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      04-18-2010, 05:03 AM   #1
///ajd
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19" RFTs vs 17" non-RFTs

Just taken my 19" rims off my car so I can leave them with my garage this week and get some new rubber on. I've put on my 17" winter tyres in the meantime (so my better half doesn't have to spend any time waiting at the garage and faffing with baby seats etc.).

Tyre Pressures 17" 2.3, 2.7 bar, 19" 2.6, 3.0 bar as per door post.

Having driven the car I can report:

1. Ride
On 19" RFTs, cats eyes feel like you are running over mini bricks. 18"s weren't much softer.
On the 17"s non-RFTs, the same cats eyes are barely noticable. Its an amazing difference!

2. Handling
On 19" RFTs, the handling is superbly sharp and very planted. Similar to 18"s, but even better.
On 17" non-RFTs, the car wallows much more, and feels much softer at the back particularly - it feels like it rolls more, which must be the give in the tyre.

Now the difference in tyre pressure will have some impact, but even so I was surprised how different they were. I much confess if my coming 19" non-RFTs are anywere near as wallowy as the 17"s then I won't like it! I do hope they won't be.


19"s



17"s



(looking at the bottom picture, you'd have to say the E46 was a much better proportioned design)
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      04-18-2010, 03:03 PM   #2
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Keep us posted on the 19's with normal rubber and your thoughts on them.
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      04-19-2010, 02:00 PM   #3
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Just out of interest how much did it cost you for the 19" 225s?

I have the M Sport 17 inchers and am currently looking at getting new tyres for it. However, i've started to think the current cars wheels are a bit on the small side and liked the 225s but don't want to spend BMW prices on them.

Also worried bout getting used wheels off Ebay cause these 225s were the ones that suffered structural failures and cracked and don't want to pay for wheels that have cracked and been refurbed.
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      04-19-2010, 03:08 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///ajd View Post
Just taken my 19" rims off my car so I can leave them with my garage this week and get some new rubber on. I've put on my 17" winter tyres in the meantime (so my better half doesn't have to spend any time waiting at the garage and faffing with baby seats etc.).
You've msport suspension? I've changed mine from 18" 193M RFT's to wintertyres (16" BBS rims i had left over from previous E46 with Falken HS439 225/55 (one size up no RFT)) and expected a world of silence. Not so car doesn't handle as crispy but no major improvement in comfort from the bridgestones. The larger tyre size looks way better on the car imho though. Just changed back to the 193's, and again no major detoriation in confort, but it steers quite a bit better.
I think the msport suspension does a lot. I'm considering Koni FSD if shocks when they need replacing.
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      04-24-2010, 01:31 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveF1 View Post
Just out of interest how much did it cost you for the 19" 225s?

I have the M Sport 17 inchers and am currently looking at getting new tyres for it. However, i've started to think the current cars wheels are a bit on the small side and liked the 225s but don't want to spend BMW prices on them.

Also worried bout getting used wheels off Ebay cause these 225s were the ones that suffered structural failures and cracked and don't want to pay for wheels that have cracked and been refurbed.
I got them from ebay last summer - from a tyre place that had taken them in part ex - they came with the RFTs, that were already showing some signs of rear inner edge wear, but good tread. I've got about 8k miles out of them since then, so not too bad. I stalked the auction and got them for under 700 even though there was quite a bit of interest - all wheels had very minor scuffs that had been refurbed with some body filler & rattle cans (! - hardly a perfect finish be looks OK from 6 yards away, and not something that was going to bother me - you can't notice in the pictures for instance). I was well aware of the 225 cracking issue at the time I bought them and confirmed with the seller that they had no cracks before bidding - the seller confirmed this.

I then checked this was the case on collection, and would have walked if not the case (OK to do as they would have been misdescribed in the advert/dialogue so my commitment to buy would have been broken). It is pretty obvious if they are cracked, or even repaired, as in the latter case the original factory finish will almost certainly not be present (look at an OEM wheel on the inside to see what I mean - its not a glossy finish on the inside like it is on the face of the wheel). My wheels were as described, scuffing abit worse than expected, but basically no fiundamental problems. So - you can buy from ebay but you do have to manage the risks.

I was relieved to still find no cracks in mine last week, so hopefully my alloys will have a long life now they will get some non-RFT rubber and a more cushioned, less impact shock driven time on our pot holed roads.

I like the 17" M Sport wheels by the way - prefer them to the 18"s if I'm honest. The 19"s do look good though.

