I-Drive Navigation Retrofit!

gIzzE · 07-21-2008, 04:59 PM

Is that setting it in the iDrive, on the climate or both?

gIzzE · 07-21-2008, 06:07 PM

You sure you have hooked up both connectors properly on the back of the climate controls??

I have just put the business nav back in my car quickly and tried climate and that seems to work fine.
I can even control it through the iDrive.

In fact the only problems I have with the retrofit without coding is......

No PDC bleep, but do have the display.
No Journey computer, but still have the main OBC on the dash and on the iDrive.

Also, the unit is obviously older than I was told firmware wise, not the grey menu and no bloody MP3 compatibility!!

Everything is fine, the phone is seen no problem and works.

I am not sure what the score is next to be honest, will BMW ever update this iDrive if it was not factory ordered?? Or when I change the vehicle order will it no longer matter and they will just do it as a matter of course?

txusa03 · 07-22-2008, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Booster4075

Well, I put a couple of photos up for the curious people to look at now. I'm about 1/2 done with the DIY I plan to post... I'll let you know when its done!

Ahhh...nice...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3060/...d1382f82_o.jpg

All the parts that had to come out!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3104/...385c7bb5_o.jpg

Cooling tube before:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3231/...51ab021d_o.jpg

Cooling tube after:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3043/...c2708248_o.jpg

Holy Cow!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3119/...f09f3e5c_o.jpg

All done:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3017/...b625aec5_o.jpg

My current hold-up...this bracket is supposed to be the same on both dashes...but its not. Hmmmm.....
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3177/...a34035b9_o.jpg

You should put a label to warn people that those images are not for the weak stomach!

skim7x · 07-22-2008, 11:06 AM

Just to make it easier on everyone...

Damn, that's sick... good luck!

Booster4075 · 07-27-2008, 02:05 PM

Well, the last stages of the retrofit have come together!

I got another (US) CCC and controller, got it all programmed and its 95% operable. It took me a little longer to get it all going since I had a faulty (brand-new) fakra antenna cable back to the TCU. Nav works with voice guidance, FM/AM/CD/Ipod, bluetooth, climate control, FTM, PDC...its nearly all working!

No dash rattles either - yay!

Anyway, the very last step in making this 100% is getting the voice recognition going, which isn't currently enabled. This will likely be a little more complicated, as any updates to the modules past Progman 25 (or something like that) require "enabling codes" which are encoded for every VIN. My car had voice recognition as a feature when it was stock (with the Professional radio), but if it has V/R when it is equipped with a CCC, a set of enabling files is required by Progman to enable the V/R. Problem is that my VIN is not known by BMW to have a CCC and V/R, so it cannot be enabled. Hmmm...

Having gotten this far and 95% working, I have to say this retrofit is not for the faint of heart...merely changing hardware is only half the battle. If you are even contemplating doing this retrofit, secure someone, somewhere, who has the equipment and know-how to get this programmed FIRST, before buying anything. As these cars are technological masterpieces, it requires strong technical measures to enable our cars to recognize and use this retrofit equipment. If BMW had made a (authorized) retrofit, this would be as simple as going down to the local dealer. Unfortunately, there is no "retrofit" and dealership service departments have no idea how to do this and don't really want to help even if you throw money at it. It is likely that there is a saavy technician or two at each shop who does know how change a vehicle order and "make things work", but isn't "allowed" to do it for customer cars. This is nothing like the old days of putting in a car stereo and amp and having it work out of the box. That being said, I have no regrets in doing this retrofit and have learned a lot along the way.

Some other notes I have;
-When I had the (UK) CCC and controller in my car, progman would not program anything in the car until those parts were changed out. In addition, I later realized that my cruise control and hill-holder (start-off assist) were inoperative. Don't know why, but there must have been some conflict in the DSC. My CCC was out of a 320d, which I've been told doesn't have cruise control. Interesting. Moral to this tale and my retrofit experience: Find out what part number(s) applies to your car (including supersessions) and only use THAT equipment. (I practically had to buy two of everything to figure out what was up.) I really wanted to put in the newer CCC (>3/07) but have questions whether Progman would have programmed it or if I could have even gotten the extra buttons to work - I didn't chance it a third time. Please let me know if someone figures it out!

