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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > SpyPix--BMW 335d in Final U.S. Tests (282 hp / 428 lb-ft)



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      07-08-2008, 10:02 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by 200Duece View Post
So they are not running the same twin turbo setup. they are going to run a sequential, small feeding big or the small one disengages when the larger one spools up?
You got it, it is a sequential setup, not a twin setup!
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      07-08-2008, 10:46 PM   #68
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eh..
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      07-08-2008, 10:52 PM   #69
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The gas costs about 35 cents a gallon more than premium, the car averages only about 7 mpg more than my 335 does now, I will have less power, a less free revving engine, and I will pay several thousand for this, why?
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      07-08-2008, 11:35 PM   #70
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^ well, first you'd have to get your verb-age correct, diesels do not use "gas" they use diesel fuel...

As its stated throughout this short thread, those mileage estimates are very conservative, more than likely you'll save on fuel consumption. However, it still may not be enough to cover the up-front added cost of purchasing a diesel. If BMW charges a premium for it that is. If it runs the same cost as the 335i, it should be worth cross-shopping if diesel and premium stay around the same prices...

Since you already own an e90, it probably wouldn't be advantageous for you to trade. Usually BMW 3ers loose +-40% of their value in the first 3 years, so you may or may not be upside down depending on what you did or did not finance...

Also keep in mind that the diesel engine should be able to accept mods just as a gas unit does. As in, it might be very easy to get back that power you think you need on a daily basis...
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      07-09-2008, 01:50 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraggy View Post
The gas costs about 35 cents a gallon more than premium, the car averages only about 7 mpg more than my 335 does now, I will have less power, a less free revving engine, and I will pay several thousand for this, why?
BMW uk site list fuel comsuption at a 42.2mpg combined for the 335d, and 31.0mpg combined for the 335i.

335d is ~27% more efficient or ~180 miles extra per tank(16 gallon tank).

Better on the enviroment, less Co2 emissions.

Thats why.

Less HP, but way more torque, which is actually what moves the car.
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      07-09-2008, 02:01 AM   #72
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dude diesel is like an average of like $5.30 a gallon here in cali. who in their right mind would go for this? even if it is better gas mileage the price of it will become basically the same thing as a normal gasoline car.
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      07-09-2008, 02:28 AM   #73
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My brother leased a 335d (European version) for some time and i must say it was really good, i mean really good. Not so much difference with the 335i and believe me, you really do save a lot on fuel comparing to the 335i. Plus the high torque is just awesome, the car pulls like a beast !!!

Diesel-power is not to be underestimated
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      07-09-2008, 04:03 AM   #74
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Quite a few of us outside the US drive diesels in preference to petrol. Economy is only one reason. Drivability is another and range also. I've owned many cars over the years from 2.0 liter Alfa's to V8 SUV's and my wife has just taken delivery of a new 2.0d X3 coupled with the 6-speed ZF auto.

It's our first diesel and I have to say it's a revelation. Just so easy to drive around the city and smooth. The engine is the latest gen BMW 2.0d as also fitted here to the 1 series, 3 series and 5 series. Wonderful and no regrets.

BTW I have an E90 M3 on order so that's the other extreme I guess!
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      07-09-2008, 04:27 AM   #75
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Diesel is actually cheaper in most European countries then petrol/gas.

Diesel in Belgium is currently €1.458 per liter compared to €1.610 for 95 or €1.656 for 98 RON.

So not only do you get much better consumption (and therefor more range), but prices are lower and you get a lot more torque. Negative is that you pay more for the purchase of the car with a diesel engine.
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      07-09-2008, 06:15 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJetE90 View Post
Not really.

328i - 18/28 mpg

Not mention the 335d Co2 emission is way less.

The 6.2 seconds is 0-62 not 0-60.
Yeah I think C&D managed 6.1 0-60 with a manual 328i.

Old sticker used to be like 21/30 or something, but at any rate I manage 20 city and 30 highway AT LEAST (there's been times I even got 33 hwy). But since when do people buying these cars care about emissions and fuel consumption?
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      07-09-2008, 09:58 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malbec View Post
Lassaxi---why would you not notice the extra torque in the 335d? My 335i has 300LB-FT. How could you not notice another 125 LB-FT in a car that weighs about the same---especially when already cruising on the open road.
I 'm thinkin this car will crack your head back from 50-80mph especially with the 7 speed DCT. More torque than a 550i, more than an M3! Yikes! More torque, gotta like that-and throw in better mileage. Sounds great!
YMMV

