E90Post
 


VIBE Motorsports
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > FMIC Comparison - Data Compilation



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      04-02-2010, 04:17 PM   #177
335e92tx
Major
 
335e92tx's Avatar
 
Drives: 07-335e92 - monaco blue
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Texas

Posts: 1,261
iTrader: (2)

The individual I got the quote from indicated a new core was being used. He also said he would get me details on the unit. Supposedly boltin-notrim.
__________________
JBSPEED|MIRO-M6 reps|BMS JB3 V2.0 & DCI |VK Motorwerks DPs|BSH Oil Catch Can |Wavetrac |ETS IC
replacement FP #3 installed on 11/18 @43K - probably more sig updates to follow :/
335e92tx is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-03-2010, 05:13 PM   #178
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management
Major
 
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Abarth 500
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NJ

Posts: 1,158
iTrader: (3)

C'mon guys its warming up everywhere, we STILL need INDEPENDANT 2-3-4 gear datalogs from the following manufacturers FMICS:

-stock factory intercooler
-HPF
-AA
-RPI
-VK
-Stett
-forge
-Agency Power


please make sure the tests are done between 58-85 degree ambient temps and at a boost level of 13.5-14.5 psi so we can standardize the testing!

log boost, ait and rpm and note ambient temperature at time of test!
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-03-2010, 05:14 PM   #179
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management
Major
 
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Abarth 500
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NJ

Posts: 1,158
iTrader: (3)

I just want to open peoples eyes as to the realities of the FMIC landscape and things to look for in regards to real data vs marketing hype... Interestingly enough i use a very good turbo outlet temp calculator that also generates a FMIC efficiency using data that is provided in this thread that answers your ?'s about starting and ending temps.

http://www.stealth316.com/2-turbotemp.htm

using this calculator with the provided data we can see how efficient each unit is in a real world situation and is all based in Physics Law(an exact science). heres the data i got using the calculator, feel free to try it yourself its actually very eye opening. When designing a FMIC I use this during prototyping to determine the best balance of internal fin density and charge row/ambient row height as we don't use an "off the shelf" core!

Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator

inlet temperature-(use the ambient temperature to standardize the test)

input pressure-14.5(atmospheric pressure this does not change unless you are at altitude)

output pressure-(this is the boost pressure seen prior to the fmic, add pressure drop plus datalogged pressure for this #)

compressor efficiency-70%(this can be found by mapping the #'s on a compressor map OR to datalog intercooler inlet temps, lets use 70% to standardize the testing as all are running similar boost levels)

Outlet Temp- (this is the temperature leaving the turbo and entering the FMIC)

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator


IC input Temperature-(this is the Outlet Temp from the previous calculation)

IC Efficiency-(This is the how efficient the FMIC is in this test, it is also the factor you play with to try and match up to the known plenum temp(ending datalogged ait at the end of the run))

IC Pressure loss-.5 (this is the pressure drop through the core, lets use .5 psi to standardize the test)

Ambient Temp-(this is the ambient temp and also the turbo inlet temp)

Plenum Temp-(this is the datalogged ait temp at the end of the 2-3-4 gear run)


now lets crunch the #'s...

HELIX-Intercooler Efficiency 86% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-85
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 249

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-249
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-85
Plenum Temp-108
IC Efficiency-86%

AMS-Intercooler Efficiency 79% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-58
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 214

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-214
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-58
Plenum Temp-112
IC Efficiency-79%

ETS-Intercooler Efficiency 78% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-58
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14.5
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 213

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-213
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-58
Plenum Temp-93
IC Efficiency-78%

SPEARCO/Code 3-Intercooler Efficiency 54% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-65
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 223

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-223
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-65
Plenum Temp-139
IC Efficiency-54%

What this data shows is the efficency and also the FMICs ability to thwart heatsoak through 2-3-4 gears, you can also get single gear efficiencies using the data provided

Last edited by TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management; 05-05-2010 at 10:30 AM.
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-10-2010, 09:51 PM   #180
kirby135i
Lieutenant
 
