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      01-18-2011, 06:10 PM   #23
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1-1.5 gram of protein per pound of your weight
Consume 3 Gainer shakes a day that are hi in calories , but watch for extreme levels of fat.
Eat 3-5 solid meals a day along with your shakes, have a little bit of everything from the food pyramid. ALWAYS have a good breakfast.
Take your daily vitamins , amino acids, and fish oil .
Make sure you have good sleep and plenty of it.
Lift nice and heavy

I would run that for atleast 3 months, then eliminate the gainer shakes, eat 3-4 solid meals a day, and then start playing with some pre-workout and post workout formulas.
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      01-18-2011, 08:06 PM   #24
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I'm assuming you want to gain muscle mass weight and not fatty weight (the latter can be done just by eating junk and fast foods).

To gain muscle weight, you must do two things:
  • Exercise your muscles so they will grow. This basically means lifting weights. There are a wide variety of approaches to lifting and most all of them work. What matters is which one is right for you at your current condition. There are approaches for folks who are already well developed, approaches for folks who are effectively just starting, approaches for targeting specific objectives, and so on.

    If you haven't been pursuing a weight training regimen, you'll want to start out with a basic program that focuses on developing strength in your body parts as well as developing your core -- abs and back -- muscle strength and control. Indeed, you'll need to do basic strength training -- which will build mass -- before you really focus on the major mass building techniques. The reason for this is so you don't hurt yourself when you really start piling on the weights and so that you learn the correct form for all your exercises. Indeed, if you do an exercise using perfect form, you'll get the most out of it.

    Now, as for how to get started, I'd recommend a personal trainer. I started with one and worked with him five days a week for a year. It did wonders. Not only did it make working out fun -- and I can assure you I don't, even now, think working out is that much fun -- but it made sure I got the absolute maximum out of my workouts. If you don't go with a trainer, you're going to have to go to a book store.
  • Eat right to both feed your muscle growth as well as prevent your body from thinking there's a "famine." So what's the famine thing?

    Your body needs nourishment all day long. When you let your body go for extended periods without food, it thinks there's a famine and when it has extra calories, it will store them as fat rather than burning them off.

    You prevent the famine perception by eating small meals all day long -- every 2-3 hours. A small meal is basically an amount of food roughly equal to the size of your fist. I tend to go with oatmeal with brown sugar and fruit, and a small bit of salmon in the a.m. about 45 min to an hour before working out. A few grapes or a banana or other small bit of fruit during my workout. A piece of fruit right after the workout. Then I do a protein shake and a full on meal -- this tends to be my largest meal of the day. It'll have protein, complex carbs, and fats. If I'm in a hurry, I may go to Chipotle and get a burrito bowl: black beans, chicken, tomato salsa, corn salsa and lemon juice. For the rest of the day, it's small things like a PB&J sandwich, fruits and nuts, and other complex carbs to keep my body fueled. I'll have some fish, chicken or turkey or lean pork in the evening and then one or two more small meals before going to bed.

    In addition to preventing famine, you should seek to eat as many calories as your body will burn. Don't eat fewer or you will lose weight. If you eat more, and you aren't effectively preventing the famine, you'll gain weight, but it'll be fat. Just make sure you are feeding your muscles enough protein so they can repair themselves from the lifting. This is how they grow. A good trainer can help you figure out what the right proportion of protein, fat and carbs is given your goals.

One thing you should keep in mind is that you really need to consider you basic body type. If you are an ectomorph, you aren't going to get big and bulky like a collegiate wrestler; your body just isn't designed that way. What you can do is get very lean, muscular and strong and look like a runner, maybe a basketball player, or decathalete.

