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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > BMW Oil Study Done-Long Interval Changes unhealthy for N54 engine



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      07-09-2009, 03:31 PM   #23
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Agreed with Saintor and jb's335.

One lab report is pretty meaningless, and I have a very hard time believing that BMW (and so many others) would be recommending such a long interval if a simple oil test proves them wrong. I'm quite confident these engineers know what they are doing on the engines THEY developed.

I'm borderline anal when it comes to taking care of my cars, but will always follow the recommendations of the manufacturer before some random lab test.

And to those of you who are changing oil every 3-5k (and using synthetic presumably) - that's a waste. Quality synthetic oil is fine for well beyond that.
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      07-09-2009, 03:47 PM   #24
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Search BMW Law Suits. This is now public information. Lets hope we finally get the root of this. My car still gets 30% less gas mileage than it did prior to the FIX and has less power.MW's answer, "Normal" I went to trade it in the other day on another make, the dealer said " have you had any turbo and or Fuel pump problems" Get for resale. They offered me $33,000 on a 07 loaded conv with 14K on it and flawless cond. Almost 50% in two years. That a way BMW! BWMNA won't even do a deal.

For those that don't have Pacer. One already has been filed.
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      07-09-2009, 07:07 PM   #25
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I believe BMW is putting forth an honest effort in making durable engines and providing a "satisfactory" service interval.

However, BMW is in the business of selling cars - that being said, deep down they don't want them to last forever...
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      07-09-2009, 08:22 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jopa489 View Post
Agreed with Saintor and jb's335.

One lab report is pretty meaningless, and I have a very hard time believing that BMW (and so many others) would be recommending such a long interval if a simple oil test proves them wrong. I'm quite confident these engineers know what they are doing on the engines THEY developed.

I'm borderline anal when it comes to taking care of my cars, but will always follow the recommendations of the manufacturer before some random lab test.

And to those of you who are changing oil every 3-5k (and using synthetic presumably) - that's a waste. Quality synthetic oil is fine for well beyond that.
I also agree..,
See what i posted in the parallel thread http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...44&postcount=4
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      07-09-2009, 09:14 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
The market for fear is alive and kicking.

Here are some empirical facts.

1. The yearly or 15000 miles oil change (device-monitored) has been around for 15 years, and have been embraced at least by BMW, Mercedes and Porsche.

2. There is no indication whatsoever that their engines are less durable. NONE.

Bottom line; don't get excited by labs data that has probably NO RELEVANCE or meaning in the real world. I fully trust BMW, Mercedes and Porsche expertise; they would never take such a risk on their reputation. I am totally confident that they have large statistical data to support that their engines will reach 150 000 miles.

Spend your nerves elsewhere.
I'm glad you trust other humans this much, I however do not. They are out to make a buck...nothing else.

change you damned oil more often its worth the safety margin.

is everyone really that lazy and cheap??
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      07-09-2009, 09:16 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Booster4075 View Post
I believe BMW is putting forth an honest effort in making durable engines and providing a "satisfactory" service interval.

However, BMW is in the business of selling cars - that being said, deep down they don't want them to last forever...
so what do you say about the thousands of HPFP that are failing time after time? BMW obviously knows about it and isnt doing anything to improve their durable engines!!!

yes I know the HPFP is not part of the engine itself, but obviously the engine is SOL w/ out the HPFP.
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      07-09-2009, 10:04 PM   #29
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I'm glad you trust other humans this much, I however do not. They are out to make a buck...nothing else.

change you damned oil more often its worth the safety margin.

