Audio Upgrade Advice for an E90

Kid Red · 11-05-2012, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bryanz

All my research is leading me to the XD600/6 also. I'm going to stick with the OEM speakers for now, I've read they're halfway decent with a good amp. If not, you can always upgrade the speakers as a second step.

Where are your 6 channels going?

I'm thinking about a few options as well:

Option1-
Center coaxial
MS-8
SWS8 + amp

Option2-
Center coaxial
MS-8
Amp OE under seats
Trunk sub + amp

Other option is replace front speaks and add sub with a 5 or 6 channel amp like you mentioned. Does everyone get the MS-8 by default? I have L7 and I'm unclear if that's a must have.

ctuna · 11-05-2012, 10:14 PM

Morels are better for the doors for SQ
This is what the experts say and I have no reason to doubt it.
They play lower than the door offering by Jehnerts was the instruction .
They do not fit in the coupe door though but do fit in the 4 door
and wagon.
I have the Morel dotechs in the doors and the Jehnerts in the floors.
I may not be able to tune it perfectly but is sounds damm good
with just the Jl 600/6
This setup gives sound quality across the board with bias toward the bass but it is quality non boomy accurate bass.

Most all that buy the ms-8 find they don't power the under seats well and there is and enormous improvement in everything once they add and amp with decent power.

MJ777LR · 11-05-2012, 11:03 PM

kaigoss and ctuna, yes, I do agree very much with your points, and thanks for sharing! I'd perhaps like to clarify that I was by no means suggesting that the Jehnerts were the 'best sounding' option. I was indeed considering the new Morel Virtus, which VP Electricity had suggested at the beginning of the thread. After thinking a lot though, I figured that if I got a set of Morels, I'd probably pair them with the XE200 underseats, and not the SWS-8 as initially planned. Unfortunately, this would probably cost me more than the Flatlines, not to mention having to fabricate my own adapter rings as well. I'm absolutely looking forward to upgrading my system, but at the same time I also can't bring myself to do it at too much of an expense (My car's maturing in age and my wallet might start to empty itself more frequently now, if you get what I mean!

) That train of thought then led me to the Flatlines, which cost less, all things considered, and also came with the necessary parts to adapt the speakers to the car mounts. I guess when I said 'tuned system', I meant that the crossover included in the Flatline was designed to work with the drivers provided as part of the kit, as in crossing the frequencies at the optimum points with respect to those drivers, so apologies if I had not phrased that with the correct terminology.

One thing I do wish I could do is to actually hear for myself what these systems sound like. Unfortunately for where I'm located, there's not much in way of car audio specialists or group meets.

But yes, I'm still considering the many options, including mixing and matching components, and seeing what will work out to be the optimal choice!

ctuna · 11-06-2012, 01:15 AM

Yeah hearing this stuff is a problem
But if you did you would probably pull out your check book right away. You can pretty much count on VP's guidance and description of what you get though.
If you put in the xd 600 with any of the speaker options you mention it should be a huge improvement over the Hi Fi.
The xd 600 handles the crossover between the under seats and the doors anyway.

dmatre · 11-06-2012, 10:21 AM

If you get everything from MusicarNW, (this sounds like the Stage 1 + kit), then all the rings, spacers, connectors, etc. are included.

It's literally plug & play (starting from HiFi) and should take you around 6 hours to do a 100% first-class job.

And the sound is fantastic (you won't be disappointed with the cost/quality relationship).

ASU · 01-05-2013, 09:42 PM

I am not sure if you have done anything yet since it has been quite some time since the last post.

I have a M3 2011 with the upgraded Dirac system and it still doesn't sound all that great. I found one company that specializes in BMW called Bavarian Soundwerks ... www.bavariansoundwerks.com

You might want to look into them. I intend to upgrade my speakers as a stop gap for now as I don't want to do a rip and custom install. They are coming out with an amp upgrade soon I understand.

ctuna · 01-05-2013, 11:10 PM

Yeah they been coming out with that amp for years now.
And they still have no replacements for the under seats
I am aware of.
I also thought the Dirac had speakers that were better than the L7 which some say aren't that bad.
And since this is an old thread who were you talking to ?