-While trying to figure out what the hell was up with my Nav not working right, I realized that it was using dead-reckoning to navigate (without the antenna.) I didn't realize this and just observed the navigation getting farther and farther out of proper position. The sure way to know if the CCC is getting a navigation signal is to check the "vehicle position" screen - if is displays an altitude, its getting a signal. That field will be blank (even though Longitude & Latitude are displayed) - if no altitude is displayed, the Lat & Long are likely off of actual. If no signal is received by the nav antenna, the CCC will use internal compass and vehicle speed to estimate the position. This works for tunnels and garages, but not for driving around in general - after a few days, I found my nav was 50+ miles off. Lesson learned: Even new parts don't always work. (brand new fakra antenna cable shorted internally.)

Oh yeah, the D-I-Y is coming....haven't finished it yet, but it will have pix and a basic guide to doing this retrofit.

Booster4075 · 07-30-2008, 04:40 AM

A little off-topic, but I've finished the DIY PDF (2.62 MB) and the site won't accept it as a valid upload... "Upload of file failed." - kind of vague. The guide says this site will accept .pdf's up to 9.54 MB. Any ideas? I've been able to upload smaller (<1MB) files without an issue.

AoshichanX · 07-31-2008, 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Booster4075

What is build date of your car - AND - were you able to get the programmable buttons on the front of the CCC working/programmable?

VERY interested as well since I read from this thread pre-March builds were not compatible.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Booster4075

A little off-topic, but I've finished the DIY PDF (2.62 MB) and the site won't accept it as a valid upload... "Upload of file failed." - kind of vague. The guide says this site will accept .pdf's up to 9.54 MB. Any ideas? I've been able to upload smaller (<1MB) files without an issue.

I apologize that I have not completely read the thread, but I could not help but notice you have the older style navigation unit without the 6 touch senstive button yet you have the new style iDrive knob. The older style iDrive knob had both voice command and menu.

My question is...with the newer iDrive knob do you still get haptic feeback? (haptic feedback is in laymans terms simply force feedback--BMW got rid of the force feedback feature in March '07 production cars and also added the 6 touch sensitive buttons)

gIzzE · 07-31-2008, 04:41 AM

The controllers are all the same, the buttons can be swapped for single or a double with voice, and the software version dictates whether it has feedback or not.

AoshichanX · 07-31-2008, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gIzzE

The controllers are all the same, the buttons can be swapped for single or a double with voice, and the software version dictates whether it has feedback or not.

Software version huh? I have a very recent progman update and I still have haptic feedback...does the OP have haptic feedback? If he does then I guess it is limited by the CCC?

Or...

PS - Thanks a lot for the fast reply. I am loving your knowledge!

gIzzE · 07-31-2008, 04:57 AM

Maybe it isn't software related then??

I know that when you put the professional controller on a business system you loose feedback, but never tried the business controller on the professioal ccc.

Maybe they are just using the business controller in all cars from the paost 03/2007 cars, having that feedback maybe slows the system down a bit??

But when I had my previous car it had the single button, I got the voice retrofit as my car did not have it and they added the twin button, just pops out.

AoshichanX · 07-31-2008, 05:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gIzzE

Maybe it isn't software related then??

I know that when you put the professional controller on a business system you loose feedback, but never tried the business controller on the professioal ccc.

Maybe they are just using the business controller in all cars from the paost 03/2007 cars, having that feedback maybe slows the system down a bit??

But when I had my previous car it had the single button, I got the voice retrofit as my car did not have it and they added the twin button, just pops out.

Do you think replacing the CCC with the 6 programmable buttons with the my current one (that the OP has) will work with dealership reprogramming? Sigh I really wish I can talk about this stuff with my SA. I know I will just get blank stares.

gIzzE · 07-31-2008, 05:17 AM

I think you would be better to find a local garage with the Autologic system, get them to programme it, I think you're right BMW will just say 'No!'.

Booster4075 · 07-31-2008, 10:55 AM

The pictures I have show the one button controller...this is actually the wrong part for my car and progman would not program it. It was a professional "high" controller though - weird. I now have a US (correct) CCC and US (correct) controller with the two-buttons. I have v29.2 software, yet my haptic feedback still works - I kind of thought they did away with that too. To my knowledge, all controllers have haptic feedback capability, its just that in the newer software (supposedly), BMW reduced its feedback to speed up the software.

If someone gets the buttons programmed on the newer CCC (with a pre 3/07 car) - please share with us!

