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      05-23-2008, 01:45 PM   #1
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So Frustrating!!

Hello all UK E90'ers


Had my car booked into Halliwell Jones in warrington for a Progman update at there request from a previous visit, they said they would need the car for two days as it could take that long. Wasn't really a problem as they provided a loan car for the two days..which was nice

The faults are well known for my version of software/age of car etc..

Car has Pro Nav, the faults are..

No pop up arrows on split screen
Cd Running on and not remembering track position etc
Plus a multitude of glitches, delayed idrive start up, haptic function etc etc....

Gave them a call on day one to check progress, they told me car was on coding and should be ready for tomorrow...good news

When i arrived to pick up the car on the second day, they said they didn't have to do the Progman update as they sorted out the fault? Which of course they didn't!

All they did was switch on the arrows in the nav menu for full screen display. I explained that 'i know how to switch on the arrows' and that the fault i reported was not the one they diagnosed!

I then produced the SIB pdf file, which was stored on my phone (complements of E90 POST), which explains all the faults rectified by the PROGMAN update v25+...it was at this point he looked confused and asked how i was in possession of said document, and that it was BMW material etc etc...copyright bull,blah blah...

I explained that that was irrelevant and what was relevant was the fact that they had had my car for 2 days and not sorted out the updated software which would fix all the listed problems!

They then asked for my phone to show the SIB to some random in guy the workshop.

10 mins later he came back with the random guy who took great pleasure in telling me 'this SIB is from the US and not validin the UK!', i said ok, but, what about my faulty iDrive? He replyed with 'i'm not aware of all your problems with your car as i didn't work on it', and with that disapeared into the back again, cheers!!

It was at this point there was silence....the service guy looked at me....i looked at him.

I thanked him for storing my car for two days and switching the Nav into arrow view for me and departed! I also thanked him for covering the wheels in tyre black (which i asked them not to do) which was sprayed all down the side of my silver car by the time i got home!

Am i in the wrong here? should i be requesting an update for the faults on my £36k car? Am i expecting to much from a BMW franchise or is it just that this particular one is below par? your thoughts appreciated, and would be interested in others who have had the PROGMAN update succesfully and what symptoms they had which qualified the update.

Also, anyone recommend a good BMW franchise in the North west?

Cheers for reading...Andy
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      05-23-2008, 03:24 PM   #2
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You're not alone in your frustration, Andy. I've gone through it as well.

In fact, the SIBs are very valid in the UK, as well as the rest of the world. Certain market-specific inclusions will be made apparent within the SIB titles & within the SIBs themselves.

I did foresee the potential for ignorance of the BMW USA SIB printouts by BMW UK dealerships, so 'UK' SIBS can be made to be available.
I also had a member of the service department ask me where I got the SIB information from. 'None of your business. Have you never heard of the Human Rights Act & Freedom of Information?' I said to him. The look on his face- priceless.

From my own experience of Progman updates, I now always provide a printed copy of any SIBs I expect to be carried out by a dealership, before any work is started & before I leave. I then ask them to tell me exactly what update they are going to carry out & the reason for doing so. The service technicians do look a little bit 'scared' when I stare at them, waiting for their reply, but I've never yet had a problem in doing so.
I've even got to know the technicians by name, so I now ask to see a particular technician if I need a particular job to be carried out.

Perhaps you could just write down the SIB number(s) & details & get them to download the information, before you book the car in, agree on a plan of action over the phone & then book the car in? I'd give the same dealership another chance. Go elsewhere if they do the same again.

Attached is a 'UK friendly' SIB846106 for you, Andy. It should be sufficient to have your Progman updated to the latest V29 version.

All the best.

Viv
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      05-23-2008, 04:06 PM   #3
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Andy that is shocking.

Viv's advice is good if you want to go back to Halliwell

But I would ring a few dealers up and quote the SIB reference. If they know about they will tell you what it covers (just act dumb and prompt them if needed). If they have no idea what you are on about try the next stealer.

As a last resort contact BMW UK to refer you to a stealer who can carry out the SIB. I have found the hotline useful when emailing the CEO in Germany and emailing customer services and anyone who is tasked with handling the response from the German CEO in the UK. As the CEO will ask many questions why he is getting email's that shouldn't be heading his/her way. I have done this with a few companies and got results.

My new stealer has been great by showing me what is being done and why to my car. My old stealer gave me the crap that you had from Halliwell Jones.
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      05-23-2008, 04:08 PM   #4
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Anygreg

I've used Williams in Bolton in the past when I had an E60 which needed an update so it could play MP3s on the CD Drive. Expecting hassle I took in a printout of the SIB or whatever it was called. They took away the document and a head tecchie guy came back and asked me where I had got it as the numbers didn't match the UK numbers. I told him I got it off the internet and that you can get any information if you know where to look. He agreed to take the car in and do the progman. I picked the car up the following day and it worked fine.

As a matter of interest how old is your car? I have recently purchased a March 07 330d SE which has never been near a dealer and I am wondering what the latest s/w wll give me that the March 07 version won't have.

I've used other dealers also when I wanted my e60 updated - just told them that the display kept going off and reappearing and was very disconcerting.