ASU · 01-05-2013, 11:28 PM

the OP...

However, generally speaking I don't particularly appreciate any of the BMW systems. I have heard the L7 and my Dirac back to back and marginal if any real difference.

As for the amp...you're right it seems like it has been coming for almost 2 years now and it has been that long since I started thinking about changing up the system or just speakers and I still haven't done anything. Decided to focus on other mods.

ctuna · 01-05-2013, 11:48 PM

ASU If you want to upgrade it contact MusicarNW

It sounds you want something very high end I probably would have been
happy with L7 but I got High Fi in a used wagon. I got MusicarNW level 2
system I am pretty happy with.
Best System I have ever had in a car or maybe in anything.

If you have a L7 amp you will have to rip a lot out to get it sound better.

koss2010 · 01-09-2013, 03:51 AM

I had a question about amps and the HiFi system which is along the lines of OPs concern. I too have the HiFi system and from what I have gathered is the signal for the HiFi system is "full ranged and unprocessed" does that mean I dont need sound processing unit like the MS-8 ? Is there a significant advantage of the MS-8 over the XD600/6 if you already have the HiFi system ?

ctuna · 01-09-2013, 11:23 AM

Its a quality mid range priced amp.
It has the exact number of channels to match Hi Fi(xd 600/6)
It fits in the same area as the OEM Hi Fi amp
It has the right kind of Inputs to be compatible with the
Hi Fi Head Unit . (balanced differential inputs)
If you get good speakers with just the amp its pretty awesome.
If you like old style stereo with Morels and Jehnerts this is
an audiophile level system.

If you get an ms-8 you probably want to add more speakers
and you really need and amp at least for the speakers in the front
of the car.
Most all the people that get ms-8's eventually add an amp to.
The MS-8 only has head unit power.
After saying this there do seem to be a lot of people that really like it
and if has an almost cult following.

koss2010 · 01-09-2013, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctuna

Its a quality mid range priced amp.
It has the exact number of channels to match Hi Fi(xd 600/6)
It fits in the same area as the OEM Hi Fi amp
It has the right kind of Inputs to be compatible with the
Hi Fi Head Unit . (balanced differential inputs)
If you get good speakers with just the amp its pretty awesome.
If you like old style stereo with Morels and Jehnerts this is
an audiophile level system.

If you get an ms-8 you probably want to add more speakers
and you really need and amp at least for the speakers in the front
of the car.
Most all the people that get ms-8's eventually add an amp to.
The MS-8 only has head unit power.
After saying this there do seem to be a lot of people that really like it
and if has an almost cult following.

THANKS

!!

Exactly what I was thinking, my thoughts are the MS-8 is more popular for those with the L7 or Hifi system.

VP Electricity · 01-09-2013, 04:36 PM

No one needs the MS-8. It is popular to use with the small 2-ohm mids and tweeters of the Premium Sound systems.

But if you have a HiFi system, your signal needs no correction. If you have a Premium Sound or a Stereo system, your signal does need some correction

kaigoss69 · 01-09-2013, 05:04 PM

I doesn't matter what the signal is, the MS-8 works well with all BMW systems. However it is not just an un-EQ thingy, it is so much more than that...

VP Electricity · 01-09-2013, 05:32 PM

Kai, the question was about "need". Yes, it does a lot more than that.

ctuna · 01-09-2013, 07:21 PM

I though Premium was a synonym for the Hi Fi system .
Since they re released the Hi Fi in 2011 is there a noticeable difference
beside the tweeter delete to the rear speaker set.

Also the Hi Fi system is the one system that accepts and amp
with no signal processing required and since the stock amp in the
Hi Fi is so wimpy changing it out is one of the easy fixes for the this system.

MJ777LR · 01-11-2013, 06:41 AM

Wow, I haven't checked back here for a while. I thought I'd update you guys on my final choice of setup. I went with the JL XD600/6 for the amp, and the Jehnert Flatlines for the speakers. I know there's some concensus that other options like the Morels perform better in some areas than the Flatlines, but in the end, the 'all-in-one' factor made me choose the Jehnerts. Also, I'll be mounting my amp and crossovers in the trunk, and laying new wiring for each connection between the amp and drivers.