is everyone really that lazy and cheap??
I agree an oil change is cheap insurance. Even at the dealer it's only a $100. 15k miles with the some oil on a turbo car is insane but thats just MHO.
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      07-10-2009, 12:37 AM   #30
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I don't recall the sales and marketing stating that my motor would last infinity miles. Did I miss something?
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      07-10-2009, 03:20 AM   #31
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I'm sure BMW is aware that 15K is not a safe oil chnage interval, but all they care about ti to get you to the end of your warranty period. After that its not their problem. I still think the main reason they have a 15K interval is because they are the ones having to pay for it under their "free maintenace program". From what I remember, the Audi RS4 is 10K even though it uses similar oil and is NA. Other Audi's are also 10K. Lexus IS's have shorter intervals too, all because its not covered under a "free maintenance program."
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      07-10-2009, 07:21 AM   #32
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I'm sorry but your assumption is completely invalid. This is a new car and you WILL have higher than normal wear in the beginning. Come back to us after TWO more oil changes. If the levels have not decreased then you may have a point. The N54 isn't a high strung 4 Cyl found in many Asian cars. Seriously, come back after TWO changes, and change your heading. It's very Fox News-ish. This isn't a post about a study conducted by BMW.
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      07-10-2009, 07:31 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Booster4075 View Post
I believe BMW is putting forth an honest effort in making durable engines and providing a "satisfactory" service interval.

However, BMW is in the business of selling cars - that being said, deep down they don't want them to last forever...
True, but they have to make them last atleast 100k miles because the CPO market is VERY VERY important to their bottom line. Most people will unload theirs cars (regardless of brand) @ ~100k miles.
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      07-10-2009, 07:55 AM   #34
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I added Redline 5W30 @ 1200 miles and again @ 5500 miles. I am now @ 10,500 miles and I am going to be changing my oil again any day now. Redline 5W30 of course. Aircraft quality synthetic with a flash point up over 400 degrees F. I won't be using BMW's "free oil change" but the rest of their free maintenance I will. Like new wiper blades every time I go in for service/repairs.

Waiting 12-15k miles is too long, but I don't know if you can change that. They allow you to change your own oil as often as you want. The car will last well over 100k miles even if you only let BMW change the oil every 15k. I think for anyone to care (like a court) engines would have to fail, due to the extended oil change intervals, well before 100k miles.
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      07-10-2009, 08:42 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
The market for fear is alive and kicking.

Here are some empirical facts.

1. The yearly or 15000 miles oil change (device-monitored) has been around for 15 years, and have been embraced at least by BMW, Mercedes and Porsche.

2. There is no indication whatsoever that their engines are less durable. NONE.

Bottom line; don't get excited by labs data that has probably NO RELEVANCE or meaning in the real world. I fully trust BMW, Mercedes and Porsche expertise; they would never take such a risk on their reputation. I am totally confident that they have large statistical data to support that their engines will reach 150 000 miles.

Spend your nerves elsewhere.
further the oil level/oil temp combo sensor also measures the density and conductivity(high metal content) of the engine oil thus enabling Condition Based Servicing.

On a tangent... some ppl it seems don't know the difference between "oil service due" and "oil level low" and complain when a quart or 2 of top up is req between services. Internal combustion engines consume oil, have done for a while...the more efficient they become the more oil they consume due to lower friction oil scraper rings and higher compression ratios and pressures etc. BMW specs up2 0.7l/1000km oil consumption and up2 1.5l/1000km on M engines with "normal" usage. Porsche stipulates up2 1.5l/1000km of usage, MB specs 0.8l/1000km and also 1.5l/1000km for AMG...so next time you get a top up oil warning, instead of whinging about a design characteristic that you should have read about or at least experienced unless you were living under a rock for the last 10 years or so lol sorry for the rant but have heard this complaint quite a few times and cringe every time I hear/read it.

Good luck with the challenge, personally I don't see it going anywhere, not with the small sample you have and the fact that possibly halve of the people that will join your campaign will have modified their cars in some way effecting the engine..including yours while you challenge an interval clearly meant for stock production vehicles.
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      07-10-2009, 08:45 AM   #36
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Quote:
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I don't recall the sales and marketing stating that my motor would last infinity miles. Did I miss something?
I also don't recall them stating that the fuel pump will die mid turn on a busy highway but it does . What did i miss ?

