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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > Mr. 5 Intake, Stock Intake, and DCI---VBOX 60-100 Time Comparisons!



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      02-15-2010, 09:50 PM   #1
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Exclamation Mr. 5 Intake, Stock Intake, and DCI---VBOX 60-100 Time Comparisons!

As promissed,
I tested my intake this morning to see if the changes made improvements.
For those who don't want the excutive summary, the Mr. 5 Intake performed the best out of the DCI and the OEM air box.
For those who don't know, this was my original design:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...3538&highlight

This is the updated version which I used during this test:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...9293&highlight

Now before anyone starts to think that these results are scewed then think again. I'm not selling this. It was just an idea that I had (Thanks Dinan) to grab the coldest air for the engine without the restrictions.

Also, I chose a road that goes slightly up hill so we don't have the "Those 60-100 runs are slow compared to what others are getting" posts. I also wanted to see how each intake did under pressure.
All off topic posts will be deleted since we are only talking about the comparisons of intakes.

This is what I did:

3 Runs with my Intake
3 runs with the OEM air box
3 runs with the DCI
2 runs with my intake again to make sure I wasn't seeing things.

I highlighted the best run of each.


Mr. 5 Intake

Time 4.63
Peak Boost 15.95
Average Boost 14.006
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 45.28%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 49.48%


Time 4.63
Peak Boost 15.95
Average Boost 14.08
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 45.25%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 49.43%

Time 4.66
Peak Boost 15.95
Average Boost 14.09
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 44.88%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 50.23%


Stock

Time 4.73
Peak Boost 16.095
Average Boost 14.031
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 46.09%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 52.88%

Time 4.68
Peak Boost 16.24
Average Boost 14.09
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 49.09%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 54.84%


Time 4.69
Peak Boost 16.385
Average Boost 14.10
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 46.00%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 53.91%

DCI

4.67
Peak Boost 16.24
Average Boost 14.33
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 45.48%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 50.54%


4.72
Peak Boost 16.24
Average Boost 14.34
Average Wastegate Pulse Duration 45.44%
Peak Wastegate Pulse Duration 51.42%

4.70
Sorry, but I forgot to hit the start button to log.


As you can see, the best times obtained were done with the Mr. 5 intake and the average boost, peak boost and wastegate duty cycles were less than with the other intakes.

When I finished the testing with the DCI, I was curious if it the conditions changed at all from when i ran the Mr. 5 intake earlier so I put it back on to see if I could replicate the results and I did.
I didn't do any BT logs but it's obvious that my intake did pretty well.

4.68 and 4.62 were the times when I put my intake back on so actually my best time was 4.62.

The pictures are in the following order:

Mr. 5 Intake
Stock
DCI
Mr. 5
Attached Images
    
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      02-15-2010, 10:06 PM   #2
powerbarsk8ter
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Wow, that is the difference that separated gold from silver or bronze medals. So Mr. 5 took gold!
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      02-15-2010, 10:08 PM   #3
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Were these done without meth?
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      02-15-2010, 10:13 PM   #4
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looks like ill be making a "mr.5" intake
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      02-15-2010, 10:28 PM   #5
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Were these done without meth?
All of these runs were done with Meth so I can just imagine what the results would be without.
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      02-15-2010, 10:32 PM   #6
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good good tests and results

CAI is the way to go for sure
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      02-15-2010, 10:35 PM   #7
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these results confirm the use of a closed system is awesome. and i bet mr. 5, if you tested higher accel test, where theres more wind in front of the car, the closed system will out perform the dci even more than it has. thanks for posting your detailed results. the cai combined with the stock box is a very cool idea as many have said. im glad i got my closed box system
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      02-15-2010, 10:45 PM   #8
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Its amazing how thing change around here when it comes to which is better cold air intakes or DCIs!!! lol

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ir+hot+intakes

I always thought the UR and STETT was the best CAI, but now that Dinan and Mr 5 intake is out, there will be alot of people changing their minds with the DCIs!!
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      02-15-2010, 11:06 PM   #9
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Nice results! It's unfortunate that an extra stock air box is expensive compared to DCI.
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      02-15-2010, 11:14 PM   #10
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as suspected... great results, thanks for posting. lower times and boost in real world conditions is what it's all aboot. i'm sure many of us will be replicating your work.
certainly getting your money's worth out of that vbox
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      02-15-2010, 11:15 PM   #11
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how much?

Nice work!
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      02-15-2010, 11:38 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335i82108 View Post
looks like ill be making a "mr.5" intake
If you can find an extra one then I would go for it but I wouldn't necessarily recommend doing it with your one and only unless you truly do plan to keep your car for a long while.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cn555ic View Post
Its amazing how thing change around here when it comes to which is better cold air intakes or DCIs!!! lol

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ir+hot+intakes

I always thought the UR and STETT was the best CAI, but now that Dinan and Mr 5 intake is out, there will be alot of people changing their minds with the DCIs!!
I can't comment about the Stett intakes and the UR intakes because they use one filter.
I am still using the drop in filter for the air going through the OEM ducting and the universal filter in the bumper.
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      02-16-2010, 08:31 AM   #13
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Honestly, the wastegate duty cycle is almost identical on DCI and your intake so the flow is sufficient on both. It would be nice to see IAT if possible at some time. Next, the time difference is nearly nothing on the best runs. I am not sure that .04 seconds proves anything because that must be within the range of error on the VBOX. There are so many other things that could account for such a tiny error.

