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      10-07-2010, 07:45 AM   #111
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Did someone say that you get money from the government for having kids!!!

WTF is all that about

Should be heavily taxed for introducing more little twats into the world

BTW, why do they keep saying it's a universal benefit when you only get it if you have kids! (I know, the clue is in the name...)
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      10-07-2010, 08:01 AM   #112
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I have recently taken a new stance on the state of our country, state of our politics, immigration, welfare, education – the whole thing.

I genuinely think life is too short to worry about it, and I am not sticking my head in the sand either. A couple of points 1- there is absolutely nothing I can do about it, yes I can go and speak to my local MP, I can write to 10 Downing St, start a petition etc – but it wont do anything. 2 – If I am being honest, I don’t really care about the people who are gonna be seriously effected by benefit cuts, I’m sorry I don’t. I have two children, one of which has just recently popped into the world and my sole focus is to make sure they are happy well fed and safe.

Currently (touching wood while writing this) money is ok, don’t get me wrong I would love to win the euro’s on Friday but I am not panicking every time I go to the cash machine and my life is pretty good. When things change, maybe I will have different outlook, but while life is good – I’m going to stopped worrying
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      10-07-2010, 08:21 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by - Paul - View Post
May I ask why stop bonuses of the public sector? Bonuses are there to drive performance (same as in the private sector) - do you not see an issue with stopping them?
Because I daresay that those in line to receive those bonuses are already on signifcant salaries and we are trying to pay down the deficit.

Do you think it's ok to remove child benefit which is supposed to be an incentive to have children (with a view to them supporting our aging population as they grow up and start working/paying taxes)?

You're implying that people who receive bonuses will stop performing to the best of their ability and performance levels would drop.

Using that logic, the removal of child benefit will disincentivise people from having children, or maybe they will have only one child per family. So you have an aging population with fewer an fewer working/contributing people younger than them for support.

Of course the world doesn't work like. People will still have children regardless of child benefit being taken away. In the same breath, those public sector workers who are in it for the bonus may (or may not) walk away from their jobs if bonuses are taken away. That doesn't mean there will not be many, many people willing to fill those posts for a basic salary that I imagine is a fair chunk over £50,000p/a.

Just a thought.
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      10-07-2010, 08:23 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by MB London View Post
I have recently taken a new stance on the state of our country, state of our politics, immigration, welfare, education Ė the whole thing.

I genuinely think life is too short to worry about it, and I am not sticking my head in the sand either. A couple of points 1- there is absolutely nothing I can do about it, yes I can go and speak to my local MP, I can write to 10 Downing St, start a petition etc Ė but it wont do anything. 2 Ė If I am being honest, I donít really care about the people who are gonna be seriously effected by benefit cuts, Iím sorry I donít. I have two children, one of which has just recently popped into the world and my sole focus is to make sure they are happy well fed and safe.

Currently (touching wood while writing this) money is ok, donít get me wrong I would love to win the euroís on Friday but I am not panicking every time I go to the cash machine and my life is pretty good. When things change, maybe I will have different outlook, but while life is good Ė Iím going to stopped worrying
Apathy helps no one.

To quote:

They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up.
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      10-07-2010, 08:25 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by doughboy View Post
You mean Uk citizens who can afford to live near the coast in the lovely south west?


Plenty like this round the corner from our 'nice' middle class street.....

I have no idea where that photo I posted was taken - just google imaged "British Landscapes." Just look a bit SWish though.

Just had an amazing lunchtime surf - hey the UK isn't bad...
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      10-07-2010, 08:28 AM   #116
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Matt,

You run your own business right?
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      10-07-2010, 08:40 AM   #117
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Toxic - yes we do. We even have a website now...!
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      10-07-2010, 08:43 AM   #118
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Out of interest, do you employ an accountant to limit your tax liability?
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      10-07-2010, 08:43 AM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toxicnerve View Post
Because I daresay that those in line to receive those bonuses are already on signifcant salaries and we are trying to pay down the deficit.

Do you think it's ok to remove child benefit which is supposed to be an incentive to have children (with a view to them supporting our aging population as they grow up and start working/paying taxes)?

You're implying that people who receive bonuses will stop performing to the best of their ability and performance levels would drop.

Using that logic, the removal of child benefit will disincentivise people from having children, or maybe they will have only one child per family. So you have an aging population with fewer an fewer working/contributing people younger than them for support.

Of course the world doesn't work like. People will still have children regardless of child benefit being taken away. In the same breath, those public sector workers who are in it for the bonus may (or may not) walk away from their jobs if bonuses are taken away. That doesn't mean there will not be many, many people willing to fill those posts for a basic salary that I imagine is a fair chunk over £50,000p/a.

Just a thought.
Not all are on significant salaries and some need their bonuses to go on holiday etc.

I do believe performance would drop - its an incentive to perform to your best and implement what the business wants. If people walk away into the private sector to earn those bonuses then their jobs will need to be filled. This in itself leads to poor performance in the short term whilst knowledge and experience is gained.

Dropping child benefit completely would reduce the population in my opinion (whether this is a good thing or bad is not what I'm discussing). The ones that can't afford kids without this benefit would have to think long and hard about whether they can live on the money they are receiving. A family with one partner earning 44k and the other one looking after the family (avoiding childcare costs) is on an everage income of 22k each. This is hardly big pay. In my opinion , they shoudn't have child benefit removed - it's scandalous.