Booster4075 · 07-31-2008, 11:07 AM

I can't post the DIY to this site..I just won't let me. But I set it up on my FTP....it should work here...

http://home.comcast.net/~Booster/idr...e_retrofit.pdf

This document just talks about the dash / hardware changeout... I don't get into the programming aspect at all.

Hope this helps you guys..

gIzzE · 08-01-2008, 03:11 PM

Top drawer on doing that PDF mate, not many people would take the time to do a 52 page 'HOW TO'.

So well done from me.

Booster4075 · 08-03-2008, 04:15 AM

Thanks for the kudos. I'm working on a few more details at the end and need some more pictures from anyone who has got their car apart for this project. I think I got excited about the assembly and forgot to take more assembly pix!

I'm still working on a "hack" for the enabling codes for the voice recognition - this is turning out to be a little programming lesson for me. Anyone know xml and familiar with Base64? I'm learning as I go...but someone with raw know-how could probably tear through this little hack.

Also - I realized I forgot to also add "6UH" to my vehicle order. Here in the US, that 6UH is necessary for the CCC to supply traffic information (RTTI) on 9/06 and newer cars. Both my car and my CCC are newer so this "should" work. Although, I've had two acquaintances tell me that it might not be as simple as adding it to the VO. Anyone know details on this?

nicknaz · 08-03-2008, 05:36 AM

Is this really the most efficient use of your time and money? Just check the Navi option box next time you go car shopping.

Lassaxi · 08-04-2008, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

Is this really the most efficient use of your time and money? Just check the Navi option box next time you go car shopping.

That ship sailed months ago...

gIzzE · 08-04-2008, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

Is this really the most efficient use of your time and money? Just check the Navi option box next time you go car shopping.

How is it any different to someone buying a car and then changing the wheels, shocks, springs, tyres, grille, hood, trunk, interior trim, amps and speakers etc. etc.??

You can retrofit all this for around $1500, so if you have a car you like why not?

Booster4075 · 08-04-2008, 04:13 PM

A few updates were made to the retrofit doc, if anyone is interested. Please forward your pix to me if you have your car apart and I'll add them!

http://home.comcast.net/~Booster/idr...e_retrofit.pdf

gIzzE · 08-04-2008, 05:24 PM

I will try and take some pics when I do it.

I am meant to be doing some work on my E30 325i tomorrow, but I may swap the dashes over on the E91 instead.

Now when you hooked up the power, ground and can hi + lo and you took them to the connectors on the JBE was this purely to keep it as factory as possible??
What I am getting at is if I hook up to the stereo harness it won't throw any codes will it??
Surely can bus is a network that you can jump into anywhere??
There is no way the car could tell it was connected further down the cable?

canucklion · 08-04-2008, 11:38 PM

Awesome DIY write up. That's like a little novel right there.

I don't have the balls to do it, but am in awe that you do and went through with the project, kudos

Quote:

Originally Posted by Booster4075

I can't post the DIY to this site..I just won't let me. But I set it up on my FTP....it should work here...

http://home.comcast.net/~Booster/idr...e_retrofit.pdf

This document just talks about the dash / hardware changeout... I don't get into the programming aspect at all.

Hope this helps you guys..

07-21-2008, 04:59 PM	#221
gIzzE Major General 363 Rep 5,984 Posts Drives: F11 + 911 C4 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Norfolk, UK. iTrader: (2)	Is that setting it in the iDrive, on the climate or both?
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07-21-2008, 06:07 PM	#222
gIzzE Major General 363 Rep 5,984 Posts Drives: F11 + 911 C4 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Norfolk, UK. iTrader: (2)	You sure you have hooked up both connectors properly on the back of the climate controls?? I have just put the business nav back in my car quickly and tried climate and that seems to work fine. I can even control it through the iDrive. In fact the only problems I have with the retrofit without coding is...... No PDC bleep, but do have the display. No Journey computer, but still have the main OBC on the dash and on the iDrive. Also, the unit is obviously older than I was told firmware wise, not the grey menu and no bloody MP3 compatibility!! Everything is fine, the phone is seen no problem and works. I am not sure what the score is next to be honest, will BMW ever update this iDrive if it was not factory ordered?? Or when I change the vehicle order will it no longer matter and they will just do it as a matter of course?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