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The extra torque of the diesel will be nice, but will not be as noticable as you think because of the tall gearing of the diesel. The final drive ratio of the diesel is 2.81 versus 3.46 for the gas. And don't forget, the peak torque of the diesel is good to only 2250 rpm, then it starts to drop. That's why the diesel can't accelerate as fast as the gas version. Peak torque is nice, but the gearing and how long the engine can hold the torque are also important factors to consider.
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      07-09-2008, 10:44 AM   #78
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Why so much torque..?
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      07-09-2008, 10:57 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCali E90 View Post
dude diesel is like an average of like $5.30 a gallon here in cali. who in their right mind would go for this? even if it is better gas mileage the price of it will become basically the same thing as a normal gasoline car.
I'm sure regular and premium will be right up there with that diesel price in the very near future. Usually diesel jumps in price before gasoline, but in the end they usually end up at a similar price point...
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      07-09-2008, 11:02 AM   #80
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Ok, I tried to figure out what the annual savings would be, if any, among the different 3 series options for 2009. Feel free to comment on the numbers. The fuel prices are from MarylandFuelPrices.com, using my home city. I also estimated 15,000 highway miles a year for driving (as it would be easier for me to calculate that way; I understand that is not necessarily representative of everyone's individual commute). The 0-60 times are based on BMWUSA.com, plus the 6.2 seconds for 0-62 noted on the first page of this thread.

Price of premium: $4.31
Price of diesel: $4.99

Miles driven per year: 15,000

328i highway mpg, estimated 0-60: 28, 6.3 (manual), 6.9 (automatic)
335i highway mpg : 26, 5.4 (manual), 5.6 (automatic)
335d highway mpg (est): 33, 6.2 (automatic only)

328i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/28): 536
335i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/26): 577
335d total annual gallons consumed (15,000/33): 455

328i total annual fuel cost (536x$4.31): $2,308.93
335i total annual fuel cost (577x$4.31): $2,486.54
335d total annual fuel cost (455 x $4.99): $2,268.18

So, total savings (under the facts assumed here) for the 335d is $40.75, compared to the 328i, and $218.36, compared to the 335i. That surprised me, as I had been a big proponent of the 335d, even if it is coming in automatic-only guise. But now with diesel prices at 68 per gallon more than premium, the annual fuel cost differential is pretty small. That's a change since the last time I tried this analysis (http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=171).
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      07-09-2008, 11:10 AM   #81
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Nice pics... Either the design center has a thousand 15776 license plates or they keep using the same one... I saw that on other mules in the past.
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      07-09-2008, 11:14 AM   #82
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This is somewhere in Nevada...
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      07-09-2008, 11:21 AM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335er View Post
Ok, I tried to figure out what the annual savings would be, if any, among the different 3 series options for 2009. Feel free to comment on the numbers. The fuel prices are from MarylandFuelPrices.com, using my home city. I also estimated 15,000 highway miles a year for driving (as it would be easier for me to calculate that way; I understand that is not necessarily representative of everyone's individual commute). The 0-60 times are based on BMWUSA.com, plus the 6.2 seconds for 0-62 noted on the first page of this thread.

Price of premium: $4.31
Price of diesel: $4.99

Miles driven per year: 15,000

328i highway mpg, estimated 0-60: 28, 6.3 (manual), 6.9 (automatic)
335i highway mpg : 26, 5.4 (manual), 5.6 (automatic)
335d highway mpg (est): 33, 6.2 (automatic only)

328i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/28): 536
335i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/26): 577
335d total annual gallons consumed (15,000/33): 455

328i total annual fuel cost (536x$4.31): $2,308.93
335i total annual fuel cost (577x$4.31): $2,486.54
335d total annual fuel cost (455 x $4.99): $2,268.18

So, total savings (under the facts assumed here) for the 335d is $40.75, compared to the 328i, and $218.36, compared to the 335i. That surprised me, as I had been a big proponent of the 335d, even if it is coming in automatic-only guise. But now with diesel prices at 68 per gallon more than premium, the annual fuel cost differential is pretty small. That's a change since the last time I tried this analysis (http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=171).
Good stuff. The published fuel consumption for the 335d seems to be quite conservative compared to what some of our UK members are saying though while the gas numbers seem to be fairly accurate. So that kind of skews the results.
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      07-09-2008, 11:21 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335er View Post
Ok, I tried to figure out what the annual savings would be, if any, among the different 3 series options for 2009. Feel free to comment on the numbers. The fuel prices are from MarylandFuelPrices.com, using my home city. I also estimated 15,000 highway miles a year for driving (as it would be easier for me to calculate that way; I understand that is not necessarily representative of everyone's individual commute). The 0-60 times are based on BMWUSA.com, plus the 6.2 seconds for 0-62 noted on the first page of this thread.