Drives: bmw
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: here

Posts: 508
iTrader: (1)

someone with a HPF needs to get their data up!
kirby135i is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      04-10-2010, 11:50 PM   #181
bmwzimmer
Major
 
bmwzimmer's Avatar
 
Drives: 335
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: 91 octane states

Posts: 1,084
iTrader: (0)

I'm waiting for my HPF to arrive. HPF and Helix should perform very similarly I would think....
__________________
_________________________________________________
09 E90 LCI Msport, European Delivery
bmwzimmer is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-11-2010, 03:38 AM   #182
gamble
New Member
 
Drives: E92 M3 JZB 6MT
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Austria

Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)

What about the CP-E One?
They recently released the Whitepapers on their new unit with integrated OC.
Maybe enough info to add it to the list?

I like the design and had a pretty good read on the Whitepapers
and its kinda cheap aswell....under 1k$ with OC..
gamble is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-12-2010, 05:31 PM   #183
kirby135i
Lieutenant
 
Drives: bmw
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: here

Posts: 508
iTrader: (1)

CPe white papers indicate 83pct. Maybe boom can do an
independent test
kirby135i is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      04-12-2010, 06:33 PM   #184
adrean8j
Brigadier General
 
adrean8j's Avatar
 
Drives: SGM 135I
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Everywhere and Nowhere

Posts: 4,071
iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2008 135i  [5.00]
Send a message via Yahoo to adrean8j
I have the HPF but would need some time and a laptop that doesnt drop the COM port midway thru a log....
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by ptack View Post
SGM was God's color and has been recalled to heaven.
adrean8j is offline   No_Country
0
Reply With Quote
      05-05-2010, 10:31 AM   #185
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management
Major
 
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Abarth 500
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NJ

Posts: 1,158
iTrader: (3)

C'mon guys its warm everywhere, we STILL need INDEPENDANT 2-3-4 gear datalogs from the following manufacturers FMICS:

-stock factory intercooler
-HPF
-AA
-RPI
-VK
-Stett
-forge
-Agency Power


please make sure the tests are done between 58-85 degree ambient temps and at a boost level of 13.5-14.5 psi so we can standardize the testing!

log boost, ait and rpm and note ambient temperature at time of test!
Quote:
Originally Posted by TTurboBullett View Post
I just want to open peoples eyes as to the realities of the FMIC landscape and things to look for in regards to real data vs marketing hype... Interestingly enough i use a very good turbo outlet temp calculator that also generates a FMIC efficiency using data that is provided in this thread that answers your ?'s about starting and ending temps.

http://www.stealth316.com/2-turbotemp.htm

using this calculator with the provided data we can see how efficient each unit is in a real world situation and is all based in Physics Law(an exact science). heres the data i got using the calculator, feel free to try it yourself its actually very eye opening. When designing a FMIC I use this during prototyping to determine the best balance of internal fin density and charge row/ambient row height as we don't use an "off the shelf" core!

Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator

inlet temperature-(use the ambient temperature to standardize the test)

input pressure-14.5(atmospheric pressure this does not change unless you are at altitude)

output pressure-(this is the boost pressure seen prior to the fmic, add pressure drop plus datalogged pressure for this #)

compressor efficiency-70%(this can be found by mapping the #'s on a compressor map OR to datalog intercooler inlet temps, lets use 70% to standardize the testing as all are running similar boost levels)

Outlet Temp- (this is the temperature leaving the turbo and entering the FMIC)

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator


IC input Temperature-(this is the Outlet Temp from the previous calculation)

IC Efficiency-(This is the how efficient the FMIC is in this test, it is also the factor you play with to try and match up to the known plenum temp(ending datalogged ait at the end of the run))

IC Pressure loss-.5 (this is the pressure drop through the core, lets use .5 psi to standardize the test)

Ambient Temp-(this is the ambient temp and also the turbo inlet temp)

Plenum Temp-(this is the datalogged ait temp at the end of the 2-3-4 gear run)


now lets crunch the #'s...