I haven't installed them yet, so I can't contribute on how they sound, but I'm sure they'll be a fantastic upgrade from the Hifi that I have now!

ctuna · 01-11-2013, 11:47 AM

Take picture of the wire routing for the new wire to the speakers.
As its one of the less documented things here.

jvsxn · 01-12-2013, 09:52 PM

Can anyone chime in on Alpine's mrp-m500 amp? It's going into a 2006 E90 with HiFi system.

kaigoss69 · 01-13-2013, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VP Electricity

No one needs the MS-8. It is popular to use with the small 2-ohm mids and tweeters of the Premium Sound systems.

But if you have a HiFi system, your signal needs no correction. If you have a Premium Sound or a Stereo system, your signal does need some correction

Well the question was also raised whether there was a significant advantage over using the MS-8 over just using the JL amp with a flat signal. The answer is that there is a huge difference in what the ms-8 can do with the signal going to the speakers and the sound between an unprocessed signal and a processed and optimized signal is night and day.

Chill13 · 02-04-2013, 03:07 PM

Would this setup work
XD600/6 Amp
http://www.amazon.com/XD600-Audio-6-.../dp/B004E9QK3E
Alpine Sps 410
Would these fit?
http://www.amazon.com/Alpine-Type-s-...=alpine+sps410
Alpine Sub
http://www.amazon.com/SWS-12D2-Alpin...pine+type+r+12
Alpine Amp
http://www.amazon.com/MRX-M50-Alpine...ref=pd_sim_e_3

And technic harness

mob17 · 02-04-2013, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chill13

Would this setup work
XD600/6 Amp
http://www.amazon.com/XD600-Audio-6-.../dp/B004E9QK3E
Alpine Sps 410
Would these fit?
http://www.amazon.com/Alpine-Type-s-...=alpine+sps410
Alpine Sub
http://www.amazon.com/SWS-12D2-Alpin...pine+type+r+12
Alpine Amp
http://www.amazon.com/MRX-M50-Alpine...ref=pd_sim_e_3

And technic harness

Mate if you aren't capable of starting a thread and want to thread jack, at least limit it to one! You've posted the same question on 3 separate threads

Regarding your question, have a good thorough read of the audio sticky at the top of the page.

