Bavarian Technic Diagnostic Tool

mwahlert · 02-10-2009, 01:15 PM

HI Mark,

We do sell a professional version interface cable by itself for $649 but it is not much less expensive then our professional kit. This is because the additional accessories only add about $100 to the cost. Our primary customers are professional shops the additional features supported in the Professional version are consider advanced features that may get enthusiast users into trouble. The professional version adds two things Coding and Command console. Coding is the ability to change the codable parameters inside the control module and allows you to enable options and configurations. On most cars with I-Drive they can perform coding from I-drive for most modules. It also allows you to make a backup of the coding from the control module and restore the coding to a new control module this is useful for shops that need to replace a control module. Currently the coding capability of the software is still limited but we will be adding many more codable values as we get feedback from our users as to what is important to them. We do offer some coding where the factory equipment does not for example on MSV80 we can code the vehicles top speed. Coding should not be confused with programming the software will not allow you to read out the entire memory of the control module and re-write it. Command console is a direct communications with the control module this has proved useful for customers that damaged their control modules through other tools but most users would not know what to do with it. Command console should not be confused with Commands. Commands is the ability to send diagnostic messages to the module like Reset Adaptations or Reinitialize the rain sensor. Commands are supported in the enthusiast version.

While you can use our product without an internet connection the software is designed to be used with an internet connection. If you have an internet connection the software will start by reading the VIN from the car then querying our web-service to decode the vehicle information. We are also publishing a lot of BMW specific repair information onto our wiki site that includes procedures for common problems and solutions. Over time we will be linking faults in the software to repair information on our wiki.

Our product is still very new, we have been quietly developing it for over two years and it has been in beta by 40 professional BMW technicians for the last 6 months. We still have many plans for development are continuing to add new features on a weekly basis. We have plans to introduce programming but have not yet figured out how we can introduce this and not open ourselves to a lot of liability for users that do not know what they are doing and damage their car. We are currently considering offering programming through professional tuners so the software would allow users to read and write binaries that have been prepared and signed by professional tuners and the tuners would than take the responsibility for the tune.
On MSD80/MSD81 used with the N54 we support over 600 actual values while the factory tool used at the dealer only support about 45. Our sampling rate will depend on the year of your E90, up to 2008 the baud rate is 115200, and as of 2009 the baud rate is 500,000. The sampling rate can be adjusted in the software to sample faster or slower, but in general you can expect at least 10-20 samples per second, if you set the sampling to the fastest rate you will need a fast computer but you can sample up to 30 or 40 samples a second. But this will really depend on the values that you are selecting, as selecting many dissimilar values will slow down the sampling rate. BMW does not use a channels concept on this control module. Our tool can sample values approximatly 5 times faster than the GT1. We also provide some advanced graphing features along with the ability to export the data to Excel.

For more information about our coverage for MSD80 please see our wiki page. http://wiki.bavariantechnic.com/inde...mens_MSD80_DME

As for the list of all possible actual values, we had them on our wiki for some control modules but pulled them down because they used so much space and the list was many pages long. In general we have every possible value that the control module supports. Usually in a calculated value as well as a raw AD value. There are also some duplicates as the same values can be read from multiple places in the control modules memory. You can still look at our old page that has all the actual values listed with this link http://wiki.bavariantechnic.com/inde...80_DME&oldid=9

Our product should not be confused with and OBD2 tool as it does not even do the OBD2 protocol. Our software can access modern BMW's exactly as the factory tool can and provides the same fault and diagnostic information available int he factory system. Though in many cases we provide more information than the factory system does.

Please let me know if you have any questions.

Best Regards,
Duram
Bavarian Technic

Bubbles · 02-10-2009, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawdude

Wish I could correlate your "lawdude special" with something relevant to my post, but then I'm from south georgia where we don't have the remarkable wit south floridians think they have.

Tip: Don't try too hard with your metaphors. Looks like you're trying to create a point where none exists.

I don't know what's worse:

1. Being told I am unfunny;

or

2. Being accused of being South Floridian.

Bubbles · 02-10-2009, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mwahlert

We have plans to introduce programming but have not yet figured out how we can introduce this and not open ourselves to a lot of liability for users that do not know what they are doing and damage their car. We are currently considering offering programming through professional tuners so the software would allow users to read and write binaries that have been prepared and signed by professional tuners and the tuners would than take the responsibility for the tune.
Please let me know if you have any questions.

Best Regards,
Duram
Bavarian Technic

Great info! Thanks!