Good luck.
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      01-18-2011, 09:06 PM   #25
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you guys, i am a girl remember that lol

i'm short and very very petite, i want to gain weight because i look so tiny and it doesn't help that i have asian genes, so i look tiny and young -__-

my goal is to gain 20 lbs and somehow KEEP that weight on.

so far i've been drinking a lot of milk and i've increased my protein intake. i've also been working out a lot more, so in 2 weeks i'll see if this helps =)
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      01-18-2011, 09:35 PM   #26
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good luck
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      01-18-2011, 09:37 PM   #27
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How about try eating a lot? Like eating 1 extra meal per day.
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      01-18-2011, 11:00 PM   #28
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Dont gain weight, you are young and a female. Very soon you will be making a thread saying the opposite. Enjoy your youth and current weight for as long as you possibly can.
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      01-18-2011, 11:49 PM   #29
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yeah, another thing to remember is your metabolism will take a dip as you get older, so you will naturally keep on a few extra pounds..
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      01-19-2011, 12:13 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CollinsE90 View Post
Dont gain weight, you are young and a female. Very soon you will be making a thread saying the opposite. Enjoy your youth and current weight for as long as you possibly can.
yeah i know, it's just hard sometimes because i'm almost 22 and some people still think i'm 12-14 -__-

another thing is that i have a hard time finding pants that fit

i'm going to give this a try for about a few months and if it doesn't work, i'll just give up ^__^
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      01-19-2011, 10:00 AM   #31
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Mostly Vietnamese food eh? I'm asian too and I gain weight if I eat more noodles (not rice noodles, but wheat noodles). Milk and cheese help too. And eating a small meal close to bed time will definitely make you gain weight.
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      01-19-2011, 11:26 AM   #32
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The information I provided earlier is the same for men and for women. You will still want to do weight lifting to gain muscle mass, not fat mass. You'll come out looking like a dancer if you follow the right weight training exercises.

As a petite woman, focus on a regimen corresponding to that a ballet dancer would follow. You'd be amazed at how strong those folks are...deceptively strong is how I'd describe it, yet they are incredibly fit. You'll be in great physical shape and you'll have a slammin', sexy body!

I would recommend too that you focus less on pounds and more on what your body looks like. Twenty pounds of fat, for example looks very different than 20 pounds of muscle, and you definitely want the latter and not the former. Being small of frame to begin with, you should forget about looking like Jennifer Lopez. Your body isn't designed to look that way.

The best thing you can do is workout, get fit, eat right and work with the body you've got. Trying to turn it into a different body type will be disappointing -- it's a goal you cannot achieve -- and unhealthy overall.

Best of luck.
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      01-19-2011, 11:42 AM   #33
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20lbs on a girl is a lot, I would try to gain .5lbs-1lb a week and adjust accordingly.

You need to start to track your daily intake.

What is your current caloric maintenance?

What does your typical day look like regarding macro nutrients (Fat, Carb, Protein)


Caloric deficit = lose weight

Caloric surplus = gain weight

Quote:
Calculating Calories and Macro's

Basic Terminology
1/ BMR (Basal Metabolic Rate): This is the amount of calories you need to consume to maintain your body if you were comatose (base level)....
2/ NEAT (Non-Exercise Associated Thermogenesis): The calorie requirements added by your daily activity that is NOT exercise (eg: washing, walking, talking, shopping, working). This is generally the most marked variable in a persons daily calorie requirements and something that everyone has a good amount of control over. This is what people term INCIDENTAL EXERCISE. It is also what helps keep 'constitutionally lean' people LEAN (they fidget)!
3/ EAT (Exercise Associated Thermogenesis): The calorie requirements associated with planned exercise.... Unless someone is doing a whole heap of exercise (eg: two or more hrs training a day) it usually doesn't add a stack of calories to your requirements (30 minutes of 'elliptical training isn't going to do it')
4/ TEF (Thermogenic effect of feedng): The calorie expenditure associated with eating.... REGARDLESS of what myths you have been told - this is NOT dependent on MEAL FREQUENCY. It is a % of TOTAL CALORIES CONSUMED (and 15% of 3 x 600 cal meals is the same as 15% of 6 x 300 cal meals). It varies according to MACRONUTRIENT content and FIBER content... For most mixed diets, it is something around 15%.... Protein is higher (up to 25%), carbs are variable (between 5-25%), and fats are low (usually less than 5%). So ->> More protein and more carbs and more fiber = HIGHER TEF. More FAT = LOWER TEF.
5/ TEE (Total Energy Expenditure): The total calories you require - and the sum of the above (BMR + NEAT + EAT + TEF).