Last edited by ///ajd; 04-24-2010 at 02:18 AM.
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      04-24-2010, 01:34 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F104 View Post
You've msport suspension? I've changed mine from 18" 193M RFT's to wintertyres (16" BBS rims i had left over from previous E46 with Falken HS439 225/55 (one size up no RFT)) and expected a world of silence. Not so car doesn't handle as crispy but no major improvement in comfort from the bridgestones. The larger tyre size looks way better on the car imho though. Just changed back to the 193's, and again no major detoriation in confort, but it steers quite a bit better.
I think the msport suspension does a lot. I'm considering Koni FSD if shocks when they need replacing.
My winters are also Falken EUROWINTERS, 17" 205/50R17 from my last E46. The E91 car is an MSport which always come with M Sport suspension in the UK. Then handling is much softer, wallowy, on the winters but these tyres really help soak up bumps.

Is there such a thing as comfort on Belgian roads? (ours aren't any better)

Last edited by ///ajd; 04-24-2010 at 02:18 AM.
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      04-25-2010, 06:52 AM   #7
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I've just had a week off the 330d and have only driven the 911 during the week. I must confess now that I jump back in the 330d on 17" nonRfts the handling is actually ok. It seemed like an 'important' difference between the 17" and 19" last week, but on reflection the handling isn't actually bad as such on 17"s - not as sharp, bit still sharp enough, if that makes sense. It'll be interesting to see what 19" non Rfts are like next week.
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      04-27-2010, 01:51 PM   #8
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Just tried the new 19" 452 Falken tyres on the car.

I used the same pressures as with the RFTs - 2.6bar front, 3.0bar rear.

Well, I must say I'm surprised to say it feels almost half way between the 19" RFTs and 17" non-RFT winter tyres - I was expecting it to feel more like the 19" RFTs. The ride is no doubt better than the 19" RFTs, but the handling is noticably a bit less sharp - certainly from the rear (it does have a marginally higher profile as they are 265/30, not 255/30).

Early days, I need to drive it a bit more, but must confess I'm left wondering whether I prefer the RFTs even though they are a bit harsh at times.....
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      04-28-2010, 02:42 AM   #9
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You will have to run much higher pressures to get the turn in back, I have noticed it too.
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      04-28-2010, 03:09 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///ajd View Post
Just tried the new 19" 452 Falken tyres on the car.

I used the same pressures as with the RFTs - 2.6bar front, 3.0bar rear.

Well, I must say I'm surprised to say it feels almost half way between the 19" RFTs and 17" non-RFT winter tyres - I was expecting it to feel more like the 19" RFTs. The ride is no doubt better than the 19" RFTs, but the handling is noticably a bit less sharp - certainly from the rear (it does have a marginally higher profile as they are 265/30, not 255/30).

Early days, I need to drive it a bit more, but must confess I'm left wondering whether I prefer the RFTs even though they are a bit harsh at times.....
If you have 19" rims what size Falkens did you have fitted to the rear wheels?
The closest match I can see is 265/30/19; is that what you have and, if so, is it ok to fit a 265 on a rim designed for 255?
The reason I ask is that I'm also thinking of changing my Bridgestones and Falkens appear to be highly recommended.

PS: sorry, I didn't fully read your comments. I now see that you do have 265's on the rears, but I'd still like to know if it's ok to have them fitted on a 255 rim - thanks.
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      04-28-2010, 04:33 AM   #11
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I switched from RFT RE050s to Falken ZE912s in a 17" 50 profile about 3 months ago and noticed the loss of turn-in. A couple of things that I've learned since:

1) Make sure your pressures are accurate and measured when properly cold. My old compressor was about 2psi low and getting the right door card pressures in after the car had been standing overnight in the garage made a difference.

2) My tyres gain about 4psi when warmed up and they feel sharper. I've added 0.2bar to the cold pressures and feel they have regained a lot of the turn-in of the RFTs without losing the ride quality.
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      04-28-2010, 04:40 AM   #12
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Don't forget you're on 17" winter tyres which will be like jelly in these temperatures, all over the place.

You can't compare the two really.
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      04-28-2010, 06:06 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///ajd View Post



Well, I must say I'm surprised to say it feels almost half way between the 19" RFTs and 17" non-RFT winter tyres - I was expecting it to feel more like the 19" RFTs. The ride is no doubt better than the 19" RFTs, but the handling is noticably a bit less sharp - certainly from the rear (it does have a marginally higher profile as they are 265/30, not 255/30).
When you don't change 'like for like' sizing, you really can't make a proper comparison. You have now built in a 'variable' without any reference. Different lateral stiffness and displacement will change the feel.

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      04-29-2010, 02:03 PM   #14
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I only managed to get my Dunlop Winter sports off the Audi A6 last week and they were getting almost comical on the really warm days.
Just going to PS2s on the same wheel was a massive difference.
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