Tony
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Last edited by tmarshall57; 05-23-2008 at 04:10 PM. Reason: typo
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      05-24-2008, 06:54 AM   #5
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How nice you all are....

If only BMW dealerships were as helpfull as you guy's Cheers, for this, really appreciate it.
As you can imagine, i was pretty P1ssed yeaterday when picking the car up...i even took my dad with me for him to sample the BMW experience (i was expecting it to be a good one) it was pretty embarrasing for me, and i suppose for him as well, having to witness his son arguing the toss with some spotty faced kid on the front desk, who was daft as a brush! Sorry dad...BM's are still really good

I think what got my back up the most was the, 'treat you like an idiot mode' which is engaged when you walk through the door by the front desk droid, why? One would assume that some one who buys into such a brand (this is my car not a company motor) knows about quality etc which should also suggest that they also like/appreciate quality of service too! Not suggesting that this should only be applicable to BMW's, but think that this is a sign of the overall problem with the UK's service industry on a whole..lets not get onto that one though hey :0 moving swiftly on

In response to taking it back...there were a few other things that hppened which i failed to include yeaterday in my post, as i didn't want to come across as a moaning bar steward, but...as you ask....

Loan car had half a conifer in the back ( 57 plate 320i series touring) was filthy throughout...totaly abused and had 15 miles of juice in the tank, on complaining, the manager said 'looks like someone has taken there junk to the tip' my immediate response was 'No, looks like the car hasn't been checked and valeted since its return!' D1ck!

Obviously, the tyre blacking gel down both sides of the car (this really annoyed me as i'd spent days claying/polishing/sealing and collinite waxing the bugger ...but what really p1ssed me of was the oil on the drivers side mat! big dirty boot print! made me so mad!

I actually went up there yesterday and got them to clean all the crap of the tyres/car and mats! looked for the manager peter, but he hid somewhere and wouldn't see me! What was funny was the front desk numptey drove the car round the back to get cleaned, then re-appeared in my car 10 mins later, when he got out i noticed he'd switched the arrow view back on on my nav...he then took great pleasure in pointing it out 'look' he said ' i've sorted your arrow thing out for you!' how good was he then came the pausing stare and silence, he had a slight puppy dog look about him like he'd done good, like he'd brought me the sunday paper...'wtf' i thought..the little fcuk-er just sh1t on the carpet!


My opinion is, the money these guys charge, they get no second chances, smaller garages charging 1/2 the price get the basics right, like using floor mats! and fixing problems...so frustrating

anyway rant over (for now)...

Cheers for the SIB Viv....much appreciated (have been reading E90post for some time now, and do respect your opinion on things! thanks for the advice, will get it printed out.

Sherkhan, did call a few, spoke to David Holmes stockport, guy there said 'no problem, we'll look for the faults but if we can't replicate them, i'm sure we'll find something that will allow us to do this under warranty!' how cool was he

tmarshall57...car is a manual 2006 model..will bear the 'intermitent screen turning off problem'...love intermitent problems

Last edited by Anygreg; 05-25-2008 at 04:16 PM.
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      06-10-2008, 09:36 AM   #6
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DEALER UPDATE.....


Car was in at David Holmes - stockport, what can i say...chalk from cheese?

Really impressed with the level of service and attention to detail, with a 'can do' attitude, was really refreshing.

The sorted out the Progman update, replaced the BMW wheel centre logos which were blistering, Are replacing the M-Sport door sills which are coroding from underneath, also replacing the drivers side inside door panel for handle wear and to top it all (which i am really chuffed about) replacing the drivers seat top leather section for premature bolster where!! How happy am I

Just goes to show that shopping around really pays, and to take no Sh1t from below par dealers!

Admins, think we need a name and shame sticky on here...Halliwell Jones warrington should be top of the list !!
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      06-10-2008, 10:32 AM   #7
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Great news Andy, glad you got it sorted in the end and have found a good quality dealership for your future needs.
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      06-10-2008, 11:01 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekk View Post
You're not alone in your frustration, Andy. I've gone through it as well.

In fact, the SIBs are very valid in the UK, as well as the rest of the world. Certain market-specific inclusions will be made apparent within the SIB titles & within the SIBs themselves.

I did foresee the potential for ignorance of the BMW USA SIB printouts by BMW UK dealerships, so 'UK' SIBS can be made to be available.
I also had a member of the service department ask me where I got the SIB information from. 'None of your business. Have you never heard of the Human Rights Act & Freedom of Information?' I said to him. The look on his face- priceless.

From my own experience of Progman updates, I now always provide a printed copy of any SIBs I expect to be carried out by a dealership, before any work is started & before I leave. I then ask them to tell me exactly what update they are going to carry out & the reason for doing so. The service technicians do look a little bit 'scared' when I stare at them, waiting for their reply, but I've never yet had a problem in doing so.
I've even got to know the technicians by name, so I now ask to see a particular technician if I need a particular job to be carried out.

Perhaps you could just write down the SIB number(s) & details & get them to download the information, before you book the car in, agree on a plan of action over the phone & then book the car in? I'd give the same dealership another chance. Go elsewhere if they do the same again.