How much do you need?
There is therefore a multitude of things that impact a persons MAINTENANCE calorie requirements
- Age and sex (males generally need > females for any given age)
- Total weight and lean mass (more lean mass = more needed)
- Physiological status (eg: sick or injured, pregnant, growth and 'enhancement')
- Hormones (eg: thyroid hormone levels, growth hormone levels)
- Exercise level (more activity = more needed)
- Daily activity level (more activity = more needed)
- Diet (that is - macronutrient intake)

In order to calculate your requirements the most accurate measure would be via Calorimetry [the measure of 'chemical reactions' in your body and the heat produced by these reactions], either directly (via placing a calorimeter where the heat you produce is measured) or indirectly (eg: HOOD studies where they monitor how much oxygen you use/ carbon dioxide and nitrogen you excrete over a given time). Although accurate - this is completely impractical for most people. So we mostly rely on pre-set formula to try to calculate our needs.

Estimating Requirements
The simplest method of estimating needs is to base your intake on a standard 'calories per unit of weight (usually kilograms)'. Typically:
- 26 to 30 kcals/kg/day for normal, healthy individuals with sedentary lifestyles doing little physical activity [12.0-14 kcal/pound]
- 31 to 37 kcal/kg/day for those involved in light to moderate activity 3-5 x a week with moderately active lifestyles [14-16 kcal/ pound]
- 38 to 40 kcals/kg/day for those involved in vigorous activity and highly active jobs [16-18 kcal/ pound].
For those involved in HEAVY training (eg: athletes) - the demand is even greater:
- 41 to 50 kcals/kg/day for those involved in moderate to heavy training (for example: 15-20 hrs/ week training) [18.5-22 kcal/ pound]
- 50 or above kcals/kg/day for those involved in heavy to extreme training [> 22 kcal/ pound]

Then a number of more complex formula which calculate BMR can also be used - which is then multiplied by an 'activity variable' to give TEE.
To go over a few BMR calculations:
1/ Harris-Benedict formula:
Particularly inaccurate - It was derived from studies on LEAN, YOUNG, ACTIVE males in a COLD lab MANY YEARS AGO (1919) and is notorious for OVERESTIMATING calorie requirements, especially in those that are overweight. IF YOU WANT AN ACCURATE READING, DON'T USE IT!
For MEN: BMR = 66 + [13.7 x weight (kg)] + [5 x height (cm)] - [6.76 x age (years)]
For WOMEN: BMR = 655 + [9.6 x weight (kg)] + [1.8 x height (cm)] - [4.7 x age (years)]

2/Mifflin-St Jeor:
Developed in the 1990s. More accurate than the above as it is more realistic in todays lifestyle settings. It still does not take into consideration the difference in metabolic rate as a consequence of high BF%. Thus, once again, it also overestimates needs in highly obese individuals. So - be warned it can OVERESTIMATE your needs.
For MEN: BMR = [9.99 x weight (kg)] + [6.25 x height (cm)] - [4.92 x age (years)] + 5
For WOMEN: BMR = [9.99 x weight (kg)] + [6.25 x height (cm)] - [4.92 x age (years)] -161

3/Katch-McArdle:
This is considered the most accurate formula for those who are relatively lean and who have a good understanding of their bodyfat %.
BMR = 370 + (21.6 x LBM)
Where LBM = [total weight (kg) x (100 - bodyfat %)]/100


To then convert to a TOTAL expenditure requirement you multiply the result from the above equations by an Activity Factor
1.2 = Sedentary (Little or no exercise and desk job)
1.3-1.4 = Lightly Active (Light exercise or sports 1-3 days a week)
1.5-1.6 = Moderately Active (Moderate exercise or sports 3-5 days a week)
1.7-1.8 = Very Active (Hard exercise or sports 6-7 days a week)
1.9-2.0 = Extremely Active (Hard daily exercise or sports and physical job)
(note: these activity factors generally include your LIFESTYLE (work) as well as your EXERCISE (gym/ sport) and a TEF of ~ 15% - which is an average mixed diet).


Just How Accurate are they?
Although these can (sometimes) give rough ball-park figures, they are still 'guesstimations'. And most people OVERESTIMATE their activity factor, and UNDERESTIMATE their bodyfat - and end up eating TOO MUCH. So - use these as 'rough figures' and then monitor your weight/ measurements for 2-4 weeks. IF your weight is stable/ measurements are stable, then you have likely found your maintenance intake.


