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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N55 Turbo Engine Tuning and Exhaust Modifications - 335i Tuning > VTT N55 DBB Stage 2 update



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      06-16-2014, 06:18 PM   #45
1cleann55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loesch View Post
I just can't trust a turbo lesson from someone that uses commas instead of periods and constantly acts like a 12 year old. Sorry. haha.
Because of vargas a mid 11 sec n55 exists and is owned by terry who makes jb4 which im 100% sure you have.. the guy has proven his point by that alone. Im not trying to start beef but why would anyone want to ban the only guy that probably actually gives a hoot about the N55 community because of his punctuation ..so far he has the DBB turbo out and is in the making of a JB stage 2 and stage 1 turbo. Personally Im the kind of person that is visually persuaded and by what DR N55 puts out im definitely persuaded that he knows his ish..
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      06-16-2014, 06:50 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1cleann55 View Post
Because of vargas a mid 11 sec n55 exists and is owned by terry who makes jb4 which im 100% sure you have.. the guy has proven his point by that alone. Im not trying to start beef but why would anyone want to ban the only guy that probably actually gives a hoot about the N55 community because of his punctuation ..so far he has the DBB turbo out and is in the making of a JB stage 2 and stage 1 turbo. Personally Im the kind of person that is visually persuaded and by what DR N55 puts out im definitely persuaded that he knows his ish..
No beef. I understand your point.
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      06-16-2014, 08:14 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1cleann55 View Post
Because of vargas a mid 11 sec n55 exists and is owned by terry who makes jb4 which im 100% sure you have.. the guy has proven his point by that alone. Im not trying to start beef but why would anyone want to ban the only guy that probably actually gives a hoot about the N55 community because of his punctuation ..so far he has the DBB turbo out and is in the making of a JB stage 2 and stage 1 turbo. Personally Im the kind of person that is visually persuaded and by what DR N55 puts out im definitely persuaded that he knows his ish..
Finally some logic, I'll never understand some people man smh.
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      06-16-2014, 09:05 PM   #48
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You may not like the way he communicates but the turbos work. I am tuning mine on normal pump petrol first, and even though Tony says there is no point to doing so, it feels a lot faster than the stock turbo maxed out on an ethanol mix and pulls a lot nicer all the way to redline.
Will update when I have numbers and when the e85 tune is done.
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      06-17-2014, 09:07 AM   #49
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Nugget - Please keep us in the loop. I think you will find some gains on pump too and of course it will pull to redline like you mention. I would love to see some more numbers besides the ones from BMS.
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      06-17-2014, 10:08 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugget View Post
You may not like the way he communicates but the turbos work. I am tuning mine on normal pump petrol first, and even though Tony says there is no point to doing so, it feels a lot faster than the stock turbo maxed out on an ethanol mix and pulls a lot nicer all the way to redline.
Will update when I have numbers and when the e85 tune is done.
Awesome! Looking forward to your results. Are you tuning it with both JB4 and Cobb?
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      06-17-2014, 07:49 PM   #51
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Cobb only, tuning is being done by PTF.
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      06-18-2014, 02:04 PM   #52
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Vargas and BMS had their little go back and forth, both were in the wrong, both kissed and made up and everythign is fine now.

A handful of posters come in and shit on any thread he starts or posts in to this day claiming they do not like the way he 'speaks to his customers/potential customers' when they are talking about something that happened now ages ago and in no way in the current thread is he talking down to anyone.

Grow up people. Let it go. If Terry can, you certainly can.
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      06-24-2014, 09:53 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugget View Post
Cobb only, tuning is being done by PTF.
I know Vargas seemed to be more excited about what PTF can do versus piggyback tunes. I'm very curious!! Per all the customer reviews, they all seem great!

In regards to Bell77, I agree. Tony has come leaps and bounds on responding professionally. Past is what it is and he does seem excited, interested and an advocate to increase the n55 platform. The rest of you need to stop bitching and ignore the posts if you do not support VTT. Easy.
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      06-24-2014, 09:55 PM   #54
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As they say in the corporate world: take fact over emotion.

