for The original thrust bearing, dry and rattly with masses of play.
Last person I know who did it welded a rod and pulled it out that way.

BTW UPS have just delivered my clutch, 60 customs charge
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      04-22-2013, 04:03 PM   #145
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Well, just got home after a long drive back (mega long way round, all A and B roads to nowhere)

Clutch feels good. Heavier pedal, but Ok.

Drive feels solid, good shifts, short engagement window makes for nice sharp shifts.

Revs a little quicker, nice downshift blips, as revs climbs it just feels solid and immediate, no WOT yet of course.

BUT, oh the noise, oh dear. I can't imagine what idnans was like with the ally one. Idle rattle is pretty bad, sounds like a diesel outside.

You can't hear it inside with a little bit of music on low, but music off you can and it is distracting.

In 3rd and above you can't really accelerate below 2k rpm as its resonates, you can let it run down to idle in gear though as normal when you slow down.

Its better driven harder TBH.

200 more miles tomorrow to Ross on Wye, so will report back.

Time to buy some extra thick 80w-140 grade gearbox oil for heavily loaded transmissions to shut it up..... seriously.

http://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-896-motu...osynthese.aspx


Thing is though, i don't see there's a viable alternative to a SMFW in the long term.

Last edited by doughboy; 04-22-2013 at 04:12 PM.
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      04-22-2013, 04:13 PM   #146
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I guess you need to break it in fully. How many miles do they recommend for this? Hopefully the noise will subside once its fully bedded down!
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      04-22-2013, 04:16 PM   #147
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Hold on, it vibrates with the steel FW in that rev range??? I don't mind the idle rattle as we can try raising it via INPA. The in gear rattle is so annoying and I ordered the steel SMFW for that reason.

I've bought the following gear oil combo for my car:

http://www.uucmotorwerks.com/html_te...nny_rattle.htm
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      04-23-2013, 04:31 AM   #148
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Yep, 140 grade oil will help a lot I reckon.

My worry is that we had to put the friction plate in the wrong way round as it seemed to be labeled wrong and wouldn't fit as marked.

But the plate springs work in both directions so it shouldn't matter?

Need to email SPEC to confirm.

Last edited by doughboy; 04-23-2013 at 09:31 AM.
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      04-23-2013, 09:39 AM   #149
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Few more miles today....

1) It's totally quiet when cold, which tell me it is gear oil viscosity dependant. No idle rattle for at least 15 minutes driving. Very little drivetrain noise, unless <1.5k in 4th or higher.

2) When hot the idle rattle is V bad, people pedestrians turn to look at you!. Also when hot the other drivetrain noises are worse, it all sounds 'looser', again viscosity dependant. The worst point is about 30mph in third, very common speed entering junctions or roundabouts, to fast for 2nd really, but in third you get a 'grrrrrrrr' from 1.8k to 2k then silence.

3) The worst booming noise is coming from my Quaife unit, if I turn my head I can hear it 'booming' in the boot area, so much so it sounds like exhaust boom.

I get two points of noise, a big booming vibration from the rear first, then a lighter zingy rattle from up front just after.

On a tiny gentle throttle it is OK, any more and as the load is taken up you get the vibration which seems to pass by 1800rpm, firm throttle gives less noise in fact.

I can only hope that a much thicker oil (in gearbox and diff) will help greatly to keep more gear separation and cut the noise.

I'm booked back in Woods for oil on Friday.... just have to choose some today...

Last edited by doughboy; 04-23-2013 at 09:45 AM.
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      04-23-2013, 09:57 AM   #150
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That's pretty much what I found with the Alu one. Are you getting Mike to adjust the idle via Autologic?

Are you planning on running 100% 140 weight gearbox oil?
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      04-23-2013, 10:02 AM   #151
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We'll try the idle on Friday.

I'm looking at 100% Motul 85w-140 for 'box and diff, I'm just not sure about the US forum mixture.
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      04-23-2013, 01:40 PM   #152
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Spoke to Opie, they say pure 75w-140 gear oil will ruin shifting action.

Told them about the US mix, he says it's worth a go, it seems like a half way house.

I'm going for the 'california' mix with MT90 as mines rattling like a bag of spanners.

That plus pure 75-140 hypoid GL5 in the diff.

If this doesn't fix the noise to an acceptable level, then I think it's curtains for this mod for me, it's just too much of a compromise for the 25% 'family duty' that the car has to do

Last edited by doughboy; 04-24-2013 at 04:15 AM.
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      04-25-2013, 09:57 AM   #153
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What would you do instead?

Go OEM DMF and compatible Spec Stage 2+
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      04-25-2013, 09:59 AM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doughboy View Post
If this doesn't fix the noise to an acceptable level, then I think it's curtains for this mod for me, it's just too much of a compromise for the 25% 'family duty' that the car has to do
Seriously? You thinking of going back to the OEM DMFW? I found that I started to change the way I drove to stop it from making the noise.
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