HELIX-Intercooler Efficiency 86% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-85
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 249

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-249
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-85
Plenum Temp-108
IC Efficiency-86%

AMS-Intercooler Efficiency 79% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-58
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 214

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-214
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-58
Plenum Temp-112
IC Efficiency-79%

ETS-Intercooler Efficiency 78% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-58
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14.5
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 213

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-213
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-58
Plenum Temp-93
IC Efficiency-78%

SPEARCO/Code 3-Intercooler Efficiency 54% through 3 gears
Turbo Outlet Temp Calculator
inlet temperature-65
input pressure-14.5
output pressure-14
compressor efficiency-70%
Outlet Temp- 223

Intercooler Outlet Temperature and Pressure Calculator
IC input Temperature-223
IC Pressure loss-.5
Ambient Temp-65
Plenum Temp-139
IC Efficiency-54%

What this data shows is the efficency and also the FMICs ability to thwart heatsoak through 2-3-4 gears, you can also get single gear efficiencies using the data provided
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2010, 11:28 AM   #186
sbefar011
Registered
 
Drives: 135i
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: nj

Posts: 3
iTrader: (0)

Im torn btw the Helix and Cp-e, appears as though the efficiency is very close, I do like the idea of the added oil cooler with the cp-e
sbefar011 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-14-2010, 03:48 AM   #187
Bizall
Captain
 
Bizall's Avatar
 
Drives: 2014 BMW 335i Sedan
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: San Antonio, TX

Posts: 807
iTrader: (0)

Anyone with the VK? Price plus ease of installation seems out of this world. Love to see some logs with it.
Bizall is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-14-2010, 05:38 PM   #188
Drakos
Lieutenant
 
Drakos's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 335xi E90/13 X5 35i M Sport
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Canada

Posts: 513
iTrader: (1)

Can't wait for all the data, lol. Got anxious by reading this thread and I just bit the bullet and bought one from Mike@N54Tuning. I went with Helix, because sooo many people have them and are happy. I think that there are a lot of good ones here but I don't see other vendors or manufacturers chiming in like Bullett to provide some insightful data.
__________________
Cobb S2+ | AR DP | Helix FMIC | BMS DCI | Forge DV | ER UCP | KW V1 | BMW Performance Exhaust | P3 DBG |
Drakos is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-14-2010, 05:54 PM   #189
themyst
Major General
 
themyst's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 335i LCI
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: NYC

Posts: 6,601
iTrader: (8)

Send a message via AIM to themyst
I was torn between Helix and HPF, but Helix seems to be the winner!
__________________
E90 LCI N54 6AT
themyst is offline   South Korea
0
Reply With Quote
      05-14-2010, 08:26 PM   #190
klipseracer
Banned
 
Drives: 2007 E90 335i, 05 E46 330i
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Arizona

Posts: 3,012
iTrader: (27)

Garage List
2007 335i  [0.00]
2005 330i  [0.00]
Send a message via MSN to klipseracer
I would just like to verify the pressure drop between the inter coolers... I don't think that using a static .5 represents very much in terms of numbers. You can have a highly efficient cooler that causes a loss in power. Efficiency is only part of the equation, and it requires accurate input such as precise compressor efficiency, pressure drop and identical boost levels done on identical tunes/maps etc. I'm sure I could skew these results legitimately just choosing the tune and day and the way I run my test or where my probes are installed.
klipseracer is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-14-2010, 11:41 PM   #191
Clap135
Brigadier General
 
Clap135's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 N54
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sticky's Mom House

Posts: 3,464
iTrader: (1)

lol these results are funny cause they are impossible. The helix has a 86% efficiency with a .5psi pressure drop. Yeaaa lol ok.