Especially for the trolls
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      06-26-2014, 10:57 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vargasturbotech View Post
No sir it is not a bull statement at all. It has nothing to do with fuel flow, the injectors can actually supply enough fuel to support well over 1000WHP, does that anything to do with what you can make? Of course it does not it has to do with how much you can support if are running enough octane to support those power levels, if you do not have the octane you cannot make the power, you turn up the boost, and timing to take advantage of the bigger turbos and on 91 you detonate and the car will just pull the timing and boost you just put in to protect itself. This is not a new theory, every single platform on earth has the same limits, the N54/55 can actually make more power on pump due to its direct injection. But the statement the injectors can provide enough fuel is completely wrong. Now lets move on the very obvious lack of turbocharger understanding here, sure when pushing a very small turbo very hard, the air indeed does get heated up quickly making the it much less dense meaning you can make less power from it, this is why we run upgraded intercooler to cool this charge and also why meth will net you much more power, not only does meth bump up the octane rating of whatever fuel you are running, it also cools the intake charge or the air coming from the turbo making it possible to again run more timing and boost, and in turn make more power. The reason the stock turbos runs out of breath up top is because the small turbine wheel gets choked down with back pressure, this ends the fun as if you can't move exhaust flow efficiently past the turbine you can make no more power. We do appreciate the post, but it flys in the face of very common turbocharger / and thermal dynamic knowledge. I hope this explanation will help people understand why you cannot make a lot of power on crappy 91 pump gas with a woefully undersized stock turbo. We tell the same thing to people on the N54 who want to run pump and upgrade to stage 2, either run meth, or run E85 because on pump you are wasting your money on the upgrade.
Sooooooo if the end outcome of every turbo vendor, on this site, that the stock turbo runs out of breath because the exhaust back pressure is causing the turbo to run out of breath, would it not make more sense to make a new exhaust header setup for the stocker and see what it can actually do?

I just don't see any sense in spending $3500 for a turbo that just gets put back in the same thing that is causing the issue.

I'm more than positive and can bet my car on it that you can make a custom exhaust header + downpipe to work with the stock that will improve its capability and even a bigger turbo for that same custom exhaust header for UNDER $3500.

But please...... prove me wrong there.

Seems like PTF has the right idea and are brewing something good for us N55 owners.
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      06-26-2014, 11:08 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trixdout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vargasturbotech View Post
No sir it is not a bull statement at all. It has nothing to do with fuel flow, the injectors can actually supply enough fuel to support well over 1000WHP, does that anything to do with what you can make? Of course it does not it has to do with how much you can support if are running enough octane to support those power levels, if you do not have the octane you cannot make the power, you turn up the boost, and timing to take advantage of the bigger turbos and on 91 you detonate and the car will just pull the timing and boost you just put in to protect itself. This is not a new theory, every single platform on earth has the same limits, the N54/55 can actually make more power on pump due to its direct injection. But the statement the injectors can provide enough fuel is completely wrong. Now lets move on the very obvious lack of turbocharger understanding here, sure when pushing a very small turbo very hard, the air indeed does get heated up quickly making the it much less dense meaning you can make less power from it, this is why we run upgraded intercooler to cool this charge and also why meth will net you much more power, not only does meth bump up the octane rating of whatever fuel you are running, it also cools the intake charge or the air coming from the turbo making it possible to again run more timing and boost, and in turn make more power. The reason the stock turbos runs out of breath up top is because the small turbine wheel gets choked down with back pressure, this ends the fun as if you can't move exhaust flow efficiently past the turbine you can make no more power. We do appreciate the post, but it flys in the face of very common turbocharger / and thermal dynamic knowledge. I hope this explanation will help people understand why you cannot make a lot of power on crappy 91 pump gas with a woefully undersized stock turbo. We tell the same thing to people on the N54 who want to run pump and upgrade to stage 2, either run meth, or run E85 because on pump you are wasting your money on the upgrade.
Sooooooo if the end outcome of every turbo vendor, on this site, that the stock turbo runs out of breath because the exhaust back pressure is causing the turbo to run out of breath, would it not make more sense to make a new exhaust header setup for the stocker and see what it can actually do?