11-05-2012, 10:14 PM	#24
ctuna Lieutenant General 1911 Rep 13,103 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Morels are better for the doors for SQ Morels are better for the doors for SQ This is what the experts say and I have no reason to doubt it. They play lower than the door offering by Jehnerts was the instruction . They do not fit in the coupe door though but do fit in the 4 door and wagon. I have the Morel dotechs in the doors and the Jehnerts in the floors. I may not be able to tune it perfectly but is sounds damm good with just the Jl 600/6 This setup gives sound quality across the board with bias toward the bass but it is quality non boomy accurate bass. Most all that buy the ms-8 find they don't power the under seats well and there is and enormous improvement in everything once they add and amp with decent power. Last edited by ctuna; 11-05-2012 at 10:23 PM..
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-05-2012, 11:03 PM	#25
MJ777LR Private First Class 22 Rep 133 Posts Drives: 2007 BMW328i Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kansas iTrader: (1)	kaigoss and ctuna, yes, I do agree very much with your points, and thanks for sharing! I'd perhaps like to clarify that I was by no means suggesting that the Jehnerts were the 'best sounding' option. I was indeed considering the new Morel Virtus, which VP Electricity had suggested at the beginning of the thread. After thinking a lot though, I figured that if I got a set of Morels, I'd probably pair them with the XE200 underseats, and not the SWS-8 as initially planned. Unfortunately, this would probably cost me more than the Flatlines, not to mention having to fabricate my own adapter rings as well. I'm absolutely looking forward to upgrading my system, but at the same time I also can't bring myself to do it at too much of an expense (My car's maturing in age and my wallet might start to empty itself more frequently now, if you get what I mean! ) That train of thought then led me to the Flatlines, which cost less, all things considered, and also came with the necessary parts to adapt the speakers to the car mounts. I guess when I said 'tuned system', I meant that the crossover included in the Flatline was designed to work with the drivers provided as part of the kit, as in crossing the frequencies at the optimum points with respect to those drivers, so apologies if I had not phrased that with the correct terminology. One thing I do wish I could do is to actually hear for myself what these systems sound like. Unfortunately for where I'm located, there's not much in way of car audio specialists or group meets. But yes, I'm still considering the many options, including mixing and matching components, and seeing what will work out to be the optimal choice!
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-06-2012, 01:15 AM	#26
ctuna Lieutenant General 1911 Rep 13,103 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Yeah hearing this stuff is a problem Yeah hearing this stuff is a problem But if you did you would probably pull out your check book right away. You can pretty much count on VP's guidance and description of what you get though. If you put in the xd 600 with any of the speaker options you mention it should be a huge improvement over the Hi Fi. The xd 600 handles the crossover between the under seats and the doors anyway. Last edited by ctuna; 11-06-2012 at 11:27 AM..
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11-06-2012, 10:21 AM	#27
dmatre Captain 665 Rep 740 Posts Drives: 2011 328i Sedan Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: The Carolinas iTrader: (0)	If you get everything from MusicarNW, (this sounds like the Stage 1 + kit), then all the rings, spacers, connectors, etc. are included. It's literally plug & play (starting from HiFi) and should take you around 6 hours to do a 100% first-class job. And the sound is fantastic (you won't be disappointed with the cost/quality relationship).
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01-05-2013, 09:42 PM	#28
ASU Second Lieutenant 7 Rep 200 Posts Drives: 2011 M3 E93 DCT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	I am not sure if you have done anything yet since it has been quite some time since the last post. I have a M3 2011 with the upgraded Dirac system and it still doesn't sound all that great. I found one company that specializes in BMW called Bavarian Soundwerks ... www.bavariansoundwerks.com You might want to look into them. I intend to upgrade my speakers as a stop gap for now as I don't want to do a rip and custom install. They are coming out with an amp upgrade soon I understand.
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01-05-2013, 11:10 PM	#29
ctuna Lieutenant General 1911 Rep 13,103 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Yeah they been coming out with that for years now. Yeah they been coming out with that amp for years now. And they still have no replacements for the under seats I am aware of. I also thought the Dirac had speakers that were better than the L7 which some say aren't that bad. And since this is an old thread who were you talking to ? Last edited by ctuna; 01-05-2013 at 11:17 PM..
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01-05-2013, 11:28 PM	#30
ASU Second Lieutenant 7 Rep 200 Posts Drives: 2011 M3 E93 DCT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	the OP... However, generally speaking I don't particularly appreciate any of the BMW systems. I have heard the L7 and my Dirac back to back and marginal if any real difference. As for the amp...you're right it seems like it has been coming for almost 2 years now and it has been that long since I started thinking about changing up the system or just speakers and I still haven't done anything. Decided to focus on other mods.
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01-05-2013, 11:48 PM	#31
ctuna Lieutenant General 1911 Rep 13,103 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	ASU If you want to upgrade it contact MusicarNW ASU If you want to upgrade it contact MusicarNW It sounds you want something very high end I probably would have been happy with L7 but I got High Fi in a used wagon. I got MusicarNW level 2 system I am pretty happy with. Best System I have ever had in a car or maybe in anything. If you have a L7 amp you will have to rip a lot out to get it sound better.
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01-09-2013, 03:51 AM	#32
koss2010 Private 4 Rep 75 Posts Drives: 09 335i coupe Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Houston, TX iTrader: (0)	I had a question about amps and the HiFi system which is along the lines of OPs concern. I too have the HiFi system and from what I have gathered is the signal for the HiFi system is "full ranged and unprocessed" does that mean I dont need sound processing unit like the MS-8 ? Is there a significant advantage of the MS-8 over the XD600/6 if you already have the HiFi system ?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