From the vendors post

turbo outlet temperature 228 degrees F(estimated using a 63 degree ambient and 65% compressor efficiency at 13.5 psi)
AIT temp- 75 degrees F - 54 degree drop over stock
pre and post intercooler temp drop- 153 degrees F
Intercooler efficiency- 93% - 33% improvement in efficiency over stock
Core pressure drop spec is .5psi at 450hp(600cfm) airflow

Can you explain how you estimated outlet temperature without rpm? Also please post compressor map you are using.
Like stated above 93% efficiency with .5 psi pressure drop is simply impossible

Last edited by Clap135; 05-14-2010 at 11:56 PM.
Clap135 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-15-2010, 01:34 AM   #192
RevC
Lieutenant General
 
RevC's Avatar
 
Drives: a couple fast toys
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Voorhees+cherry hill,NJ

Posts: 11,773
iTrader: (26)

oh snap
__________________
-Rev


SGM e92 335xi|Helix|AFE|AWE|PROCEDE|SYNAPSE|ER|OSS|BMW PERFORMANCE|P3|always growing..
RevC is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-15-2010, 06:30 PM   #193
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management
Major
 
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Abarth 500
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NJ

Posts: 1,158
iTrader: (3)

Using this calculator and the data provided, which is totally fair an representative of all the independant fmic datalogs is how these intercooler efficiency %'s are figured out! What the numbers show are each intercoolers efficiency percentages at the end of a 2-3-4 gear run using the ending temp at the end of the run! Th compressor efficiency is calculated from data that has been posted on compressor outlet temperatures! As far as pressure drop our core specs are .5 psi pressure drop at 450hp flow, Shiv did a comparo between the helix and 2 other aftermarket fmics and even he was impressed how much better the helix was in comparison in regards to pressure drop and the ability to thwart heat soak... But why?

- the helix has 13 charge rows other fmics have 7-8
- helix has an ambient face 56% larger than stock, where some others are stock or slightly larger
-the exposed ambient face( the area exposed to air flow not under the plastic cowl is 70% larger than some competitors, many fmics make the face larger under the cowl not exposed to direct airflow!
- helix uses a custom core built specifically for this platform, we don't use an off the shelf core IE we are not stuck with what's available or what works!
-since we have 5-6 more charge rows we can use a much higher density fin pack without causing pressure drop issues.
-the mass of the helix fmic is the highest on the market this mass holds off heatsoak longer than a lighter fmic!

I hope this explains some things o
for you! We have sold over 200 fmics and everyone who has independently tested has datalogged this impossible data!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clap135 View Post
lol these results are funny cause they are impossible. The helix has a 86% efficiency with a .5psi pressure drop. Yeaaa lol. From the vendors post

turbo outlet temperature 228 degrees F(estimated using a 63 degree ambient and 65% compressor efficiency at 13.5 psi)
AIT temp- 75 degrees F - 54 degree drop over stock
pre and post intercooler temp drop- 153 degrees F
Intercooler efficiency- 93% - 33% improvement in efficiency over stock
Core pressure drop spec is .5psi at 450hp(600cfm) airflow

Can you explain how you estimated outlet temperature without rpm? Also please post compressor map you are using.
Like stated above 93% efficiency with .5 psi pressure drop is simply impossible
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-16-2010, 12:17 AM   #194
Clap135
Brigadier General
 
Clap135's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 N54
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sticky's Mom House

Posts: 3,464
iTrader: (1)

So can you post the compressor map? Also wierd how you can estimate a outlet temp with out actual engine rpm, but your a vendor for helix so you're forgiven lol
Clap135 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-16-2010, 07:01 AM   #195
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management
Major
 
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Abarth 500
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NJ

Posts: 1,158
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clap135 View Post
So can you post the compressor map? Also wierd how you can estimate a outlet temp with out actual engine rpm, but your a vendor for helix so you're forgiven lol
the outlet % is not estimated its taken from a datalogged outlet temp with rpm from a vendors post (this actual end outlet temp is how we come to the compressor efficiency and using the log you could actually map the compressor at that boost level) I dont know what beef you have with Helix, but all of these computations come from independant datalogs and are 100% fair and representative of each fmic at the end of a 2-3-4 gear run,all of these fmics are subject to the same criteria as much of it does not vary.) this calculator is based in the laws of physics and is unbiased and pretty damn accurate as well, the use of independant end user logs takes away any vendor BS... I see you are running CP-E stuff can you do some 2-3-4 gear testing? post all the data for everyone to see since there is no independant CPe data posted on this thread yet.