07-22-2008, 11:06 AM	#224
skim7x Colonel 208 Rep 2,558 Posts Drives: 335i, C63 AMG Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: USA iTrader: (4) Garage List 2007 335i [10.00]	Just to make it easier on everyone... Damn, that's sick... good luck! __________________ '07 Space Gray 335i coupe - R.I.P. COBB ProTuned \| AMS \| CP-e \| BMS \| Quaife
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07-27-2008, 02:05 PM	#225
Booster4075 First Lieutenant 43 Rep 391 Posts Drives: E90, 335i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Northern California iTrader: (1)	Retrofit Update Well, the last stages of the retrofit have come together! I got another (US) CCC and controller, got it all programmed and its 95% operable. It took me a little longer to get it all going since I had a faulty (brand-new) fakra antenna cable back to the TCU. Nav works with voice guidance, FM/AM/CD/Ipod, bluetooth, climate control, FTM, PDC...its nearly all working! No dash rattles either - yay! Anyway, the very last step in making this 100% is getting the voice recognition going, which isn't currently enabled. This will likely be a little more complicated, as any updates to the modules past Progman 25 (or something like that) require "enabling codes" which are encoded for every VIN. My car had voice recognition as a feature when it was stock (with the Professional radio), but if it has V/R when it is equipped with a CCC, a set of enabling files is required by Progman to enable the V/R. Problem is that my VIN is not known by BMW to have a CCC and V/R, so it cannot be enabled. Hmmm... Having gotten this far and 95% working, I have to say this retrofit is not for the faint of heart...merely changing hardware is only half the battle. If you are even contemplating doing this retrofit, secure someone, somewhere, who has the equipment and know-how to get this programmed FIRST, before buying anything. As these cars are technological masterpieces, it requires strong technical measures to enable our cars to recognize and use this retrofit equipment. If BMW had made a (authorized) retrofit, this would be as simple as going down to the local dealer. Unfortunately, there is no "retrofit" and dealership service departments have no idea how to do this and don't really want to help even if you throw money at it. It is likely that there is a saavy technician or two at each shop who does know how change a vehicle order and "make things work", but isn't "allowed" to do it for customer cars. This is nothing like the old days of putting in a car stereo and amp and having it work out of the box. That being said, I have no regrets in doing this retrofit and have learned a lot along the way. Some other notes I have; -When I had the (UK) CCC and controller in my car, progman would not program anything in the car until those parts were changed out. In addition, I later realized that my cruise control and hill-holder (start-off assist) were inoperative. Don't know why, but there must have been some conflict in the DSC. My CCC was out of a 320d, which I've been told doesn't have cruise control. Interesting. Moral to this tale and my retrofit experience: Find out what part number(s) applies to your car (including supersessions) and only use THAT equipment. (I practically had to buy two of everything to figure out what was up.) I really wanted to put in the newer CCC (>3/07) but have questions whether Progman would have programmed it or if I could have even gotten the extra buttons to work - I didn't chance it a third time. Please let me know if someone figures it out! -While trying to figure out what the hell was up with my Nav not working right, I realized that it was using dead-reckoning to navigate (without the antenna.) I didn't realize this and just observed the navigation getting farther and farther out of proper position. The sure way to know if the CCC is getting a navigation signal is to check the "vehicle position" screen - if is displays an altitude, its getting a signal. That field will be blank (even though Longitude & Latitude are displayed) - if no altitude is displayed, the Lat & Long are likely off of actual. If no signal is received by the nav antenna, the CCC will use internal compass and vehicle speed to estimate the position. This works for tunnels and garages, but not for driving around in general - after a few days, I found my nav was 50+ miles off. Lesson learned: Even new parts don't always work. (brand new fakra antenna cable shorted internally.) Oh yeah, the D-I-Y is coming....haven't finished it yet, but it will have pix and a basic guide to doing this retrofit.
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07-30-2008, 04:40 AM	#226
Booster4075 First Lieutenant 43 Rep 391 Posts Drives: E90, 335i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Northern California iTrader: (1)	A little off-topic, but I've finished the DIY PDF (2.62 MB) and the site won't accept it as a valid upload... "Upload of file failed." - kind of vague. The guide says this site will accept .pdf's up to 9.54 MB. Any ideas? I've been able to upload smaller (<1MB) files without an issue.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

07-31-2008, 04:41 AM	#228
gIzzE Major General 363 Rep 5,984 Posts Drives: F11 + 911 C4 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Norfolk, UK. iTrader: (2)	The controllers are all the same, the buttons can be swapped for single or a double with voice, and the software version dictates whether it has feedback or not.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