Ilma · 02-10-2009, 01:33 PM

Breaking news flash.....this just in:

http://wiki.bavariantechnic.com/inde...g_box_detected

2D25 Mass Air Flow Excessive - External tuning box detected

2D25 is stored in the MSD81 control module when an external tuning box is detected. These systems work by manipulating the control signals to and from the engine control module. When this fault is detected by BMW dealers diagnostic tools this information is sent to BMW. Some customers have received letters from BMW stating that their warranty has been voided from the use of an external tuning device.

This fault code can be cleared just link any other fault code.

lawdude · 02-10-2009, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubbles

I don't know what's worse:

1. Being told I am unfunny;

or

2. Being accused of being South Floridian.

1. You're funny, just not in a good way.

and

2. Did you move?

NM_BMW · 02-10-2009, 01:40 PM

Subscribed. This looks promising.

Looking forward to your feedback Scalbert.

Ilma · 02-10-2009, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawdude

Wish I could correlate your "lawdude special" with something relevant to my post, but then I'm from south georgia where we don't have the remarkable wit south floridians think they have.

Tip: Don't try too hard with your metaphors. Looks like you're trying to create a point where none exists.

Perhaps this is this what you were trying to convey?

flem · 02-10-2009, 01:48 PM

I am extremely interested to see where this is heading...

Subbing to this thread

ar design · 02-10-2009, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilma

Breaking news flash.....this just in:

http://wiki.bavariantechnic.com/inde...g_box_detected

2D25 Mass Air Flow Excessive - External tuning box detected

2D25 is stored in the MSD81 control module when an external tuning box is detected. These systems work by manipulating the control signals to and from the engine control module. When this fault is detected by BMW dealers diagnostic tools this information is sent to BMW. Some customers have received letters from BMW stating that their warranty has been voided from the use of an external tuning device.

This fault code can be cleared just link any other fault code.

N54 doesn't have a mass air flow sensor?

slubu · 02-10-2009, 01:53 PM

Where does it say no MSD81 support?

NM_BMW · 02-10-2009, 02:01 PM

If you started out with the enthusiast package and wanted to upgrade to the pro later, would you have to buy the new cable package or is it just pay the fee and download new software? I guess if you wanted the 50' extension and round cable you could buy them, but to upgrade is it just a software fee to unlock the command console and coding?

goowatchi · 02-10-2009, 02:02 PM

I've been doing research on shops with GT1 and/or Autologic, but if this proves to be functionally and diagnostically the same as the GT1 or Autologic, then I definitely plan on owning one. Hopefully, Scalbert's research will give us more info!

Ilma · 02-10-2009, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ar design

N54 doesn't have a mass air flow sensor?

That description is probably just the text they have assigned to pop up when that particular code is thrown.

Don't forget that they make this product for multiple BMW platforms, many of which have a MAF sensor.

Could just be an oversight on their part....but I do agree with you on the N54 having a MAP sensor.

A418t81 · 02-10-2009, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilma

That description is probably just the text they have assigned to pop up when that particular code is thrown.

Don't forget that they make this product for multiple BMW platforms, many of which have a MAF sensor.

Could just be an oversight on their part....but I do agree with you on the N54 having a MAP sensor.

Mass airflow excessive has nothing to do with a MAF sensor, though the names are similar. The N54 DME has a full gas law model of the engine at all times. It knows the air mass the engine is flowing at any given time based on a number of different inputs. Even if the MAP sensor is attenuated, it takes more fuel to make more power. Until the piggies started increasing the fuel pressure, which the DME is not aware of, since they mimic stock pressure values back to the computer, the only other way was to use 02 sensor offsets, which the computer is well aware of the fact that its adding in additional fuel. The computer sees the mass of the fuel its injecting, and based on other calculations, can "see" the mass of the air in the cylinder is exceeding what it should be (which obviously is the case if you are running 14 psi vs. 8, that's at least an additional 30-40% increase in air mass over stock . And thus the code..

Ilma · 02-10-2009, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A418t81

Mass airflow excessive has nothing to do with a MAF sensor, though the names are similar. The N54 DME has a full gas law model of the engine at all times. It knows the air mass the engine is flowing at any given time based on a number of different inputs. Even if the MAP sensor is attenuated, it takes more fuel to make more power. Until the piggies started increasing the fuel pressure, which the DME is not aware of, since they mimic stock pressure values back to the computer, the only other way was to use 02 sensor offsets, which the computer is well aware of the fact that its adding in additional fuel. The computer sees the mass of the fuel its injecting, and based on other calculations, can "see" the mass of the air in the cylinder is exceeding what it should be (which obviously is the case if you are running 14 psi vs. 8, that's at least an additional 30-40% increase in air mass over stock . And thus the code..