01-09-2013, 11:23 AM	#33
ctuna Lieutenant General 1911 Rep 13,103 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Reason's for the XD Its a quality mid range priced amp. It has the exact number of channels to match Hi Fi(xd 600/6) It fits in the same area as the OEM Hi Fi amp It has the right kind of Inputs to be compatible with the Hi Fi Head Unit . (balanced differential inputs) If you get good speakers with just the amp its pretty awesome. If you like old style stereo with Morels and Jehnerts this is an audiophile level system. If you get an ms-8 you probably want to add more speakers and you really need and amp at least for the speakers in the front of the car. Most all the people that get ms-8's eventually add an amp to. The MS-8 only has head unit power. After saying this there do seem to be a lot of people that really like it and if has an almost cult following. Last edited by ctuna; 01-09-2013 at 12:16 PM..
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01-09-2013, 04:36 PM	#35
VP Electricity Brigadier General 289 Rep 3,201 Posts Drives: F34 xDrive Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: portland oregon iTrader: (3)	No one needs the MS-8. It is popular to use with the small 2-ohm mids and tweeters of the Premium Sound systems. But if you have a HiFi system, your signal needs no correction. If you have a Premium Sound or a Stereo system, your signal does need some correction
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01-09-2013, 05:04 PM	#36
kaigoss69 Brigadier General 300 Rep 3,969 Posts Drives: '08 335i Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: JAX iTrader: (6)	I doesn't matter what the signal is, the MS-8 works well with all BMW systems. However it is not just an un-EQ thingy, it is so much more than that... __________________ Mobridge DA2 > JBL MS-8 > ARC XDi 600/4 > JBL Gti 408 Mids & Vifa OT19 Tweeters; PG Ti2 1600.5 > Morel HCW-10 & IDMax 15
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01-09-2013, 05:32 PM	#37
VP Electricity Brigadier General 289 Rep 3,201 Posts Drives: F34 xDrive Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: portland oregon iTrader: (3)	Kai, the question was about "need". Yes, it does a lot more than that.
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01-09-2013, 07:21 PM	#38
ctuna Lieutenant General 1911 Rep 13,103 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Uh doesn't the Premium system=the Hi Fi system I though Premium was a synonym for the Hi Fi system . Since they re released the Hi Fi in 2011 is there a noticeable difference beside the tweeter delete to the rear speaker set. Also the Hi Fi system is the one system that accepts and amp with no signal processing required and since the stock amp in the Hi Fi is so wimpy changing it out is one of the easy fixes for the this system.
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01-11-2013, 06:41 AM	#39
MJ777LR Private First Class 22 Rep 133 Posts Drives: 2007 BMW328i Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kansas iTrader: (1)	Wow, I haven't checked back here for a while. I thought I'd update you guys on my final choice of setup. I went with the JL XD600/6 for the amp, and the Jehnert Flatlines for the speakers. I know there's some concensus that other options like the Morels perform better in some areas than the Flatlines, but in the end, the 'all-in-one' factor made me choose the Jehnerts. Also, I'll be mounting my amp and crossovers in the trunk, and laying new wiring for each connection between the amp and drivers. I haven't installed them yet, so I can't contribute on how they sound, but I'm sure they'll be a fantastic upgrade from the Hifi that I have now! Last edited by MJ777LR; 01-11-2013 at 11:17 AM..
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01-11-2013, 11:47 AM	#40
ctuna Lieutenant General 1911 Rep 13,103 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Take picture of the wire routing. Take picture of the wire routing for the new wire to the speakers. As its one of the less documented things here.
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01-12-2013, 09:52 PM	#41
jvsxn Lieutenant Colonel 101 Rep 1,727 Posts Drives: e-ninety Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: San Jose, CA iTrader: (8)	Can anyone chime in on Alpine's mrp-m500 amp? It's going into a 2006 E90 with HiFi system. __________________ Hiatus
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02-04-2013, 03:07 PM	#43
Chill13 Registered 0 Rep 3 Posts Drives: 06 325i Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0)	Would this setup work XD600/6 Amp http://www.amazon.com/XD600-Audio-6-.../dp/B004E9QK3E Alpine Sps 410 Would these fit? http://www.amazon.com/Alpine-Type-s-...=alpine+sps410 Alpine Sub http://www.amazon.com/SWS-12D2-Alpin...pine+type+r+12 Alpine Amp http://www.amazon.com/MRX-M50-Alpine...ref=pd_sim_e_3 And technic harness
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