Using the Above to Recalculate Based on Goals
You will then need to DECREASE or INCREASE intakes above based on your goals (eg: lose or gain mass).
To do this, instead of using 'generic calorie amounts' (eg: 500 cals/ day), you need to calculate it on a % of your maintenance. The effect of a given calorie amount on an individual is going to be markedly different based on their size/ total calorie intake. For example - subtracting 500 cals/ day from a 115# females 1500 total intake is 1/3rd of her total cals but 500 cals/ day for a 215# male on 3500 total intake is only 1/6th of their total... And it will result in markedly different effects on their energy levels and weight loss.

Generally speaking:
-> to ADD weight: ADD 10-20% calories to your total from above
-> to LOSE weight: SUBTRACT 10-20% calories from your total from above
Then monitor your results and adjust as required.


Macronutrient Needs
Once you work out how many CALORIES you need to reach your goals you need to work out how much of each particular macronutrient you should aim for. And this is one of the areas that is MOST confused in the calculation of requirements!! So... Let us go through it and try to make it as simple as possible! This should NOT be based on a generic RATIO of total calorie intake such as '30:40:30 or 40:40:20. Your body doesn't CARE what % intake you have for macronutrients. It works in terms of SUFFICIENT QUANTITY per LEAN MASS or TOTAL MASS. Therefore your level should relate back to your BODY and your needs!!

1. Protein: Most studies out suggest that in the face of ADEQUATE calories and CARBS then the following protein intakes are sufficient:
STRENGTH training -> 1.2 to 1.6g per KG bodyweight (about .6 / pound)
ENDURANCE training -> 1.4 to 1.8g per KG bodyweight (about .8 / pound)
ADOLESCENT in training -> 1.8 to 2.2g per KG bodyweight (about 1g / pound)
BUT they also acknowledge that protein becomes MORE important in the context of LOWER calorie intakes, or LOWER carb intakes.

Anyway - you can see that the general recommendations given in the 'bodybuilding' area (1g / pound) is nearly double this! And although the evidence out to suggest a NEED for this requirement is scarce - some general 'bodybuilding' guidelines would be based as follows:
If bodyfat UNKNOWN but AVERAGE = 1-1.25g per pound weight
If bodyfat KNOWN = 1.25-1.5g per LEAN weight

If you are VERY LEAN or if you are on a LOW TOTAL CALORIE INTAKE then protein becomes more important - so stick toward the higher levels:
Average bodyfat, lower calorie intake = 1.25-1.5 x pound total mass
Bodyfat known, lower calorie intake = 1.33-2 x pounds lean mass

If you are VERY OVERWEIGHT, VERY INACTIVE, and NOT on a lower calorie diet then you should stick closer to, or decrease slightly BELOW the above levels:
protein = something around the 1 x total weight (down to 1 x LEAN MASS).


2. Fats: Generally speaking, although the body can get away with short periods of very low fat, in the long run your body NEEDS fat to maintain general health, satiety, and sanity. Additionally - any form of high intensity training will benefit from a 'fat buffer' in your diet - which acts to control free radical damage and inflammation.

General guides:
Average or lean: 1 - 2g fat/ kg body weight [between 0.45 - 1g total weight/ pounds]
High bodyfat: 1-2g fat/ LEAN weight [between 0.45 - 1g LEAN weight/ pounds]
IF low calorie dieting - you can decrease further, but as a minimum, I would not suggest LESS than about 0.35g/ pound.
Note 1: Total fat intake is NOT the same as 'essential fats' (essential fats are specific TYPES of fats that are INCLUDED in your total fat intake)...

3. Carbs: VERY important for athletes, HIGHLY ACTIVE individuals, or those trying to GAIN MASS - Carbs help with workout intensity, health, and satiety (and sanity). But there are no specific 'requirements' for your body. Carbs are basically used by most as 'the extra stuff'.
If you are an athlete - I would actually suggest you CALCULATE a requirement for these:
moderately active: 4.5 - 6.5 g/ kg (about 2 - 3g/ pound)
highly active: 6.5 - 9 g/ kg (about 3 - 4g/ pound)

But for 'general folk' to calculate your carbs you just calculate it from the calories left over from fats/ protein:
carb calories = Total calorie needs - ([protein grams as above x 4] + [fat grams as above x 9])]
carbs in grams = above total/ 4


Please do not listen to what you see in bold below, it is completely incorrect. Meal timing is completely irrelevant and your body will NOT go catabolic if you go more than 3 hours of not eating. You do not need a PT, half of them don't know shit. Read what I posted above and go from there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony20009 View Post
I'm assuming you want to gain muscle mass weight and not fatty weight (the latter can be done just by eating junk and fast foods).