Thanks for that clarification.....the code makes perfect sense then.

There are obviously a a lot of background calculations going on that can infer the amount of air volume being consumed in spite of a lack of MAF sensor.

Septro · 02-10-2009, 05:04 PM

I think whoever brings this to the nest regional meet will probably be more popular than the M3s and Porsches that show up everyone wants to see.

I'ma start putting this on my list of mods if this thing pans out to be the code-clearing tool of year.

mwahlert · 02-10-2009, 05:32 PM

well add me to the list - i just ordered the professional cable.

scalbert · 02-10-2009, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubbles

2. Being accused of being South Floridian.

Hrmm, if living in South Florida and not native:

A) You came across on a raft from Cuba

B) You are from the Northeast.

scalbert · 02-10-2009, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mwahlert

Command console should not be confused with Commands. Commands is the ability to send diagnostic messages to the module like Reset Adaptations or Reinitialize the rain sensor. Commands are supported in the enthusiast version.

Glad to see the above mentioned, it makes me feel better as I would sometimes like to reset adapatation channels.

Thanks for sending the email, it was very useful.

And got confirmation a short time ago that mine shipped. This does look like the tool we have been waiting on.

mwahlert · 02-10-2009, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scalbert

Glad to see the above mentioned, it makes me feel better as I would sometimes like to reset adapatation channels.

Thanks for sending the email, it was very useful.

And got confirmation a short time ago that mine shipped. This does look like the tool we have been waiting on.

mine should ship tomorrow - hope to have it by the weekend.

which did you order?

Bubbles · 02-10-2009, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scalbert

Hrmm, if living in South Florida and not native:

A) You came across on a raft from Cuba

B) You are from the Northeast.

I don't speak a word of Spanish and I don't like the Yankees/Red Soxs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335iAW

Fixed...

+1 They don't call it God's waiting room for nothing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by scalbert

Glad to see the above mentioned, it makes me feel better as I would sometimes like to reset adapatation channels.

Thanks for sending the email, it was very useful.

And got confirmation a short time ago that mine shipped. This does look like the tool we have been waiting on.

Shipped, Woot. Keep us in the loop.

Bubbles · 02-10-2009, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawdude

1. You're funny, just not in a good way.

and

2. Did you move?

Always moving to the highest bidder.

02-10-2009, 01:15 PM	#45
mwahlert Lieutenant Colonel 95 Rep 1,659 Posts Drives: 2009 335i Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: NC iTrader: (8)	HI Mark, We do sell a professional version interface cable by itself for $649 but it is not much less expensive then our professional kit. This is because the additional accessories only add about $100 to the cost. Our primary customers are professional shops the additional features supported in the Professional version are consider advanced features that may get enthusiast users into trouble. The professional version adds two things Coding and Command console. Coding is the ability to change the codable parameters inside the control module and allows you to enable options and configurations. On most cars with I-Drive they can perform coding from I-drive for most modules. It also allows you to make a backup of the coding from the control module and restore the coding to a new control module this is useful for shops that need to replace a control module. Currently the coding capability of the software is still limited but we will be adding many more codable values as we get feedback from our users as to what is important to them. We do offer some coding where the factory equipment does not for example on MSV80 we can code the vehicles top speed. Coding should not be confused with programming the software will not allow you to read out the entire memory of the control module and re-write it. Command console is a direct communications with the control module this has proved useful for customers that damaged their control modules through other tools but most users would not know what to do with it. Command console should not be confused with Commands. Commands is the ability to send diagnostic messages to the module like Reset Adaptations or Reinitialize the rain sensor. Commands are supported in the enthusiast version. While you can use our product without an internet connection the software is designed to be used with an internet connection. If you have an internet connection the software will start by reading the VIN from the car then querying our web-service to decode the vehicle information. We are also publishing a lot of BMW specific repair information onto our wiki site that includes procedures for common problems and solutions. Over time we will be linking faults in the software to repair information on our wiki. Our product is still very new, we have been quietly developing it for over two years and it has been in beta by 40 professional BMW technicians for the last 6 months. We still have many plans for development are continuing to add new features on a weekly basis. We have plans to introduce programming but have not yet figured out how we can introduce this and not open ourselves to a lot of liability for users that do not know what they are doing and damage their car. We are currently considering offering programming through professional tuners so the software would allow users to read and write binaries that have been prepared and signed by professional tuners and the tuners would than take the responsibility for the tune. On MSD80/MSD81 used with the N54 we support over 600 actual values while the factory tool used at the dealer only support about 45. Our sampling rate will depend on the year of your E90, up to 2008 the baud rate is 115200, and as of 2009 the baud rate is 500,000. The sampling rate can be adjusted in the software to sample faster or slower, but in general you can expect at least 10-20 samples per second, if you set the sampling to the fastest rate you will need a fast computer but you can sample up to 30 or 40 samples a second. But this will really depend on the values that you are selecting, as selecting many dissimilar values will slow down the sampling rate. BMW does not use a channels concept on this control module. Our tool can sample values approximatly 5 times faster than the GT1. We also provide some advanced graphing features along with the ability to export the data to Excel. For more information about our coverage for MSD80 please see our wiki page. http://wiki.bavariantechnic.com/inde...mens_MSD80_DME As for the list of all possible actual values, we had them on our wiki for some control modules but pulled them down because they used so much space and the list was many pages long. In general we have every possible value that the control module supports. Usually in a calculated value as well as a raw AD value. There are also some duplicates as the same values can be read from multiple places in the control modules memory. You can still look at our old page that has all the actual values listed with this link http://wiki.bavariantechnic.com/inde...80_DME&oldid=9 Our product should not be confused with and OBD2 tool as it does not even do the OBD2 protocol. Our software can access modern BMW's exactly as the factory tool can and provides the same fault and diagnostic information available int he factory system. Though in many cases we provide more information than the factory system does. Please let me know if you have any questions. Best Regards, Duram Bavarian Technic
	Appreciate 0 Quote

