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      12-09-2010, 08:12 AM   #1
m@rk
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BMW Technical Support

I seem to have hit a stalemate between BMW UK and my dealer.

I have a problem with my car and the dealer is telling me that the computer is not showing a fault so there is nothing they can do.

BMW UK are telling me that they have no technical resource and that any technical resource they do have is back with the dealers.

But if my dealer does not know the answer who does?

Somebody must have designed the car, specified it, spent millions on R&D and subjected each and every component to QA.

Even for the sensor I am having problems with, somebody must have designed it, somebody must have coded the firmware to make it work an so on.

So somebody MUST know how the thing is coded and made and I am guessing that they may be outside of the UK but how do I make contact.

At the moment, I have a function on my car that no longer works thanks to the actions of my dealer yet they are claiming that even though it worked before, because the computer says no, there is nothing they can do.

HELP!
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      12-09-2010, 08:22 AM   #2
creepy coupe
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Have you tried another dealer or an indie?
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      12-09-2010, 08:32 AM   #3
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What the fuck. They broke it, are unable to fix it: And that's YOUR problem?

No luck with BMW CS UK? Take this to trading standards if you have the documents to back this up. This is ridiculous.

By the way: What dealer network? Coopers no doubt?

If its Sytner then drop Anneka a mail fro some advice...
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      12-09-2010, 08:33 AM   #4
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Ask your dealer if they employ mechanics, or if they are just an IT support desk? A good one for Auto Express or one of the other motoring mags to follow up on pehaps. The 'computer says no' attitude of some stealers is apalling.
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      12-09-2010, 08:43 AM   #5
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Hi Mark, I can't promise that I can help sort this and by no means am I a technician, but in case someone either at my dealership or on the forum can help/has experienced similar, can you clarify the exact problem that you are experiencing and what was done to bring it about?

Thanks in advance
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      12-09-2010, 09:31 AM   #6
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You Could Try This Local Independent

Forest Motors Lincoln.

Ask for Derek (the Owner) 01522 567824

He has great knowledge and experience (and a 335D)

Magnon
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      12-09-2010, 10:06 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m@rk View Post
At the moment, I have a function on my car that no longer works thanks to the actions of my dealer yet they are claiming that even though it worked before, because the computer says no, there is nothing they can do.

HELP!
What's the problem? no one can help without any details..
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      12-09-2010, 11:18 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anneka @ Sytner View Post
Hi Mark, I can't promise that I can help sort this and by no means am I a technician, but in case someone either at my dealership or on the forum can help/has experienced similar, can you clarify the exact problem that you are experiencing and what was done to bring it about?

Thanks in advance
Sure

I have mentioned this in another thread but back in September Sycamore in Peterborough replace the windscreen on my 08MY 335D touring.

As part of the work, the sensor for the rain sensing wipers was replaced. We have established that some of the components have been redesigned by BMW in the last couple of years even though they carry the same part number.

So since buying the car new 3 years ago, if it has looked like rain, all I have needed to do is press the button on the end of the wiper stalk, leave the sensitivity dial set a couple of stops down from maximum and forget about it.

If it has started to spot with rain, the wipers have done their thing.

If it has started to rain harder, not a problem.

And if it has started to rain even harder, then the wipers have gone faster.

A good example has been when passing a truck on the motorway. As you pass the thing with all the spray etc, the wipers have detected this and gone faster. Once past the truck, they go back to normal speed or wherever they were before. Not a problem. In the time I have had the car I have NEVER had to manually over ride the automatic setting.

Now I have my new screen with it's new sensor.

When it starts to rain, the wipers do detect this.

When it rains harder the wipers come on faster.

But when I overtake a truck, 9 times out of 10, they don't go faster still so I am left trying to work out how to make my wipers go faster as I can no longer see where I am going and of course from the auto setting, this means moving the stalk twice to get to the faster setting. Not a very safe situation to be in.

I have put brand new wiper blades on the car as I do know this can make a difference and we have proven (by hanging an engineer out of the passenger window with a squity bottle) that eventually, the wipers will automatically go onto full speed.

So whilst things do work of a fashion, the sensitivity of the things is way way down on where it was before to the point of being of no use to me any more. If the wipers are not going fast enough to clear the water off the screen to the point I can see, what's the point?

So because they do detect water, my dealer tells me there is no fault found!

In other words, I have reached a "computer says no" scenario.

So there must be a way to increase the sensitivity of these things further. But nobody knows how.

So does anybody have any clues (yes the stalk setting is set to the maximum)?

It worked 100% before. Now I can't rely on it to give me clear vision when driving in poor conditions. This is to me a safety concern and is actually enough to have me now getting a different car.
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      12-09-2010, 11:29 AM   #9
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Sounds daft, but you do realise the sensitivity is adjusted by the thumb ratchet thing on the same stalk?
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      12-09-2010, 11:44 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by creepy coupe View Post
Sounds daft, but you do realise the sensitivity is adjusted by the thumb ratchet thing on the same stalk?
I was about to say, push the sensitivity up to the 2nd to top slot or even the top setting.