To gain muscle weight, you must do two things:
  • Exercise your muscles so they will grow. This basically means lifting weights. There are a wide variety of approaches to lifting and most all of them work. What matters is which one is right for you at your current condition. There are approaches for folks who are already well developed, approaches for folks who are effectively just starting, approaches for targeting specific objectives, and so on.

    If you haven't been pursuing a weight training regimen, you'll want to start out with a basic program that focuses on developing strength in your body parts as well as developing your core -- abs and back -- muscle strength and control. Indeed, you'll need to do basic strength training -- which will build mass -- before you really focus on the major mass building techniques. The reason for this is so you don't hurt yourself when you really start piling on the weights and so that you learn the correct form for all your exercises. Indeed, if you do an exercise using perfect form, you'll get the most out of it.

    Now, as for how to get started, I'd recommend a personal trainer. I started with one and worked with him five days a week for a year. It did wonders. Not only did it make working out fun -- and I can assure you I don't, even now, think working out is that much fun -- but it made sure I got the absolute maximum out of my workouts. If you don't go with a trainer, you're going to have to go to a book store.
  • Eat right to both feed your muscle growth as well as prevent your body from thinking there's a "famine." So what's the famine thing?

    Your body needs nourishment all day long. When you let your body go for extended periods without food, it thinks there's a famine and when it has extra calories, it will store them as fat rather than burning them off.

    You prevent the famine perception by eating small meals all day long -- every 2-3 hours. A small meal is basically an amount of food roughly equal to the size of your fist. I tend to go with oatmeal with brown sugar and fruit, and a small bit of salmon in the a.m. about 45 min to an hour before working out. A few grapes or a banana or other small bit of fruit during my workout. A piece of fruit right after the workout. Then I do a protein shake and a full on meal -- this tends to be my largest meal of the day. It'll have protein, complex carbs, and fats. If I'm in a hurry, I may go to Chipotle and get a burrito bowl: black beans, chicken, tomato salsa, corn salsa and lemon juice. For the rest of the day, it's small things like a PB&J sandwich, fruits and nuts, and other complex carbs to keep my body fueled. I'll have some fish, chicken or turkey or lean pork in the evening and then one or two more small meals before going to bed.

    In addition to preventing famine, you should seek to eat as many calories as your body will burn. Don't eat fewer or you will lose weight. If you eat more, and you aren't effectively preventing the famine, you'll gain weight, but it'll be fat. Just make sure you are feeding your muscles enough protein so they can repair themselves from the lifting. This is how they grow. A good trainer can help you figure out what the right proportion of protein, fat and carbs is given your goals.

One thing you should keep in mind is that you really need to consider you basic body type. If you are an ectomorph, you aren't going to get big and bulky like a collegiate wrestler; your body just isn't designed that way. What you can do is get very lean, muscular and strong and look like a runner, maybe a basketball player, or decathalete.

Good luck.
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      01-19-2011, 12:48 PM   #34
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Quick,
I don't see a lot of difference between what you provided -- in vast detail -- and what I said, other than the level of detail, and the need to feed one's body throughout the day. The basic six small meals a day.

We both said that if if you eat more calories than your body uses, you will gain weight and vice versa if you eat fewer calories than your body uses. That you provided all the info one needs to calculate what one's maintenance caloric intake should be is useful, but not different. Indeed, once one has calculated all that stuff, the fact is that one will tailor their diet accordingly.

As for personal trainers, there are good and bad ones. Mine is excellent. He did the calculations you cited above. He taught me how to read food labels to make sure I'm not buying the wrong things. He structures my fitness activities and he makes working out pleasurable, ensuring the right balance of soreness and results. He also structures my meal plans. When I first started with him, I was on a fat loss diet. Eventually, he had me change my diet to begin to gain weight. Right now I'm on a maintenance diet.