Price of premium: $4.31
Price of diesel: $4.99

Miles driven per year: 15,000

328i highway mpg, estimated 0-60: 28, 6.3 (manual), 6.9 (automatic)
335i highway mpg : 26, 5.4 (manual), 5.6 (automatic)
335d highway mpg (est): 33, 6.2 (automatic only)

328i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/28): 536
335i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/26): 577
335d total annual gallons consumed (15,000/33): 455

328i total annual fuel cost (536x$4.31): $2,308.93
335i total annual fuel cost (577x$4.31): $2,486.54
335d total annual fuel cost (455 x $4.99): $2,268.18

So, total savings (under the facts assumed here) for the 335d is $40.75, compared to the 328i, and $218.36, compared to the 335i. That surprised me, as I had been a big proponent of the 335d, even if it is coming in automatic-only guise. But now with diesel prices at 68 per gallon more than premium, the annual fuel cost differential is pretty small. That's a change since the last time I tried this analysis (http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=171).
Excellent analysis!,
The only thing is that prices for fuel vary so much from locale to locale that you numbers do not translate to where I am. I usually use the regional or national averages when I do the same analysis.

For example today Premium was $4.69, diesel $4.99 where I am. So my saving would be double yours, not to mention the 33 is a low ball figure and you are not comparing auto to auto.

For US fuel avg. I use the Department of Energy site:
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oil_gas/petro...petroleum.html

BTW- the reason for the auto in the 335d is for drivability and efficiency.
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      07-09-2008, 11:32 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e92phreak View Post
Nice pics... Either the design center has a thousand 15776 license plates or they keep using the same one... I saw that on other mules in the past.
hahaha

yea, i believe they have many with the same #, because it's always the same # on their test mules.
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      07-09-2008, 11:34 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335er View Post
So, total savings (under the facts assumed here) for the 335d is $40.75, compared to the 328i, and $218.36, compared to the 335i. That surprised me, as I had been a big proponent of the 335d, even if it is coming in automatic-only guise. But now with diesel prices at 68 per gallon more than premium, the annual fuel cost differential is pretty small. That's a change since the last time I tried this analysis (http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=171).
As an E92 335D driver ... it just confirms that I can run a car with more torque than an M3 or M5, effortless pace and comparable straight line speed to a 335i (that's from real drivers' experience and feedback of both cars in the UK). I can have all that, but still have a nice little bonus that it costs less than a 328i to run.

It seems that most, not all, Americans are unable to see the 335D as an alternative performance package, but rather see the "D" badge and break immediately into arithmetic to work out fuel savings. Which do exist.

If you want a high-revving experience go buy a 335i - you'll love it, and nobody could fault you.

However .... if you enjoy a mountain of addictive, creamy torque (just ask all those 335i drivers who appreciate that), equal real world performance and much better mpg you'll soon have the choice of a 335D. Choice is good.

D.
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      07-09-2008, 11:42 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335er View Post
Ok, I tried to figure out what the annual savings would be, if any, among the different 3 series options for 2009. Feel free to comment on the numbers. The fuel prices are from MarylandFuelPrices.com, using my home city. I also estimated 15,000 highway miles a year for driving (as it would be easier for me to calculate that way; I understand that is not necessarily representative of everyone's individual commute). The 0-60 times are based on BMWUSA.com, plus the 6.2 seconds for 0-62 noted on the first page of this thread.

Price of premium: $4.31
Price of diesel: $4.99

Miles driven per year: 15,000

328i highway mpg, estimated 0-60: 28, 6.3 (manual), 6.9 (automatic)
335i highway mpg : 26, 5.4 (manual), 5.6 (automatic)
335d highway mpg (est): 33, 6.2 (automatic only)

328i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/28): 536
335i total annual gallons consumed (15,000/26): 577
335d total annual gallons consumed (15,000/33): 455

328i total annual fuel cost (536x$4.31): $2,308.93
335i total annual fuel cost (577x$4.31): $2,486.54
335d total annual fuel cost (455 x $4.99): $2,268.18

So, total savings (under the facts assumed here) for the 335d is $40.75, compared to the 328i, and $218.36, compared to the 335i. That surprised me, as I had been a big proponent of the 335d, even if it is coming in automatic-only guise. But now with diesel prices at 68 per gallon more than premium, the annual fuel cost differential is pretty small. That's a change since the last time I tried this analysis (http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=171).
cool analysis!

diesel around my area is about $0.30 more than premium as well (~$5.10 for diesel; ~$4.80 for 91).
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      07-09-2008, 11:47 AM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_3 View Post
As an E92 335D driver ... it just confirms that I can run a car with more torque than an M3 or M5, effortless pace and comparable straight line speed to a 335i (that's from real drivers' experience and feedback of both cars in the UK). I can have all that, but still have a nice little bonus that it costs less than a 328i to run.

It seems that most, not all, Americans are unable to see the 335D as an alternative performance package, but rather see the "D" badge and break immediately into arithmetic to work out fuel savings. Which do exist.

If you want a high-revving experience go buy a 335i - you'll love it, and nobody could fault you.

However .... if you enjoy a mountain of addictive, creamy torque (just ask all those 335i drivers who appreciate that), equal real world performance and much better mpg you'll soon have the choice of a 335D. Choice is good.

D.
Excellent summary.
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