Harry
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      07-10-2009, 08:53 AM   #37
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Oh and one more thing...the concept of high interval servicing was introduced long before free servicing. The idea was to reduce running costs for the consumer. Coming from the country that pioneered the free maintenance plans (called BMW Motorplan back in 93/94 in South Africa and then sold to all other markets after 2002) I remember there used to be a lot of people complaining that the longer intervals where because BMW SA wants to earn a cheap buck, yet BMW consumers around the world that actually paid their own maintenance costs embraced the concept. Now that they don't have to pay anymore in most big markets suddenly the intervals are too long...
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      07-10-2009, 09:00 AM   #38
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free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 20,000 miles(my case)

no free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 3,000 miles

it's all about saving $$$$$$ and making $$$$$$$$$$$
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      07-10-2009, 09:03 AM   #39
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Quote:
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free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 20,000 miles(my case)

no free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 3,000 miles

it's all about saving $$$$$$ and making $$$$$$$$$$$
funny how that works
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      07-10-2009, 09:05 AM   #40
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further the oil level/oil temp combo sensor also measures the density and conductivity(high metal content) of the engine oil thus enabling Condition Based Servicing.
So the car and sensors can actually tell when the oil starts break down and needs to be changed? That's what sets the oil change interval? If that's the case then why after an oil chage the oil change indicator does not change? I just had mine done the other day, car still states it needs an oil change in 5k miles.
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      07-10-2009, 09:14 AM   #41
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So the car and sensors can actually tell when the oil starts break down and needs to be changed? That's what sets the oil change interval? If that's the case then why after an oil chage the oil change indicator does not change? I just had mine done the other day, car still states it needs an oil change in 5k miles.
The parameters need to be reset to indicate that a service has been done and the entire cycle can start to count down again. While the oil sensor is one of the main inputs there a few more such as average fuel consumption, time, number of cold starts, ambient temp and engine load adaptation. It's the same when you get the main battery replaced the SOH(state of health is not automatically factored and still requires a technician to log a battery replacement.) I'm not looking for excuses for BMW here I just happen to know the behind the scenes situ in a workshop quite well, having been a certified BMW master technician myself.
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      07-10-2009, 09:17 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaTuReB0Y View Post
free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 20,000 miles(my case)

no free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 3,000 miles

it's all about saving $$$$$$ and making $$$$$$$$$$$
Your SA or whomever told you that needs to be shot or maybe they come from your location cos the only time an oil change is prescribed before or around 3000miles is during running in of an M vehicle. If it's not in the manual or officially from BMW AG or NA or other country HQ it's BS.
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      07-10-2009, 09:20 AM   #43
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Quote:
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so what do you say about the thousands of HPFP that are failing time after time? BMW obviously knows about it and isnt doing anything to improve their durable engines!!!

yes I know the HPFP is not part of the engine itself, but obviously the engine is SOL w/ out the HPFP.
+1 when will people stop blindly accepting things without looking at the bigger picture

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaTuReB0Y View Post
free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 20,000 miles(my case)

No free maintenance = bmw recommends oil change every 3,000 miles

it's all about saving $$$$$$ and making $$$$$$$$$$$
no you should just change your oil every 15000 miles


I'm surprised that everyone wants to argue this... Change your damn oil every 3000/4000/5000 miles (whatever suits your driving style)... Have a UOA done to make sure you are using the correct intervals and to uncover any major problems with the motor... Is it that hard to grasp?
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      07-10-2009, 09:21 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jopa489 View Post
Agreed with Saintor and jb's335.

One lab report is pretty meaningless, and I have a very hard time believing that BMW (and so many others) would be recommending such a long interval if a simple oil test proves them wrong. I'm quite confident these engineers know what they are doing on the engines THEY developed.

I'm borderline anal when it comes to taking care of my cars, but will always follow the recommendations of the manufacturer before some random lab test.

And to those of you who are changing oil every 3-5k (and using synthetic presumably) - that's a waste. Quality synthetic oil is fine for well beyond that.
+1
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