I've been working out with him for a while now. I'm 51, 6 feet tall, thin body type and weight 180 lbs. of which 8% is fat. I can bench 250, run three miles in 20 minutes, and fukk like a rabbit when that's appropriate. My body looks lean and muscled. Most folks think I'm 20 years younger than I am. Nearly none of that was true when I first started with my trainer, indeed, then I weighed 168 and looked thin and flabby.

Sure not all trainers are great. On several occasions I've had long term work assignments away from my home town and I've definitely found some of those less than stellar trainers. One dude even tried to put me on a football player's workout routine. As if that was even remotely appropriate for my lifestyle or body type. I guess he thought he was going to show me that I'd not been working out heavily enough or something....whatever it was, he lasted only three workouts.
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      01-19-2011, 01:11 PM   #35
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Tony,


The issues I had with your post I noted and specified that I had placed in bold.

You are incorrect about your point on the body going into a "famine" after several hours of not eating; that is false and a common myth.

Meal timing is completely irrelevant; it all comes down to daily intake, both on a caloric and macro nutrient level. Whether it comes from one huge meal (which would be difficult), 8 small ones, or 3 balanced meals.

Some find it easier to eat smaller meals throughout the day because they binge when hungry. Other's cannot consume enough calories in 3 sittings to sustain a surplus.


All in all, do what works for you, just please do not preach the idea of a "famine."

Good read: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/res...ch-review.html
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      01-19-2011, 02:00 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick6EF View Post
You are incorrect about your point on the body going into a "famine" after several hours of not eating; that is false and a common myth.
TRUE

Meal timing is completely irrelevant; it all comes down to daily intake, both on a caloric and macro nutrient level. Whether it comes from one huge meal (which would be difficult), 8 small ones, or 3 balanced meals.
DEPENDENT ON GOAL

Some find it easier to eat smaller meals throughout the day because they binge when hungry. Other's cannot consume enough calories in 3 sittings to sustain a surplus.
ITS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE EASY

All in all, do what works for you,
AGREEE 100%
Strength Training, 3 Meals > 6 Meals

"After multiple regression analysis the 3 meal group had a significant greater gain in lean body mass (LBM) than the 6 meal group when adjusted for gender and energy intake (p=0.04), when adjusted for gender and protein intake (p=0.03), and when adjusted for gender, protein intake, carbohydrate intake and fat intake."

And ...

"In this study, three meals per day resulted in larger muscle gain from strength training than six meals per day over a period of twelve weeks."

https://ecss2007.cc.jyu.fi/schedule/...s/pdf/1796.pdf
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      01-19-2011, 03:13 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Dre01SS View Post
Strength Training, 3 Meals > 6 Meals

"After multiple regression analysis the 3 meal group had a significant greater gain in lean body mass (LBM) than the 6 meal group when adjusted for gender and energy intake (p=0.04), when adjusted for gender and protein intake (p=0.03), and when adjusted for gender, protein intake, carbohydrate intake and fat intake."

And ...

"In this study, three meals per day resulted in larger muscle gain from strength training than six meals per day over a period of twelve weeks."

https://ecss2007.cc.jyu.fi/schedule/...s/pdf/1796.pdf

"More long-term studies are needed to determine
the optimal meal frequency for gain in LBM from
strength training."


but I really do appreciate you for shedding some light on the topic. There are so many people out there with incorrect knowledge.
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      01-19-2011, 03:44 PM   #38
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Don't take lifting or nutrition advice on a car forum. Check out bodybuilding.com if you're serious.



EAT BIG. LIFT BIG.

Calculate your daily caloric requirement for maintaining your current weight and eat more than that. you will gain weight.
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      01-19-2011, 04:48 PM   #39
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Don't take lifting or nutrition advice on a car forum. Check out bodybuilding.com if you're serious.



EAT BIG. LIFT BIG.

Calculate your daily caloric requirement for maintaining your current weight and eat more than that. you will gain weight.
My post was taken direct from a sticky on the Nutrition forums from *******, where I spend most of my (forum) time.


and OP is a girl fyi.
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      01-19-2011, 05:24 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick6EF View Post
My post was taken direct from a sticky on the Nutrition forums from *******, where I spend most of my (forum) time.


and OP is a girl fyi.
doesn't matter....guy/girl, still have to eat.



at the end of the day, it's calories in vs. calories out....PERIOD.
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