I just don't see any sense in spending $3500 for a turbo that just gets put back in the same thing that is causing the issue.

I'm more than positive and can bet my car on it that you can make a custom exhaust header + downpipe to work with the stock that will improve its capability and even a bigger turbo for that same custom exhaust header for UNDER $3500.

But please...... prove me wrong there.

Seems like PTF has the right idea and are brewing something good for us N55 owners.
The biggest restriction is the stock turbine wheel, its is pretty small and gets choked up top farily quickly. The stock turbine housing is actually not too terrible. So going with a Stage 2 set up the turbine wheel we use is significantly larger than the stock turbine, this opens up quite a bit of flow up top. So now with proper fueling and tuning, you actually can find the limits of the stockk housing which on pump / race and meth, seems to be right around the 475-500 range, once we get a HPFP upgrade done for the N55 and you can run 100% E85 and tune for it, I am sure we willl see over 500WHP. So bottom line stage 1, you are still looking at the limits of the stock turbine. With a stage 2 you increase those limits by quite a bit, by allowing much more exhaust flow before it backs up. I hope that helps. Also our vendorship has slipped, I just need to go pay the monthly fee again which I will tonight, I wish it would I could set up auto pay.
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      06-27-2014, 01:34 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JETmn View Post
Nugget - Please keep us in the loop. I think you will find some gains on pump too and of course it will pull to redline like you mention. I would love to see some more numbers besides the ones from BMS.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MNick View Post
Awesome! Looking forward to your results. Are you tuning it with both JB4 and Cobb?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iuhutch View Post
As they say in the corporate world: take fact over emotion.

Especially for the trolls
Did a dyno on my pump gas map.
Details are here.
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      06-27-2014, 02:12 AM   #58
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Looking good!
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      06-27-2014, 04:39 AM   #59
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Thanks, power curve is a lot more enjoyable this way. It's no longer just a huge lump of mid range torque that quickly dies off.
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      06-27-2014, 11:03 AM   #60
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Looks good so far! Still falls off hard at 6500, but that isn't far from redline. I could handle that. Looking forward to some E85 numbers!
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      06-27-2014, 07:52 PM   #61
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If you look at the log
http://datazap.me/u/nugs/ptf-vtt2-st...9&zoom=296-410
Boost doesn't actually drop off that badly after 6500rpm (from 14.2 to 13psi at redline), but PTF has tapered the timing for some reason (from 5 down to 2).
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      06-27-2014, 08:04 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugget
If you look at the log
http://datazap.me/u/nugs/ptf-vtt2-st...9&zoom=296-410
Boost doesn't actually drop off that badly after 6500rpm (from 14.2 to 13psi at redline), but PTF has tapered the timing for some reason (from 5 down to 2).
This is a conservative tune Dzenno made for you to run on pump. There is SO much room left on better octane and meth. The thing is going to scream...
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      06-28-2014, 02:12 PM   #63
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Whats the current wait time for the journal bearing option? Thanks
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      06-28-2014, 04:59 PM   #64
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http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1003520
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      11-04-2014, 05:52 PM   #65
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Hi tony, I saw you bragging in robs n54 stage 3 thread on the other forum that the limit of your n55 upgrade wasnt 475whp at all and his turbo knowledge was shit. However, I cant find any info of your turbos making any more horsepower than terrys first 469 log from 9 months ago. Can you let us in on the secret?
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      11-04-2014, 06:12 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curare86 View Post
Hi tony, I saw you bragging in robs n54 stage 3 thread on the other forum that the limit of your n55 upgrade wasnt 475whp at all and his turbo knowledge was shit. However, I cant find any info of your turbos making any more horsepower than terrys first 469 log from 9 months ago. Can you let us in on the secret?
Actually Terry made 477whp it's just probably dug deep into the forum you'll have to dig deep to find it
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