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      02-07-2008, 02:56 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by jdink View Post
It may be the Clutch Delav Valve (CDV) that is giving you the hesitation.

Also, I was concerned that the "hicups" I was feeling sometimes when i shifted from 1-2 or 2-3 were from either the CDV or just my bad manual driving abilities but my friend was saying when he drove my car that it may be the turbos kicking in. I know this isn't a "Turbo" thread, but it may be beneficial if someone could explain this so people would know what aspects of their driving (smoothness of shifts) is due to their manual driving abilities, and what can be attributed to other factors.
they have someone else drive their car

no seriously, i had a coworker with a Evo, his tranny used to like jolt when he shifts. he's like yah my clutch is F'd up.

one day i let him drive my G35, and the same behavior happened. so im like IT'S YOU BRO!!
i drove his car and just drove nicely hahaha
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      02-07-2008, 02:58 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mantis View Post
i think that's what's called dumping the clutch. it will wear your clutch, u'll have slippage soon. you're basically driving your car hard.

I have no idea which RPM's are bad for the 335, i'd imagine 2k and above are a lot of torque! I havent gotten my 6MT yet

someone else can chime in here.
Ok good..yea I really don't ever do that but, once in a while it's fun.
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      02-07-2008, 03:01 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mantis View Post
they have someone else drive their car

no seriously, i had a coworker with a Evo, his tranny used to like jolt when he shifts. he's like yah my clutch is F'd up.

one day i let him drive my G35, and the same behavior happened. so im like IT'S YOU BRO!!
i drove his car and just drove nicely hahaha
Haha that's hilarious! your co-worker!
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      02-07-2008, 03:01 PM   #48
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oh i plan on killing my clutch once the car comes
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      02-07-2008, 03:15 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by checuervo View Post
What if it's a pretty significant rev jump: from 6th to 4th or even to 3rd maybe? Will the internal synchro's still be fine?

From that M5 training vid, the guy seemed to agree with you that you really don't NEED to double-clutch in normal down shifting, but he did seem to imply that there was some minor benefit.
Like Welshman said, I don't think there is a huge need to double-clutch with today's cars. Rev-matching is more then enough for just about everyone. Most drivers can't even do that correctly.

Someone correct me if I'm messing this up; but double clutching gets both your engine and flywheel to the correct RPM. So sure there's a benefit to it, but I don't know if it's significant enough to warrant doing this every time.
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      02-07-2008, 03:16 PM   #50
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Quote:
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oh i plan on killing my clutch once the car comes
let me help you with that, I have over 50K experiences so far
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      02-07-2008, 03:18 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by nmulax View Post
Like Welshman said, I don't think there is a huge need to double-clutch with today's cars. Rev-matching is more then enough for just about everyone. Most drivers can't even do that correctly.

Someone correct me if I'm messing this up; but double clutching gets both your engine and flywheel to the correct RPM. So sure there's a benefit to it, but I don't know if it's significant enough to warrant doing this every time.
EXACTLY!!! if you do not double clutch, and do not blip in neutral where clutch is not depressed the flywheel wont be synch'd. ur synchro's have to do it. that's their job, but that is wear/tear
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      02-07-2008, 03:19 PM   #52
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let me help you with that, I have over 50K experiences so far
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      02-07-2008, 03:21 PM   #53
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Some of the explanations in this link helped me:
http://waycoolinc.com/z3/essentials/...e/shifting.htm
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      02-07-2008, 03:21 PM   #54
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EXACTLY!!! if you do not double clutch, and do not blip in neutral where clutch is not depressed the flywheel wont be synch'd. ur synchro's have to do it. that's their job, but that is wear/tear
Yeah, considering how much I have to think about it when trying to double-clutch and how long it takes (don't have it down to a natural reaction like single-clutching), I tend to stick to a single-clutch.
I figure I'm still doing better and putting less wear on my synchros then most MT drivers out there, and that if their cars are still running, mine is in great shape.
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      02-07-2008, 03:25 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by status38 View Post
Some of the explanations in this link helped me:
http://waycoolinc.com/z3/essentials/...e/shifting.htm
yah that's very good. i read that last year