I have no idea how it detects rain, i assume is monitoring frequency of vibrations or so. Is it flush against the screen?
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      12-09-2010, 11:46 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m@rk View Post
leave the sensitivity dial set a couple of stops down from maximum .
Seems to me he's done that.
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      12-09-2010, 11:53 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by briers View Post
I have no idea how it detects rain, i assume is monitoring frequency of vibrations or so. Is it flush against the screen?
It just applies the law of averages by visually detecting how many drops land on the small sensor area and assuming the same drops-per-area have fallen over the whole screen.

If no drops land on the sensor it won't operate, thats why for example, a big drip from a bridge that may only land on one place on the screen won't set the wipers going if they are on auto.

The sensitivity is tricky as its quite a subjective point, but the OPs car seems to have changed when the screen was changed.

OP - was is a genuine BMW marked windscreen?

You say the sensor has changed, but the part number is the same. This is strange, as usually the same part when updated gets a new number so they can track the finish / start of new parts. For example, the high pressure pumps on 335i's, although they all look the same, each iteration has a new number.
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      12-09-2010, 12:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doughboy View Post

OP - was is a genuine BMW marked windscreen?
Yes. Right down to a new Achtung sticker as well

Quote:
You say the sensor has changed, but the part number is the same. This is strange, as usually the same part when updated gets a new number so they can track the finish / start of new parts. For example, the high pressure pumps on 335i's, although they all look the same, each iteration has a new number.
Well getting a straight answer is proving problematic.

When i look at the plastic cover up behind the mirror, it used to be that the whole cover met the roof line at the top of the windscreen. Now, there is a plastic cover behind the mirror and then like a ribbed umbilical that runs up to the roof line instead. I have been told that the design has been changed.

Now it maybe that the sensor itself inside this cover is the same but seeing that the whole box has changed, suggests not.

As you can see from the quote attached, there were a number of "new" bits fitted. All I can be 100% sure of is that what is there now is physically different to what was there before

PS

To the others that have mentioned the adjustment on the stalk, yes I have played with it.
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      12-09-2010, 01:31 PM   #14
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Have they got glue or dirt between the sensor and glass?
Grap a torch and see if its all aligned properly.
My boss had a similar issue and it took a couple of attempts to fix this.
The screen had a different dot mask to the original IIRC and it messed up the sensor which is optical.
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      12-10-2010, 03:57 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m@rk View Post
this means moving the stalk twice to get to the faster setting. Not a very safe situation to be in.

This is to me a safety concern and is actually enough to have me now getting a different car.
I can see your point but also the dealers point - I mean, how many times would this really bother an average driver?? How did we all manage without wipers that turn themselves on automatically! Just move your right fingers 2 inches and turn em on!!

You would actually SELL your car because of this??

Read through some of the recent threads of people losing close relatives, pets dying, cars being crashed into & written off, etc... surely the small inconvenience issue with your wipers is not for losing sleep over Not worth getting so wound up over IMO.
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      12-10-2010, 08:55 AM   #16
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OP - I share your frustration. This happened with my wife's Pathfinder. I can honestly say that the wiper sensitivity is not what the original OEM screen was. The sensor is built into the windscreen so there is no way to change it...
The only saving grace for us is that 2 weeks after it was replaced it was cracked again (talk about bad luck!) so we're patiently waiting until January when it can be replaced FOC (a spot repair was done to prevent the crack spreading).
I'm certain that the wipers don't work any way as well as the original screen but like yourself there isn't anything actually broken.
I wish you well in your quest!

S.
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      12-10-2010, 04:41 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3-FAST View Post
I can see your point but also the dealers point - I mean, how many times would this really bother an average driver?? How did we all manage without wipers that turn themselves on automatically! Just move your right fingers 2 inches and turn em on!!
One of those technologies that once you have lived with it, you don't want to do without. In my case it was one of those options I WANTED when I specified the car new as I have gotten used to them previously. I believe they are a great aid to safety.

Quote:
You would actually SELL your car because of this??
Previously my car was perfect. I could not fault it. As such, I had no desire to change it (as you can't improve on perfect). Now it's not.

Quote:
Read through some of the recent threads of people losing close relatives, pets dying, cars being crashed into & written off, etc... surely the small inconvenience issue with your wipers is not for losing sleep over Not worth getting so wound up over IMO.
Of course there are loads of things more important but that does not stop me being bothered by the fact that I am out of pocket. Going down the BMW route cost me a lot more than going with Autoglass via my insurer and the only reason I did it was to be sure that we did not end up with the very situation I now find myself in.

If they had not worked perfectly before then I cold have written them off as crap but the fact I have now lost a safety feature on my car and paid for the privilege!

I think I am justified in expecting the job to be done properly just like any other job I ask my dealer to do. I pay a premium price every time I walk through the dealers door. I therefore expect the job doing right.

So far they have done just 2 jobs for me and not done either right (the other problem was that they bodged the oil change by over filling the car with oil to a point where after 7,000 miles, the oil was still reading way over the max mark on the dipstick and they had to drain some out. Just how can you get an oil change wrong when you are charging 200 for it).

I am sure my dealer may start thinking differently when I start asking for that 700 back as they have not done the job I paid them for!
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      12-10-2010, 04:42 PM   #18
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I would lay odds that the rain sensor is not seated properly against the glass.
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      12-11-2010, 07:34 AM   #19
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Take it to Autoglass then for a second opinion.
If its wrong they will be only too happy to tell you
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