Attached is a 'UK friendly' SIB846106 for you, Andy. It should be sufficient to have your Progman updated to the latest V29 version.

All the best.

Viv

Hi Viv,

You havent got the SIB for this have you ? http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=147958

In English will be fine no need for Español
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      06-10-2008, 11:40 AM   #9
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Well chuffed for you fella 100% agree why should you accept crap work after paying top dollar .Well done and yes complain to bmw uk customer service
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      06-10-2008, 01:25 PM   #10
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Glad its sorted - best advice is to get to know someone who's actually working on the car...haven't managed it yet with the Beemer but always speak direct to the techy for any work on out Treg.. He usually sorts me out something nice to drive too, instead of a Lupo/Polo!!!
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      06-10-2008, 01:27 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anygreg View Post
I think what got my back up the most was the, 'treat you like an idiot mode' which is engaged when you walk through the door by the front desk droid, why
I've always wondered about this, is it actually company policy to make you feel uncomfortable, unwelcome, and - if at all possible - about 2 feet tall? I sometimes honestly do begin to wonder if these people have some sort of personal vendetta against me, or maybe I have 'Clueless No-Mark' tattooed on my forehead?

As for Halliwell, I had a run-in with those t***ers at the weekend, they wouldn't arrange a test-drive for me unless I agreed to "sit down and go through all the figures first", and said they "don't do willy nilly test drives". Well, you better f**king start, mate, because the way the economy is shaping up you'll be out on the streets soon offering a b*** job to anyone who'll come into your strip-lit sh**hole of a showroom.... (Please be careful with your language regarding dealerships, FM- they do actually read some of the threads! Viv)
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      06-10-2008, 02:18 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anygreg View Post
DEALER UPDATE.....


Car was in at David Holmes - stockport, what can i say...chalk from cheese?..

Admins, think we need a name and shame sticky on here...Halliwell Jones warrington should be top of the list !!
Glad you've found a dealer you're happy with, Andy.

As for 'naming & shaming' dealerships, have a look here.

All the best.


Viv
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      06-10-2008, 03:02 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FieldingMellish View Post
(Please be careful with your language regarding dealerships, FM- they do actually read some of the threads! Viv)
Heh. Ok, point taken, Viv, but on the other hand, who was this (in that dealers thread you linked to above) not so long ago:

"1 Preston Hall in Stockton-on-Tees are a bunch of f*cking dipsh*ts :mad:"

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      06-10-2008, 03:22 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FieldingMellish View Post
Heh. Ok, point taken, Viv, but on the other hand, who was this (in that dealers thread you linked to above) not so long ago:

"1 Preston Hall in Stockton-on-Tees are a bunch of f*cking dipsh*ts :mad:"

It was actually you I was trying to protect, FM.

I know that Preston Hall are truly a complete bunch of f*cking dipsh*ts & I'm not afraid of saying so, despite what they'll have their prospective customers believe.
Also, I couldn't give a flying f**k what they think about what I've got to say about them.

However, other members may say something they could potentially regret at some point in the future, so it was for that reason I made the edit to your post.

All the best.

Viv
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      06-10-2008, 04:53 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FieldingMellish View Post
I've always wondered about this, is it actually company policy to make you feel uncomfortable, unwelcome, and - if at all possible - about 2 feet tall? I sometimes honestly do begin to wonder if these people have some sort of personal vendetta against me, or maybe I have 'Clueless No-Mark' tattooed on my forehead?

As for Halliwell, I had a run-in with those t***ers at the weekend, they wouldn't arrange a test-drive for me unless I agreed to "sit down and go through all the figures first", and said they "don't do willy nilly test drives". Well, you better f**king start, mate, because the way the economy is shaping up you'll be out on the streets soon offering a b*** job to anyone who'll come into your strip-lit sh**hole of a showroom.... (Please be careful with your language regarding dealerships, FM- they do actually read some of the threads! Viv)


The guy wasn't bald by any chance? If so had a run in with him when i was looking to purchase a few months back, he just came out with old skool selling tactics, chin scratching bowlox us customers are only to familiar with.....

Did you know that Toyota now only employe sales staff with no previous car sales experience, thus avoiding the swiss tony approach

Quote`Swiss Tony - Fast Show ...Of course, As you know, I'm a very keen fisherman myself. You know, I've often thought that going fishing was very much like making love to a beautiful woman. First of all, clean and inspect your tackle, carefully pull back your rod cover, and remove any dirt or gunge that may have built up whilst not in use. Then, extend your rod to its full length, and check that there are no kinks or any wear. Particularly at the base, where the grip is usually applied. Make sure you've got a decent float, the appropriate bait, and that there's plenty of shot in your bag. class
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      06-10-2008, 04:56 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekk View Post
It was actually you I was trying to protect, FM.

I know that Preston Hall are truly a complete bunch of f*cking dipsh*ts & I'm not afraid of saying so, despite what they'll have their prospective customers believe.
Also, I couldn't give a flying f**k what they think about what I've got to say about them.

However, other members may say something they could potentially regret at some point in the future, so it was for that reason I made the edit to your post.

All the best.

Viv
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