It is important to note this proves the stock intake is worthless on higher boost. You will notice the wastegate duty cycles are higher on the stock intake, so it is not sufficent to flow at higher boost levels. End of story.

Please don't take this the wrong way Mr. 5. I am simply stating that the quantifable difference here is not conclusive in my opinion.
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      02-16-2010, 08:36 AM   #14
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awesome Mr. 5. I'll have to find a 335i in a junk yard or something.
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      02-16-2010, 08:48 AM   #15
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Too bad no one of the tuners is truly listening...in fact, I think they are listening but a Mr. 5 intake does not make business sense for them, unless they will fabricate an airbox cover like Dinan.

However, I think that selling a bundle comprised of: a high-quality machined part to couple the silicon hose to the airbox (the most difficult part of such an intake), an air-filter, silicone or even steel pipe and required clamps, fittings etc. would make some business sense.
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      02-16-2010, 08:53 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cstavaru View Post
Too bad no one of the tuners is truly listening...in fact, I think they are listening but a Mr. 5 intake does not make business sense for them, unless they will fabricate an airbox cover like Dinan.

However, I think that selling a bundle comprised of: a high-quality machined part to couple the silicon hose to the airbox (the most difficult part of such an intake), an air-filter, silicone or even steel pipe and required clamps, fittings etc. would make some business sense.
Terry had this idea about 2 years ago and scrapped the project because his testing showed it didn't work. Terry is clear that he would have preferred it worked because he can make more money on this than a DCI.
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      02-16-2010, 09:18 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Former_Boosted_IS View Post
Honestly, the wastegate duty cycle is almost identical on DCI and your intake so the flow is sufficient on both. It would be nice to see IAT if possible at some time. Next, the time difference is nearly nothing on the best runs. I am not sure that .04 seconds proves anything because that must be within the range of error on the VBOX. There are so many other things that could account for such a tiny error.

It is important to note this proves the stock intake is worthless on higher boost. You will notice the wastegate duty cycles are higher on the stock intake, so it is not sufficent to flow at higher boost levels. End of story.

Please don't take this the wrong way Mr. 5. I am simply stating that the quantifable difference here is not conclusive in my opinion.
Worthless? Come on.

1-3% duty cycle on stock airbox is relatively nothing. It even made slightly more boost. If the stock airbox required 95% duty cycle and was overheating the solenoids, then it would be useless. It's obviously a small flow restriction but I think your wording is poor (and also spelling)
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      02-16-2010, 09:33 AM   #18
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How much did it cost you from start to finish?
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      02-16-2010, 09:38 AM   #19
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Quote:
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Worthless? Come on.

1-3% duty cycle on stock airbox is relatively nothing. It even made slightly more boost. If the stock airbox required 95% duty cycle and was overheating the solenoids, then it would be useless. It's obviously a small flow restriction but I think your wording is poor (and also spelling)
i honestly think if you run some statistical tests... the data wouldn't be significant enough to say that the Mr. 5 intake is actually better.. there are a lot of variables that can alter the data by such a small amount... this is almost like saying you did a 0-60 mph run and the mr. 5 intake ran 3.93 and the DCI ran 3.96... there is no way that you can say that the intake is better off of such a small difference...
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      02-16-2010, 09:40 AM   #20
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Nice stats!
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      02-16-2010, 10:15 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bren335i View Post
Worthless? Come on.

1-3% duty cycle on stock airbox is relatively nothing. It even made slightly more boost. If the stock airbox required 95% duty cycle and was overheating the solenoids, then it would be useless. It's obviously a small flow restriction but I think your wording is poor (and also spelling)
The car making more boost is not what matters though for understanding flow. What the higher WG DC does tell us is that the turbos needed to spin faster on the stock intake to produce almost the same boost. That is by definition a restriction. That does indeed verify that the stock intake is not free flowing enough for higher boost levels. This is undenyable proof in my opinion and verifies other testing I have done and posted.

If you want your turbos spinning faster, all else equal on about 15 psi, then you should keep the stock intake. Just understand that this is a fact.
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      02-16-2010, 10:43 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Former_Boosted_IS View Post
The car making more boost is not what matters though for understanding flow. What the higher WG DC does tell us is that the turbos needed to spin faster on the stock intake to produce almost the same boost. That is by definition a restriction. That does indeed verify that the stock intake is not free flowing enough for higher boost levels. This is undenyable proof in my opinion and verifies other testing I have done and posted.

If you want your turbos spinning faster, all else equal on about 15 psi, then you should keep the stock intake. Just understand that this is a fact.
I understand it is a restriction, but not a LARGE one by that data. This is nothing new in any turbo community.

1-3% duty cycle is NOT a significant change due to flow. 10% could be, 20% could be. Especially since it was making more then peak boost of the other pulls. It is not hurting the turbos to make 1-3% to justify the same boost. Cars do far more at high altitude to reach peak boost.

If the car was indeed making 15.94 like the other pulls, instead of 16.2 it would probably have LESS increase in duty cycle 1-3% peak.
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