"Cut your cloth" - "it's Labours fault" etc will not wash with me. These are my opinions
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      10-07-2010, 09:00 AM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by - Paul - View Post
Not all are on significant salaries and some need their bonuses to go on holiday etc.

I do believe performance would drop - its an incentive to perform to your best and implement what the business wants. If people walk away into the private sector to earn those bonuses then their jobs will need to be filled. This in itself leads to poor performance in the short term whilst knowledge and experience is gained.

Dropping child benefit completely would reduce the population in my opinion (whether this is a good thing or bad is not what I'm discussing). The ones that can't afford kids without this benefit would have to think long and hard about whether they can live on the money they are receiving. A family with one partner earning 44k and the other one looking after the family (avoiding childcare costs) is on an everage income of 22k each. This is hardly big pay. In my opinion , they shoudn't have child benefit removed - it's scandalous.

"Cut your cloth" - "it's Labours fault" etc will not wash with me. These are my opinions
My point is simply that the government should be looking inwards and making real savings rather than just taxing more.
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      10-07-2010, 09:20 AM   #121
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Originally Posted by toxicnerve View Post
Out of interest, do you employ an accountant to limit your tax liability?
Of course.

I fear I have just stepped into a big trap...
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      10-07-2010, 03:17 PM   #122
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As I have said before in the words of Neil Kinnock after being beaten by the Tories

“I warn you not to be ordinary, I warn you not to be young, I warn you not to fall ill, and I warn you not to grow old.”

and now we can add

I warn you not to have children!

I'm going to be £2500 down per year thanks to this! Just so that some stripey shirted bastards can have a big fat bonus in the city.

Yes and I know that I am a drama queen ;-)

Oops just realised that I was wearing a striped shirt!

Last edited by Boyd1963; 10-07-2010 at 04:34 PM.
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      10-08-2010, 03:05 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by acerboo View Post
i find you, your comments, inability to deabte and your foul language extremely offensive and see no point in answering you.
You my good sir are an idiot. Your arguments are full of double standards, you are clearly a snob, not as intelligent as you'd like people to think, and when you are loosing a debate you then insult me and say Im rude.

If you take the time to re read your posts you'll find it is you that is rude and offensive, and i have been countering your offensive posts, and the only debate your good for is a masdebate with your self.



Quote:
Originally Posted by toxicnerve View Post
My point is simply that the government should be looking inwards and making real savings rather than just taxing more.
i couldn't agree more. I feel though that the real savings from businesses are probably fraught with danger. Big business can fight the government us lot cant.
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      10-08-2010, 10:38 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve A View Post
You my good sir are an idiot. Your arguments are full of double standards, you are clearly a snob, not as intelligent as you'd like people to think, and when you are loosing a debate you then insult me and say Im rude.

If you take the time to re read your posts you'll find it is you that is rude and offensive, and i have been countering your offensive posts, and the only debate your good for is a masdebate with your self.





i couldn't agree more. I feel though that the real savings from businesses are probably fraught with danger. Big business can fight the government us lot cant.
You Sir are a true Socialist!
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      10-08-2010, 02:27 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toxicnerve View Post
My point is simply that the government should be looking inwards and making real savings rather than just taxing more.
Which is of course what they told us all they would do BEFORE the election.

Now they don't seem to give a damn.
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      10-09-2010, 03:46 AM   #126
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Swings and roundabouts

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Originally Posted by NFS View Post
Stupid Tory scumbag arsewipe twunting baronet

So the lying tossers are taking away our child benefit after all. Bloody Osbourne has just given every family with a higher rate tax payer a £3k paycut before tax.

Despite saying that he wouldn't do it before the election

Before the bastards were elected they were saying that the Tories would let families where one parent works share their tax allowances.

Obviously they didn't bother with that and to make matters worse they are now punishing families with a parent that looks after their kids again.

If 2 parents each earn £ 40K a year, they pay less tax (because they each have an allowance) and will still get full child benefit.

Wheras a family where one parent works and earns £ 80k a year, pay loads more tax (because they can't share allowances) and they lose their child benefit.

What happened to family values and the big society??? It's patently unfair.

A family with a parent earning £ 44k loses child benefit, but a family with 2 parents earning £ 80k between them keeps it? Idiots.
Cameron liked to talk about labour stealth taxes? This has a bigger impact on my family than any of those.

I hope all of the people that voted for these tossers are very happy.

At one stage in our history, households were taxed as a single entity. Dual salaries were added together, a married couples' allowance applied (regardless of the number of incomes), the number of dependents counted and the same allowances given for each.

Would answer all your points...a 2 x £35K income family paid the same as a 1 x £70 income family and every dependent was treated equally. Then along came Labour.

So now you've got a Coalition Government tinkering with the broken and iniquitous system they inherited.

There's no easy way to fix huge indebtedness and a nation addicted to benefits using a tax system that's been mercilessly milked and exploited for 13years. By definition, any fix is going to be unfair because its based on a fundamentally unfair system designed to favour a section of the population to the detrement of the rest. As it unwinds, all are going to suffer in one way or another.
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