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      02-15-2011, 03:55 AM   #45
Tippo
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That's a tad contradictory saying about snobbery as no doubt part of the reason you bought the 320d is for the badge snobbery as maybe perceived by others.

Ok, maybe dilluting could be misconstrued, more like the general populous get used to seeing BMW's on the roads (many 320d's), that a degree of exclusivity may be lost. Or, you could argue that they are a victim of their own success which has its pros and cons as previously said.

One thing is for sure, BMW will continue to offer to the market 320d's in as many numbers as possible (especially fleet sales at discounted prices) as they are in the market for selling and making a profit and won't care how it may or may not affect private owners.

I personally think it's a lot of money to pay new for a car with a 2.0 diesel engine, however nearly new or second hand is different. But one thing I do not think of them is cheap, either figuratively or literally. However if anyone dares to start modding them in a tasteless fashion, then they will start to look common and cheap. Just the way I see it.

Sorry you are wrong to a degree, the reason I got a BMW is for the economy and overall reliability. BUT I confess I wanted to remain in a 'prestige' brand.

For what its worth I hate the 3 series coupe and all of the other models so I am not exactly a BMW nut.

All I am doing is highlighting posters on here taking it out on certain models in the range. Which creates an atmosphere of blatant snobbery.

It's one thing to be a badge snob but another being a specific range model snob all IMHO of course.

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      02-15-2011, 04:11 AM   #46
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This is going around in circles.

A quick bit of BMW history...

BMW made cheapish cars then went "upmarket" with almost all rapid and sporty models such as the E20 323i. They continued being a "prestige" brand until the decided to make the 3 series compact.

BMW saw how well their "low rent" models were selling so added more and more "mainstream" models to their line up - suddenly aspirational middle managers could afford them and BMW's sale rocketed.

This unfortunately resulted in an odd kind of snobbery - suddenly Nigel in his 316i thought he had "made it" and drove in a way that reflected his "status" - BMW became the car of the c0ck and many jumped on the bandwagon, partly damaging the brand.

The release of the E9* saw the 3 series grow up with base spec models being fairly well specced but all were expensive to buy yet cheapish to run - lease car heaven.

So you have a car that even in the lowliest spec costs 25k - a lot of money for a fairly low powered car. Owners clearly want to justify this high cost of what is basically a decent car so get very narked at anyone with a "bigger" engine that appears to look down on them.

However these people are still snobs - they spent a lot on a car and are happy to mock Mondeo owners and similar. Yet they are also very sensitive to comments from the "six pot" boys and girls telling people they have more or less the "same" car. Most don't bother doing the same with M3s as they know they are very different.

3 series owners have also become obsessed with tech and will use this as a "weapon" to outdo others - "mine has a NASA space station control system, yours doesn't, ner ner" etc - it's all about snobbery.

However this website generally attracts the "good" owners. Ones that bought the car to enjoy, because it's well made - all for the "right" reasons.

But occasionally a few "chip on shoulder" merchants will wonder in and get stroppy when anyone suggests they drive a pretty mainstream car.

You can't win.
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      02-15-2011, 04:15 AM   #47
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To be fair though, it happens on just about every forum you could care to think of, for whatever reason.

Back in the PC day you'd post about how you just picked up a 8mb Voodoo2 and games were fantastic, someone would reply by saying that's nothing compared to 2x12mb Voodoo SLI, 1 billion frame rates per second, blah blah blah.

And as for HiFi, there's always someone who's spent a gazzillion pounds more than you (and quite happy to let you know) on what you considered your high-end system, all in the pursuit of blacker blacks, voices lingering in the air, feeling of being in the front row, etc, etc.

Take it all with a (large) pinch of salt and be happy with your own choice
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      02-15-2011, 04:29 AM   #48
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Guys,

I think everyone just needs to chill out a little bit. I don't think anyone insulted anyone else, either explicitly or implicitly. We're all just sharing opinions.
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      02-15-2011, 04:54 AM   #49
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Well I don't care how many times 335diesel uses " ", I'm mortally offended and I'll do my best to knock him off his bike next time I'm in Cornwall. BTW, my bike has got 84 gears, how many has yours got? I've also got a digital watch with 26 functions (if you include the light).

An online conversation like this will always turn a bit tetchy because face to face you'd know the six pot owners weren't being cocks. Well not much anyway. On a forum it's just text and wide open to misinterpretation. And I'd like to say I've got a 320d on the way and this thread hasn't offended me in the slightest.
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      02-15-2011, 04:58 AM   #50
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An online conversation like this will always turn a bit tetchy because face to face you'd know the six pot owners weren't being cocks. Well not much anyway. On a forum it's just text and wide open to misinterpretation. And I'd like to say I've got a 320d on the way and this thread hasn't offended me in the slightest.
Yes but my 3 litre is faster ha ha ha ha.
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      02-15-2011, 05:00 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by rich1068 View Post
Well I don't care how many times 335diesel uses " ", I'm mortally offended and I'll do my best to knock him off his bike next time I'm in Cornwall. BTW, my bike has got 84 gears, how many has yours got? I've also got a digital watch with 26 functions (if you include the light).


My old digital G Shock has 28 functions Main bike only has 27 -
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      02-15-2011, 06:30 AM   #52
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There is another slant on this BMW image thing. I was driving BMW's back in the late 70's and 80's seemed everyone who commented on it, though I was loaded with money, because I drove a 5-series 528 saloon. The fact it was used and cost no more than buying and running a new Ford Cortina, didn't seem to count. It was viewed as exclusive and expensive.

BMW also promoted the exclusive brand, particularly back then. I remember when the 3-series started becoming popular, BMW 'assured' the loyal customer the brand wasn't going to be diluted, they would cap production.

Then they got in financial trouble, the Quandt family had to follow the market to survive, higher volume of the smaller "bread and butter" cars to keep the brand afloat.

They've never looked back, on growing the business, but it was against their business model and ethos of the past.

The terms "a real BMW" and "poverty spec" are not new expressions for BMW, since the invention of the internet and forums. It goes back to the past when unless the cars were specced well, and had 6-pot engines, they were viewed as the "poor mans" BMW. Take an 520i's of the past, viewed as a bit of a joke, even in the 80's.

Once we had the silky smooth 6-pot inline engines, nothing else really had the same kudos with the BMW enthusiast. So a ribbing for anyone who had the 'base' model.

Let's see it for what it is, a bit of banter, and if their is snobbery, (certainly not from my part) enjoy what you have, but most enthusiast BMW drivers still aspire to the bigger models, don't we? Always did.

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      02-15-2011, 07:12 AM   #53
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Quote:
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Describing a 318 se as poverty spec is a bit stuck up, if actually meant that way.
Maybe m3 drivers describe a 335 as a poor mans m3.
M5 owners might think every m3 owner really wanted an m5 and so on.....
Aspire to what's above don't degrade what's below, those who have earn't it have been there before.
That's just a turn of phrase that's used here and on other car forums!
Yup, and a stuck up one
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      02-15-2011, 07:25 AM   #54
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Seriously, let it go.

Are you that offended by the ramblings of an internet random?
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      02-15-2011, 07:26 AM   #55
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No offence but you're taking things far too seriously Lee. What do you prefer? Base model? Low spec? Cheap? Standard?
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      02-15-2011, 07:54 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by leetennis View Post
Yup, and a stuck up one
You're right Lee - we should have all bought four pot 3ers and should shut our stuck up faces up and be glad we have such a "prestige" badge.

Come on, get real - loads of ranges of cars have base models with wee engines up to macking great units kicking out big power - so what?

You need to take a massive chill pill. Preferably in your tiny engined repmobile.

Oh and BTW, why do you feel the need to put "M Sport" in your info? Isn't that a bit snobbish towards SE and ES model owners? Doesn't it show you feel the need to feel "one up" on them?
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      02-15-2011, 08:10 AM   #57
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Quite. The hypocrisy is astounding.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tippo View Post
It's one thing to be a badge snob but another being a specific range model snob all IMHO of course.
Really? Care to explain the difference?

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      02-15-2011, 08:46 AM   #58
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Quite. The hypocrisy is astounding.



Really? Care to explain the difference?
Me a 320d owner would probably confess to being a badge snob for owning a BMW, end of.

Some of the BMW owners here (badge snobs) seem to think that our models dilute the brand hence they are taking the snobbery one level up as it were.
Just my view on things take it or leave it mate.

Looks like I touched a toxicnerve in this debate.......
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      02-15-2011, 08:53 AM   #59
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So some of us are worse snobs than all other 3 series snobs for daring to own the faster versions?

Maybe there should be a snob league table just to clarify?

Just as a minor observation - I do occasionally get tailgated by the a 3/5 series and/or odd Audi A4/A5. Almost without exception, it's almost always a four pot engined model.

Something to prove? I'll leave you sensitive snob denying souls to decide.
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      02-15-2011, 08:55 AM   #60
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^^ Ha! You're a double snob. I'm only a snob.

Damn it. Now I envy your snobbery. You've got more of it than me
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      02-15-2011, 08:58 AM   #61
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That's what I was getting at. What's the difference between being a badge snob vs. a model snob?

I thought it was all just snobbery, I didn't realise there were different kinds of "snob"...



rich1068, why don't you take your 4-pot and inferior snobbery and just bugger off, you're not good enough to converse with in this thread
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      02-15-2011, 09:01 AM   #62
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I once accused my wife of being a snob. The best she could come back with was 'I can't be! I'm an ethnic minority!'

Can anyone suggest a forum where my snobbery (albeit single, not double) will be looked on with awe and bestow immediate status? Mini forum?
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      02-15-2011, 09:02 AM   #63
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TN - it's very complex and mastery of the art of snobbery takes many years of intensive study.

I am a mere green belt in the art and I practise daily.

Rich - now I have an SE but a 35d engine. You have an M Sport but a 20d unit. So does M Sport vs SE snobbery outdo 35d vs 20d snobbery or vice versa?

As I said, it's a complex art.
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      02-15-2011, 09:03 AM   #64
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Ah....ethnic minorities are the worst for snobbery! I'm of Indian origin and the one-upmanship that goes on in the community is (at times) ridiculous. Keeping up with the Patels & Mistrys is hard work...
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      02-15-2011, 09:06 AM   #65
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Finally we've got onto race. Safe ground at last.
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      02-15-2011, 09:28 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335diesel View Post
Just as a minor observation - I do occasionally get tailgated by the a 3/5 series and/or odd Audi A4/A5. Almost without exception, it's almost always a four pot engined model.
Of course there are more of us lowly specced ones about so statistically that would make sense
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