07-31-2008, 04:57 AM	#230
gIzzE Major General 363 Rep 5,984 Posts Drives: F11 + 911 C4 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Norfolk, UK. iTrader: (2)	Maybe it isn't software related then?? I know that when you put the professional controller on a business system you loose feedback, but never tried the business controller on the professioal ccc. Maybe they are just using the business controller in all cars from the paost 03/2007 cars, having that feedback maybe slows the system down a bit?? But when I had my previous car it had the single button, I got the voice retrofit as my car did not have it and they added the twin button, just pops out.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

07-31-2008, 05:17 AM	#232
gIzzE Major General 363 Rep 5,984 Posts Drives: F11 + 911 C4 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Norfolk, UK. iTrader: (2)	I think you would be better to find a local garage with the Autologic system, get them to programme it, I think you're right BMW will just say 'No!'.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

07-31-2008, 10:55 AM	#233
Booster4075 First Lieutenant 43 Rep 391 Posts Drives: E90, 335i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Northern California iTrader: (1)	The pictures I have show the one button controller...this is actually the wrong part for my car and progman would not program it. It was a professional "high" controller though - weird. I now have a US (correct) CCC and US (correct) controller with the two-buttons. I have v29.2 software, yet my haptic feedback still works - I kind of thought they did away with that too. To my knowledge, all controllers have haptic feedback capability, its just that in the newer software (supposedly), BMW reduced its feedback to speed up the software. If someone gets the buttons programmed on the newer CCC (with a pre 3/07 car) - please share with us!
	Appreciate 0 Quote

07-31-2008, 11:07 AM	#234
Booster4075 First Lieutenant 43 Rep 391 Posts Drives: E90, 335i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Northern California iTrader: (1)	I can't post the DIY to this site..I just won't let me. But I set it up on my FTP....it should work here... http://home.comcast.net/~Booster/idr...e_retrofit.pdf This document just talks about the dash / hardware changeout... I don't get into the programming aspect at all. Hope this helps you guys..
	Appreciate 0 Quote

08-01-2008, 03:11 PM	#235
gIzzE Major General 363 Rep 5,984 Posts Drives: F11 + 911 C4 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Norfolk, UK. iTrader: (2)	Top drawer on doing that PDF mate, not many people would take the time to do a 52 page 'HOW TO'. So well done from me.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

08-03-2008, 04:15 AM	#236
Booster4075 First Lieutenant 43 Rep 391 Posts Drives: E90, 335i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Northern California iTrader: (1)	Thanks for the kudos. I'm working on a few more details at the end and need some more pictures from anyone who has got their car apart for this project. I think I got excited about the assembly and forgot to take more assembly pix! I'm still working on a "hack" for the enabling codes for the voice recognition - this is turning out to be a little programming lesson for me. Anyone know xml and familiar with Base64? I'm learning as I go...but someone with raw know-how could probably tear through this little hack. Also - I realized I forgot to also add "6UH" to my vehicle order. Here in the US, that 6UH is necessary for the CCC to supply traffic information (RTTI) on 9/06 and newer cars. Both my car and my CCC are newer so this "should" work. Although, I've had two acquaintances tell me that it might not be as simple as adding it to the VO. Anyone know details on this?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

08-03-2008, 05:36 AM	#237
nicknaz Lieutenant General 3187 Rep 10,509 Posts Drives: C6Z Join Date: May 2008 Location: NorCal iTrader: (0)	Is this really the most efficient use of your time and money? Just check the Navi option box next time you go car shopping.
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08-04-2008, 04:13 PM	#240
Booster4075 First Lieutenant 43 Rep 391 Posts Drives: E90, 335i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Northern California iTrader: (1)	A few updates were made to the retrofit doc, if anyone is interested. Please forward your pix to me if you have your car apart and I'll add them! http://home.comcast.net/~Booster/idr...e_retrofit.pdf
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08-04-2008, 05:24 PM	#241
gIzzE Major General 363 Rep 5,984 Posts Drives: F11 + 911 C4 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Norfolk, UK. iTrader: (2)	I will try and take some pics when I do it. I am meant to be doing some work on my E30 325i tomorrow, but I may swap the dashes over on the E91 instead. Now when you hooked up the power, ground and can hi + lo and you took them to the connectors on the JBE was this purely to keep it as factory as possible?? What I am getting at is if I hook up to the stereo harness it won't throw any codes will it?? Surely can bus is a network that you can jump into anywhere?? There is no way the car could tell it was connected further down the cable?
	Appreciate 0 Quote