Last edited by TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management; 05-16-2010 at 07:08 AM.
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-16-2010, 08:29 AM   #196
Clap135
Brigadier General
 
Clap135's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 N54
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sticky's Mom House

Posts: 3,464
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TTurboBullett View Post
the outlet % is not estimated its taken from a datalogged outlet temp with rpm from a vendors post (this actual end outlet temp is how we come to the compressor efficiency and using the log you could actually map the compressor at that boost level) I dont know what beef you have with Helix, but all of these computations come from independant datalogs and are 100% fair and representative of each fmic at the end of a 2-3-4 gear run,all of these fmics are subject to the same criteria as much of it does not vary.) this calculator is based in the laws of physics and is unbiased and pretty damn accurate as well, the use of independant end user logs takes away any vendor BS... I see you are running CP-E stuff can you do some 2-3-4 gear testing? post all the data for everyone to see since there is no independant CPe data posted on this thread yet.
can you post that information then? I simply would like to see it. I have no beef, I want you to prove your claims though. Me posting and 2nd-4th gear log won't show you anything because it won't show you outside temps, and it won't show you compressor temps.
Clap135 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-16-2010, 10:26 AM   #197
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management
Major
 
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Abarth 500
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NJ

Posts: 1,158
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clap135 View Post
can you post that information then? I simply would like to see it. I have no beef, I want you to prove your claims though. Me posting and 2nd-4th gear log won't show you anything because it won't show you outside temps, and it won't show you compressor temps.
as the earlier threads state you notate ambient temps and boost levels the calculator does the rest, on another note all of the constants remain the same between manufacturers the inputs that change are taken directy from the logs using this calculator which follows the laws of physics give a very good idea as to how these units perform in the real world...so yes posting an independant datalog will show alot IE it will show the heatsoak trend across 3 gears in direct comparison to other FMICs, as you can see by the posted data some intercoolers fend off heat soak very well others not so good... I believe the graphs you are looking for are a few pages ago, one of the manufacturers posted actual compressor outlet temps across gears, using these numbers you can reverse calculate the compressor efficiency at any given rpm/boost point using the calculator. there is really no beef because the data is what it is its simple physics and if an intercooler doesn't perform as expected or as well as advertised take it up with the manufacturer... Personally id rather get all the independant data on the table and let the results speak for themselves, so end users and potential customers can make an educated decision NOT based on a sales pitch or buying a fmic cause xyz company made it so it must be good---look at the datalogs look at the heatsoak trends look and use the calculator using the data provided and come to your own conclusions.

BTW heres the pic of the compressor outlet temps:

Last edited by TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management; 05-16-2010 at 10:39 AM.
TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-16-2010, 11:25 AM   #198
mkiv
2JZ
 
Drives: E92 335i AW/CR
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: 温哥华Vancouver

Posts: 816
iTrader: (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TTurboBullett View Post
as the earlier threads state you notate ambient temps and boost levels the calculator does the rest, on another note all of the constants remain the same between manufacturers the inputs that change are taken directy from the logs using this calculator which follows the laws of physics give a very good idea as to how these units perform in the real world...so yes posting an independant datalog will show alot IE it will show the heatsoak trend across 3 gears in direct comparison to other FMICs, as you can see by the posted data some intercoolers fend off heat soak very well others not so good... I believe the graphs you are looking for are a few pages ago, one of the manufacturers posted actual compressor outlet temps across gears, using these numbers you can reverse calculate the compressor efficiency at any given rpm/boost point using the calculator. there is really no beef because the data is what it is its simple physics and if an intercooler doesn't perform as expected or as well as advertised take it up with the manufacturer... Personally id rather get all the independant data on the table and let the results speak for themselves, so end users and potential customers can make an educated decision NOT based on a sales pitch or buying a fmic cause xyz company made it so it must be good---look at the datalogs look at the heatsoak trends look and use the calculator using the data provided and come to your own conclusions.

BTW heres the pic of the compressor outlet temps:
is that ets fmic ?
mkiv is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:13 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST