E90Post
 


GTB Performance
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Tracking, Autocrossing, Dragstrip, Driving Techniques > Track tires on E90 330 - how wide on 17x8.5?



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-19-2007, 11:27 AM   #1
CinciE92M3
Livin' the dream...
 
CinciE92M3's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 M3 Coupe
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cincinnati, OH

Posts: 77
iTrader: (0)

Track tires on E90 330 - how wide on 17x8.5?

I'm going to be buying a set of dedicated track tires for Autocross and DE events this year. I've already got 17"x8.5" Kosei wheels, but I'm looking for recommendations on tire sizes. I have two main questions:

1) I've heard mixed messaged on whether to keep the same tire width on all 4 tires, or to keep the rears wider. What's the conventional wisdom for track tires?

2) Assuming all 4 tires are the same width, does anyone know the widest tire that will not rub in the front wheel wells?

My current "safe" plan is a 235/45-17, but I'd like to a bit wider if possible.

Thanks!
__________________
2008 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Interlagos Blue Metallic | Silver Novillo Leather | ZCW | ZPP | ZTP | 19" Double Spoke | HD/Sat/PDC
CinciE92M3 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-20-2007, 04:40 PM   #2
BMWMICHAEL_52
Client Advisor, BMW West Springfield, MA
 
Drives: 2007 E90 ALPINE WHITE
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: GRANBY, CT

Posts: 17
iTrader: (0)

try this link Tirerack's Hoosier Tire specs page

Looks like 245 would be the maximum for a 8.5" rim
BMWMICHAEL_52 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-21-2007, 12:24 AM   #3
bnj
Banned
 
Drives: e92 335i
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Helsinki

Posts: 1,137
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWMICHAEL_52 View Post
try this link Tirerack's Hoosier Tire specs page

Looks like 245 would be the maximum for a 8.5" rim
Bmw puts 255 on 8.5" on 335. It's too wide for the wheel for track use though imho.
bnj is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-21-2007, 04:34 PM   #4
CinciE92M3
Livin' the dream...
 
CinciE92M3's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 M3 Coupe
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cincinnati, OH

Posts: 77
iTrader: (0)

It looks like 235s might be the best bet. Any thoughts on staggering for track use? 235s all around would work, but would there be any benefit to 245s or 255s for the rears?
__________________
2008 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Interlagos Blue Metallic | Silver Novillo Leather | ZCW | ZPP | ZTP | 19" Double Spoke | HD/Sat/PDC
CinciE92M3 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-22-2007, 11:43 AM   #5
Gary@TireRack
Moderator
 
Gary@TireRack's Avatar
 
Drives: Formerly 1995 M3
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: South Bend, IN, Tire Rack HQ

Posts: 4,360
iTrader: (2)

For track use most eliminate the stagger for more neutral handling and ease of rotation.

http://www.tirerack.com/a.jsp?a=AH8&...ires/index.jsp
__________________
Gary
Tire and Wheel Forum Moderator. Tire Rack Sales Rep
Gary@Tirerack.com
http://www.tirerack.com/a.jsp?a=AH8&url=index.jsp

Please refer to 'Gary' as your previous contact when you order online.
Gary@TireRack is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-22-2007, 12:23 PM   #6
E30M3Driver
Captain
 
E30M3Driver's Avatar
 
Drives: E92 335is, 89 M3, 12 Wrangler
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Here, there

Posts: 777
iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2007 BMW 335i  [4.00]
1989 BMW M3  [4.10]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cinci330i View Post
It looks like 235s might be the best bet. Any thoughts on staggering for track use? 235s all around would work, but would there be any benefit to 245s or 255s for the rears?
You really want the bigger rears so that the rear end has as much grip as possible. This is especially true since the E90/92 has no limited slip. In the E36 M3, I ran 245's on 7.5/8.5 stock wheels and in some cases 245f/255r depending on the actual width of particular tires.

In your case, if you can't go to at least 245 in the front, then you would ideally want to run 235f/245r or preferably 235f/255r. In other words, max out the tire size you can on both axles. If you can eliminate the stagger using that approach, so much the better, but the width is more important than the stagger particularly if it is minimized. Without camber plates, lowering, custom wheel offsets and fender rolling, I doubt you can get wider than a 235 in the front. You can always use other tuning tricks to help counteract the understeering traits from the staggered tire size. This is the approach that most people have had to take with the E46 M3 since it is impossible to get same size tires on stock wheels without making the rears too narrow-I preferred 245/275 on mine for example even after I ran 245/265 which was still pretty loose.

My concern is if you stay with 235s on the rear, the rear will be so loose you will be getting wheel spin very easily and the car will be over rotating on even simple gates and transitions making car control much more challenging-it will look cool, but you will be frustrated.

Good luck!
__________________


Performance Center Delivery, June 21, 2013: 2013 E92 335is | Le Mans Blue | Gray Leather with Black | 6MT | 19" Style 313's | Michelin Pilot Super Sports | BMW Carbon Fiber Rear Spoiler |
E30M3Driver is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-22-2007, 02:21 PM   #7
CinciE92M3
Livin' the dream...
 
CinciE92M3's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 M3 Coupe
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cincinnati, OH

Posts: 77
iTrader: (0)

OK, here's where my ignorance comes in... can someone explain "stagger" vs. "different width front and rear tires" ? I (mistakenly?) thought they were one in the same.

My stock tires are 225f, 255r on 18" rims, so I'm guessing I can put a 255 on my 17" rims for the rears. I'm not sure how to check if 245s would rub on the front... maybe I can try taking some measurements with the wheel turned to its stop.

Thanks!
__________________
2008 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Interlagos Blue Metallic | Silver Novillo Leather | ZCW | ZPP | ZTP | 19" Double Spoke | HD/Sat/PDC
CinciE92M3 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-01-2007, 11:21 AM   #8
Adham
Second Lieutenant
 
Adham's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i sedan
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Dallas, TX

Posts: 245
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to Adham
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cinci330i View Post
OK, here's where my ignorance comes in... can someone explain "stagger" vs. "different width front and rear tires" ? I (mistakenly?) thought they were one in the same.

My stock tires are 225f, 255r on 18" rims, so I'm guessing I can put a 255 on my 17" rims for the rears. I'm not sure how to check if 245s would rub on the front... maybe I can try taking some measurements with the wheel turned to its stop.

Thanks!
staggering just means different widths front and rear, thats all.

My strong suggestion is that you go with the same size front and rear. there is validity to the claim that since we have no LSD we should maximize grip in the rear, but at the limit you want some slip angle, not to be pushing through the cones of all the turns due to understeer. Also, like gary from the tirerack said, it will maximize the life of your tires due to ease of rotation. If you see one tire cording, you can rotate it and get a few more sessions out of it, but you cant do that if you stagger. 10 extra mm in the rear is definitely not worth giving up the ease of rotation.
__________________
Adham is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-01-2007, 12:33 PM   #9
S4to335
Brigadier General
 
Drives: 95 Audi S6
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: San Jose, CA

Posts: 4,377
iTrader: (5)

Garage List
One thing to remember....R compound tires run WAY wider than conventional tires. I have seen some Hoosiers that were mega wide for the size show on the side of the tire. I had a set of R3S03s before...on my 325i race car...btw, they flat spot really easily.
__________________

Car is now gone .... :-(
S4to335 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      04-01-2007, 01:09 PM   #10
Adham
Second Lieutenant
 
Adham's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i sedan
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Dallas, TX

Posts: 245
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to Adham
Quote:
Originally Posted by S4to335 View Post
One thing to remember....R compound tires run WAY wider than conventional tires. I have seen some Hoosiers that were mega wide for the size show on the side of the tire. I had a set of R3S03s before...on my 325i race car...btw, they flat spot really easily.
true, but i dont know if he said he was actually doing r-comps or not. with an r-comp, 235 on an 8.5in kosei should be PLENTY.
__________________
Adham is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-02-2007, 05:39 PM   #11
rsjames
Private First Class
 
Drives: 07 335i Montego Blue
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Orange County, Calif.

Posts: 122
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adham View Post
staggering just means different widths front and rear, thats all.
Stagger refers to different circumference tires from SIDE TO SIDE, not front to rear. It used on oval tracks to help the car in the corners (right side of the car travels farther than the left). The tradeoff is that the rear tires (rear-wheel-drive car) slip in relation to each other on the straights.

Now, as to the original question... It is possible to mount a 285 section tire on an 8-inch rim, but it takes some skill. So a 295, maybe even a 305, might be possible on an 8.5-inch rim. That is not to say, however, that it will work on a particular car - the tire might rub.

I don't know the maximum width tire that will work on either end of the e90, but I sure would like to find out if someone knows.

Richard
rsjames is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      04-11-2007, 01:18 PM   #12
will335iad
Private First Class
 
Drives: 07 335i Saloon, E39 M5
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Abu Dhabi

Posts: 104
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2007 335i  [0.00]
could I put my E39 M5 wheels and tires on my rear end of the 335i? They are as follows 91/2JX18 ET:22 with 275 40 18 Yokohama tires, I am just wanting to use them for a short run where I need max traction.
Will
will335iad is offline   England
0
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:15 PM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST