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      05-29-2011, 04:09 AM   #23
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I agree with you about the CGT.. And that just proves my point over priced..

Forget the CGT.. Just a Porsche I like. But you get so much more from a Ferrari thats why they cost so much more. Look at the Top Gear times.. Also I am more of a day to day driver, I very rarely get to hit the track unless I am Invited.

I like the CGT because of the # of them, The engine of course...(WOW WHAT A SOUND) and the design.

I just feel every time I look at a Porsche and see the price I say "Damn for that price I could have ________"

Hell I saw this today and got excited..
I've been fortunate enough to own a few Porsches as well as track them and has also been fortunate enough to have tracked a fair few Ferraris too. You feel you get much much more from a Ferrari than a Porsche? Sure lets look at lap times, a perfect example is the comparison test they did between the 430Scud and the GT3RS a while back, they did the same lap time and yet the Ferrari was a sizeable bit more expensive.

Sorry but from my experience the Ferrari feels like a kitcar by comparison, maybe the latest 458 has improved on this I honestly don't know as I haven't driven it yet but the rest when compared to the equivalent Porsche it's the Porsche that has always feel more solid and dare I say it more engineered of the two. Unlike a Porsche which when you take it to the track the whole experience goes up a couple of levels from before, the Ferrari which impressed so much on the road fails to live up to the hype on the track (personal opinion here guys). Ferraris in my mind is like someone famous that you admire and finally get to meet but turn out to be such a disappointment, at least with the Porsche it always fulfills your expectations and more.
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      05-29-2011, 09:42 AM   #24
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Huh... U couldn't afford the M3!!!??!! JK. Just because I say it is overpriced does not mean I couldn't afford it. I went to look at a Cayman S before I bought my 1. How much is the R. If its M3 money I would buy the M3 any day of the week. And that to me would make it overpriced. I will never own a porsche. Unless it looks like this... (A friends car in the pic)

You are the biggest hypocrite on this forum. WOW.. You drive a 335i Hey by the way start looking at new performance cars that are coming out, N/A engines are not the way to go anymore. The power and MPGs you get from a turbo is great!

I was not trying to be mean.. Ps- u car looks great.

My friend had a Porsche turbo (vert) and Now he has a CL 550. The CL AMG its a TT V12 pushing over 600HP for 200K. ONE HELL OF A DEAL.. If you think thats overpriced I would hate to hear what you think a Zonda is priced at.. Thats one hell of a deal (A TT V12 GOD might as well hand over the throne to u)
I was very young when I got my 335i and I didn't have the same mindset I have now. Back then, I loved the 335i due to its easy tune ability and the huge aftermarket support in comparison to the M3 (back then there wasn't as much stuff for the M3). To say the least, it wasn't at all about the fact that I couldn't afford the M3.

The Cayman R is $66k. And I don't think it is overpriced at all. The seats, interior, engine placement, driving feel, etc are superior to the M3. And it has 2 trunks. The only reason the M3 would ever be better is if you need 4 seats IMO.

And I'm looking into the C63 coupe, 911 GT3, 911 C4S/C2S, Cayman R, and Z06 as my next car (I plan to buy next summer)... and all of them are N/A, so I don't know what you are talking about that no performance cars are N/A anymore.

Yea I still think the CL65 is overpriced. It is a BOAT. With all that power, it is relatively slow because it weighs right around 5,000 pounds (what kind of "sports"-luxury car weighs that much besides bentleys?). For that money you are in Ferrari, Bentley, and Lamborghini territory. On top of that you can get a Porsche Panamera Turbo S for $176k and it blows it out of the water performance wise with a much smaller engine. I've seen F430 Scuds for under 200k with less than 5k miles, brand new Lamborghini's and Bentley's are under 200k. I would take any of those cars over a CL65 ANY DAY. Bottom line, they are overpriced compared to cars in their segment.


AND I don't think the Zonda is overpriced at all. They are MASTERPIECES. My favorite cars. It would be really tough for me to choose between a McLaren F1 and a Zonda R, which shows how much I love Zondas.
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      05-29-2011, 09:46 AM   #25
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EDIT: the only porsche I think is overpriced is the 918 spyder that's coming out. and for how much you can get CGT's right now, they are AMAZING deals out there right now for what you get.
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      05-29-2011, 12:22 PM   #26
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I was very young when I got my 335i and I didn't have the same mindset I have now. Back then, I loved the 335i due to its easy tune ability and the huge aftermarket support in comparison to the M3 (back then there wasn't as much stuff for the M3). To say the least, it wasn't at all about the fact that I couldn't afford the M3.

The Cayman R is $66k. And I don't think it is overpriced at all. The seats, interior, engine placement, driving feel, etc are superior to the M3. And it has 2 trunks. The only reason the M3 would ever be better is if you need 4 seats IMO.

And I'm looking into the C63 coupe, 911 GT3, 911 C4S/C2S, Cayman R, and Z06 as my next car (I plan to buy next summer)... and all of them are N/A, so I don't know what you are talking about that no performance cars are N/A anymore.

Yea I still think the CL65 is overpriced. It is a BOAT. With all that power, it is relatively slow because it weighs right around 5,000 pounds (what kind of "sports"-luxury car weighs that much besides bentleys?). For that money you are in Ferrari, Bentley, and Lamborghini territory. On top of that you can get a Porsche Panamera Turbo S for $176k and it blows it out of the water performance wise with a much smaller engine. I've seen F430 Scuds for under 200k with less than 5k miles, brand new Lamborghini's and Bentley's are under 200k. I would take any of those cars over a CL65 ANY DAY. Bottom line, they are overpriced compared to cars in their segment.


AND I don't think the Zonda is overpriced at all. They are MASTERPIECES. My favorite cars. It would be really tough for me to choose between a McLaren F1 and a Zonda R, which shows how much I love Zondas.
I was just pulling your chain about the can't afford M3 thing. I was talking more about the New M5, MP4, ZR1, 1M, noble, CCX, Some AMGs s.. Because of the benefits you get with MPGs you will see more N/A disappearing.

The AMGs have a lot of power and have a lot of luxury in them, also back seats, trunks just a great combo.

And as for Zonda its an amazing car and was kidding about that car too..
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      05-29-2011, 12:30 PM   #27
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I've been fortunate enough to own a few Porsches as well as track them and has also been fortunate enough to have tracked a fair few Ferraris too. You feel you get much much more from a Ferrari than a Porsche? Sure lets look at lap times, a perfect example is the comparison test they did between the 430Scud and the GT3RS a while back, they did the same lap time and yet the Ferrari was a sizeable bit more expensive.

Sorry but from my experience the Ferrari feels like a kitcar by comparison, maybe the latest 458 has improved on this I honestly don't know as I haven't driven it yet but the rest when compared to the equivalent Porsche it's the Porsche that has always feel more solid and dare I say it more engineered of the two. Unlike a Porsche which when you take it to the track the whole experience goes up a couple of levels from before, the Ferrari which impressed so much on the road fails to live up to the hype on the track (personal opinion here guys). Ferraris in my mind is like someone famous that you admire and finally get to meet but turn out to be such a disappointment, at least with the Porsche it always fulfills your expectations and more.
Ya I guess thats your opinion. I have been on the track in ferraris too.. But did you just call a Ferrari a Kitcar...

Sorry but the sound and experience I have had with Ferraris is 10000000 times better than any porsche (I have not been in the CGT on the track).

Im 22 but I have had a lot of great people around me.. And I think this is all personal opinion.
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      05-29-2011, 01:00 PM   #28
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Ya I guess thats your opinion. I have been on the track in ferraris too.. But did you just call a Ferrari a Kitcar...

Sorry but the sound and experience I have had with Ferraris is 10000000 times better than any porsche (I have not been in the CGT on the track).

Im 22 but I have had a lot of great people around me.. And I think this is all personal opinion.
Yeah it's my opinion, and the opinion of a racing instructor who's job was teaching guys who came on trackdays. We both had the very same opinion that once you disregarded to engine note and ignored to name what you were left with was something not as great as expected. Build quality isn't really that good and certainly not at the level of an equivalent Porsche.

Like I said, I haven't driven the latest ones so that opinion was based on past models but on each of those occasions I continued to compare the experience to a Porsche and in my humble opinion it didn't come close, especially when you took each to the track. For example, drive a 355 or 430 on the track and then drive a humble Cayman S on the same track, they are both mid-engined and yet the experience is so much better in the Porsche. It's why I rated the R8 so highly because it behaves so similar to a big Cayman.

Ferrari make special cars, no doubt in this but the sum of their parts aren't as special in my eyes as is with Porsches. Just look at the number of occasions Porsche win driver's car of the year and you will understand what I mean by this.
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      05-29-2011, 01:15 PM   #29
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Yeah it's my opinion, and the opinion of a racing instructor who's job was teaching guys who came on trackdays. We both had the very same opinion that once you disregarded to engine note and ignored to name what you were left with was something not as great as expected. Build quality isn't really that good and certainly not at the level of an equivalent Porsche.

Like I said, I haven't driven the latest ones so that opinion was based on past models but on each of those occasions I continued to compare the experience to a Porsche and in my humble opinion it didn't come close, especially when you took each to the track. For example, drive a 355 or 430 on the track and then drive a humble Cayman S on the same track, they are both mid-engined and yet the experience is so much better in the Porsche. It's why I rated the R8 so highly because it behaves so similar to a big Cayman.

Ferrari make special cars, no doubt in this but the sum of their parts aren't as special in my eyes as is with Porsches. Just look at the number of occasions Porsche win driver's car of the year and you will understand what I mean by this.
I think the engine note is a big part and so is the name. You could never convince me that porsche is all that you make it to be.

Like I said I always come up saying but I could have _____ for that price or a lil more..
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      05-29-2011, 01:26 PM   #30
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WOW.. I just packaged one out and it came to about 80K... For a Cayman?? Thats crazy. It didn't even have navigation in it. It looks nice but for that kind of money I would rather have something else.. Sorry just my opinion.
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      05-29-2011, 02:46 PM   #31
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I think the engine note is a big part and so is the name. You could never convince me that porsche is all that you make it to be.

Like I said I always come up saying but I could have _____ for that price or a lil more..
Whilst I can understand why some may be satisfied by name and engine noise there are others that might want to dig deeper into a car's abilities, that is why I personally prefer what Porsche bring to the table. Remember these are meant to be the best driving experience at any amount of money, that's why given the choice I would choose a GT3RS or GT2RS over a 458 and why I would pick a Cayman R over either the 1M or M3, even though these cars are still all exceptional.

On car forums you are going to get people who prefer one brand over another and will get excited about different elements. As long as we can all come away respecting and understand why the other person has this opinion then I feel progress has been made.
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      05-29-2011, 04:58 PM   #32
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Whilst I can understand why some may be satisfied by name and engine noise there are others that might want to dig deeper into a car's abilities, that is why I personally prefer what Porsche bring to the table. Remember these are meant to be the best driving experience at any amount of money, that's why given the choice I would choose a GT3RS or GT2RS over a 458 and why I would pick a Cayman R over either the 1M or M3, even though these cars are still all exceptional.

On car forums you are going to get people who prefer one brand over another and will get excited about different elements. As long as we can all come away respecting and understand why the other person has this opinion then I feel progress has been made.
Cool U have the GT3Rs and I will take the 458 and we can call it a day..
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      05-29-2011, 09:51 PM   #33
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Whilst I can understand why some may be satisfied by name and engine noise there are others that might want to dig deeper into a car's abilities, that is why I personally prefer what Porsche bring to the table. Remember these are meant to be the best driving experience at any amount of money, that's why given the choice I would choose a GT3RS or GT2RS over a 458 and why I would pick a Cayman R over either the 1M or M3, even though these cars are still all exceptional.

On car forums you are going to get people who prefer one brand over another and will get excited about different elements. As long as we can all come away respecting and understand why the other person has this opinion then I feel progress has been made.
Leave it, mate. People will complain and moan about cars which they can't yet afford - this young one does not yet understand that driving pleasure does not necessarily equate to horsepower or 0-60 times.

To Stoutnj - any car can be viewed as overpriced. You need to look at what the car brings to the table as a whole, and then see if it's priced according to your wants and desires. Clearly for you, Porsches are not worth their money. That's fine. But for others, the feedback, precision, and driving experience that a Porsche provide is worth its weight in gold. I for one, would have taken a Cayman R over my current car, had it been available at the time. Cheers
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      05-30-2011, 12:53 AM   #34
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Leave it, mate. People will complain and moan about cars which they can't yet afford - this young one does not yet understand that driving pleasure does not necessarily equate to horsepower or 0-60 times.

To Stoutnj - any car can be viewed as overpriced. You need to look at what the car brings to the table as a whole, and then see if it's priced according to your wants and desires. Clearly for you, Porsches are not worth their money. That's fine. But for others, the feedback, precision, and driving experience that a Porsche provide is worth its weight in gold. I for one, would have taken a Cayman R over my current car, had it been available at the time. Cheers
Interesting Cheers and your in NY... I could have had a Cayman S. Wasn't practical at all for me. I understand what you are saying..

Just could not see paying that much and getting half the stuff I could get in a benz or a BMW. Not gunna lie my car has been a pain and I have hated it at times. But as soon as my 1 is ready to go I will be looking for a 1M.

Thanks
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      05-30-2011, 06:33 AM   #35
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Interesting Cheers and your in NY... I could have had a Cayman S. Wasn't practical at all for me. I understand what you are saying..

Just could not see paying that much and getting half the stuff I could get in a benz or a BMW. Not gunna lie my car has been a pain and I have hated it at times. But as soon as my 1 is ready to go I will be looking for a 1M.

Thanks
I'm a great believer is picking a car that suit you and your requirements. If the 1M suits your requirement better than the Cayman R then that's the better car in your opinion, but it's not the same as saying it's the better car full stop and nor is it right in saying it's overpriced. One man's opinion of being overpriced (based on his/her values) could as easily look like a bargain to someone else who views it's abilities differently.

P.S.
Hope you get your 1M soon.
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      05-30-2011, 07:27 AM   #36
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Cars are a lot like women. What attracts one guy may not attract another.

Loud and flashy for one fella and subdued and classy for another.

I would take this old gal over either of the young tarts mentioned in this thread for example.

One day..
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      05-30-2011, 08:28 AM   #37
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Sunbeam Tiger, or as we would call it the Sunbeam Alpine. At the time I was buying my Lotus Elan a friend was searching for one of these, not my cup of tea but as they say one man's medicine is another man's poison.

Getting OT here with this, but what the hell. I'm more of a sucker for this.

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      05-30-2011, 11:05 AM   #38
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      06-02-2011, 03:10 PM   #39
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WOW.. I just packaged one out and it came to about 80K... For a Cayman?? Thats crazy.
Ur doin it wrong is the problem. I optioned mine out with A/C, Bose, and Bi-Xenons and it is just over $71k.
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      06-03-2011, 09:02 PM   #40
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I think the 1M is cooler, but it's unfair to compare car the 1M only has a tuned 335i motor and Porsche can have some different powerfull motor!

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      06-03-2011, 10:32 PM   #41
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Ur doin it wrong is the problem. I optioned mine out with A/C, Bose, and Bi-Xenons and it is just over $71k.
I changed up wheels and color if exterior and interior. Plus the things you have and it was 10k more.
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      06-06-2011, 09:01 AM   #42
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Exactly. You are doin it rong. The Boxster Spyder / Cayman R wheels are the lightest Porsche has ever made. It is wrong to swap them out because you want your car to look like a 911 Turbo. If you want to pay Porsche thousands of dollars to paint items in your interior, then you have also missed the point of the Cayman R and might be better served with a Cayman or Cayman S.
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      06-06-2011, 01:22 PM   #43
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It's so easy to get carried away with options on Porsches. I quickly learned that there is a max MSRP you can use to calculate residual on a lease (MRM). Leasing gets very expensive if you go over that, so i had to stop when I got there, which wasn't very hard to do.
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      06-06-2011, 04:39 PM   #44
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Exactly. You are doin it rong. The Boxster Spyder / Cayman R wheels are the lightest Porsche has ever made. It is wrong to swap them out because you want your car to look like a 911 Turbo. If you want to pay Porsche thousands of dollars to paint items in your interior, then you have also missed the point of the Cayman R and might be better served with a Cayman or Cayman S.
HAHAHA... Im making the car the way I like, but Im wrong... If Im spending that much I want it to be perfect.

Its funny that you guys say this because I remember a Top Gear episode where Richard Hammond talks about how Porsche should only make the 911. Also when you want one the only option you should have is the exterior color.
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