Quote:
Originally Posted by nmulax View Post
Yeah, considering how much I have to think about it when trying to double-clutch and how long it takes (don't have it down to a natural reaction like single-clutching), I tend to stick to a single-clutch.
I figure I'm still doing better and putting less wear on my synchros then most MT drivers out there, and that if their cars are still running, mine is in great shape.
well... try doing it slowly... it can take u like 5 seconds to complete the operation first, then all of a sudden it'll be done in split second before u know it
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      02-07-2008, 03:29 PM   #56
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My next car is going to be manual, no question about it. However, I do not want to learn on a brand new high-end car. Since nobody rents manual cars anymore, nor do I want to ask any of my friends with manuals (they are all relatively high-end) to let me learn on their cars, I came up with this plan. Sometime before I buy my car, I am going to buy a POS Honda or something for a few hundred bucks. In Ontario we have 10-day permits you can buy for like $15. You can buy a maximum of two without registering the car, so 20 days in total. Practice on the beater for up to 20 days, without having to register it, get a safety check or emission test done. My current insurance will cover any new car I buy for up to 30 days or when I register it. 20 days should be sufficient to gain enough confidence/skill not to fuck up a new tranny. It also doubles as a means of getting around in between any potential sale of the old car date and delivery of the new car. Finally, when there is only like 1 day left on the permit drive it into a junk yard and potentially recover a significant part of your initial expense. Bonus if you can get a friend to go in on one with you.
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      02-07-2008, 03:31 PM   #57
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This thread is so addictive...now has any of you ride your clutch while reversing out of your driveway?
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      02-07-2008, 03:33 PM   #58
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Quote:
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My next car is going to be manual, no question about it. However, I do not want to learn on a brand new high-end car. Since nobody rents manual cars anymore, nor do I want to ask any of my friends with manuals (they are all relatively high-end) to let me learn on their cars, I came up with this plan. Sometime before I buy my car, I am going to buy a POS Honda or something for a few hundred bucks. In Ontario we have 10-day permits you can buy for like $15. You can buy a maximum of two without registering the car, so 20 days in total. Practice on the beater for up to 20 days, without having to register it, get a safety check or emission test done. My current insurance will cover any new car I buy for up to 30 days or when I register it. 20 days should be sufficient to gain enough confidence/skill not to fuck up a new tranny. It also doubles as a means of getting around in between any potential sale of the old car date and delivery of the new car. Finally, when there is only like 1 day left on the permit drive it into a junk yard and potentially recover a significant part of your initial expense. Bonus if you can get a friend to go in on one with you.
a tad but hopefully this thread will help you with your experience
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      02-07-2008, 03:34 PM   #59
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This thread is so addictive...now has any of you ride your clutch while reversing out of your driveway?
oh i do all the time... it's at slow speed and very brief... it cant be that bad

flame suit on haha
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      02-07-2008, 03:37 PM   #60
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Quote:
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oh i do all the time... it's at slow speed and very brief... it cant be that bad

flame suit on haha
Yea same here- I ride the clutch all the time in reverse- it's only during the very short distance when backing into the street from my driveway...
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      02-07-2008, 03:41 PM   #61
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I do believed that all of our driveway has a slight slope. I only use reverse to get out of the garage itself. Reverse is so nerve racking for me somehow. Here is my technique on reverse . Put it in reverse, ride clutch while reversing (very short brief second), stopped when I am out of the garage and have cleared my garage door, pop into neutral, close the garage door, and let gravity take over until I am on the street and then put in first gear and off I go.
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      02-07-2008, 03:42 PM   #62
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Let clear some things up:

- RIDING the clutch does NOT mean letting the clutch out slowly! It means you're resting your left foot on the clutch pedal whilst driving instead of on the foot rest as you should.

- The FLYWHEEL is bolted to the crankshaft and therefore is ALWAYS spinning at the same RPM as the engine.
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      02-07-2008, 03:42 PM   #63
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- To FEATHER or SLIP means letting the clutch up only a little bit to get only a little bit of movement.
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      02-07-2008, 03:48 PM   #64
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you really don't have to worry about feathering the clutch (or what people consider riding the clutch now) for short periods of time at low rpms (like while reversing, in traffic)
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      02-07-2008, 03:48 PM   #65
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Quote:
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Yea same here- I ride the clutch all the time in reverse- it's only during the very short distance when backing into the street from my driveway...
Great thread.

I'm in the process of learning to drive a manual trying to make my mind up between step and stick on my 335i order. Unfortunately, Seattle's hills make a stick more of an issue that it otherwise would be. Had a series of stalls on a hill yesterday afternoon that was brutally embarrassing and seemed to last forever. I can still remember the look on the woman's face who was sitting in a different car waiting for me to get up the hill. UGH!

While hill starts and regular driving are getting manageable at this point, I seriously have not been able to get the car in reverse without stalling it. Fear I guess is that I'm going to go flying backwards if I give the car too much gas. I can't modulate the speed properly so I react by not giving the car enough gas, resulting in a stall.

I take it that what I should be doing is only partially letting go of the clutch?
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      02-07-2008, 03:50 PM   #66
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Ok... So i just got back from my lunch break, which i spent driving around instead of eating and came up with the following observations about driving my new 335 6MT

When I do a slow start if i do not feather the clutch until about 3000 RPM then I get a jerky like motion. If i start faster and keep an adding preasure to the gas at an increasing rate I do not have to feather as much and it is much more smooth. Using this second type of start I reach a much higher RPM and probably eat up a lot more gas.

Downshifting is very jerky if i do not rev match (the RPM falls off very quickly). In order to get a smooth downshift I can either

a) 1. Press in the clutch 2. rev engine 3. downshift 4. Depress Cluch

or

b) 1. Press in the cluch 2. shift into neutral 3. rev engine 4. shift into the lower gear 5. depress clutch.

Option a is faster, but is there any benefit do doing option b? (i guess option c would be to do the double clutch, but that seems unnecessary per previous posts)

Another observation is when I come to a stop. Typically i find myself shifting into neutral, holding in the cluch all the way and breaking. I find it to be the smoothest way to come to a stop. Downshifting at low speeds with rev matching while coming to a stop seems counter productive (since you arn't trying to speed up). Also, if suddenly the light turns green before i come to a complete stop, or have just stopped, I shift from neutral into second to start.

Does anyone have a good technique for driving at low speeds? I realized last night when I let my friend drive my car (he drives a m3 so i trusted him) that sitting in the passanger seat is scary as heck, and i can't even imagine what it is like if a) you havent driven with someone before and b) don't trust a cars handling...esp in rainy washington I guess feathering is a must, but whats a good way to avoid jerky movements in downshifting without rev matching?
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