02-10-2009, 01:33 PM	#48
Ilma Colonel 184 Rep 2,841 Posts Drives: 2008 135i Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Mississauga iTrader: (0)	Breaking news flash.....this just in: http://wiki.bavariantechnic.com/inde...g_box_detected 2D25 Mass Air Flow Excessive - External tuning box detected 2D25 is stored in the MSD81 control module when an external tuning box is detected. These systems work by manipulating the control signals to and from the engine control module. When this fault is detected by BMW dealers diagnostic tools this information is sent to BMW. Some customers have received letters from BMW stating that their warranty has been voided from the use of an external tuning device. This fault code can be cleared just link any other fault code.
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02-10-2009, 01:40 PM	#50
NM_BMW Vishnu Powered 68 Rep 2,205 Posts Drives: 335xi, S1000RR Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Proceding iTrader: (7)	Subscribed. This looks promising. Looking forward to your feedback Scalbert. __________________ 2008 335xi Sedan \| Titanium Silver \| Black Dakota PROcede v5 \| Vishnu Exhaust \| BMS DCI \| AR Catless DPs \| Helix FMIC \| Stett Charge w/ Tial BOV \| MORR VS8s \| KWv3
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02-10-2009, 01:48 PM	#52
flem ..... 8 Rep 318 Posts Drives: 08 E92 335xi Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Morgantown, WV iTrader: (1) Garage List 2008 335xi [0.00]	I am extremely interested to see where this is heading... Subbing to this thread
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02-10-2009, 01:53 PM	#54
slubu Never Go Full Retard 182 Rep 1,851 Posts Drives: White Lightning Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Agrestic iTrader: (2)	Where does it say no MSD81 support? __________________ 2008 335i
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02-10-2009, 02:01 PM	#55
NM_BMW Vishnu Powered 68 Rep 2,205 Posts Drives: 335xi, S1000RR Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Proceding iTrader: (7)	If you started out with the enthusiast package and wanted to upgrade to the pro later, would you have to buy the new cable package or is it just pay the fee and download new software? I guess if you wanted the 50' extension and round cable you could buy them, but to upgrade is it just a software fee to unlock the command console and coding? __________________ 2008 335xi Sedan \| Titanium Silver \| Black Dakota PROcede v5 \| Vishnu Exhaust \| BMS DCI \| AR Catless DPs \| Helix FMIC \| Stett Charge w/ Tial BOV \| MORR VS8s \| KWv3
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02-10-2009, 02:02 PM	#56
goowatchi Chairman of the Board. 16 Rep 452 Posts Drives: F15 X5 Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: CA iTrader: (7)	I've been doing research on shops with GT1 and/or Autologic, but if this proves to be functionally and diagnostically the same as the GT1 or Autologic, then I definitely plan on owning one. Hopefully, Scalbert's research will give us more info!
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02-10-2009, 05:04 PM	#60
Septro Banned 77 Rep 1,649 Posts Drives: '08 e90 335xi Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: C-Bus, OH iTrader: (1)	I think whoever brings this to the nest regional meet will probably be more popular than the M3s and Porsches that show up everyone wants to see. I'ma start putting this on my list of mods if this thing pans out to be the code-clearing tool of year.
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02-10-2009, 05:32 PM	#61
mwahlert Lieutenant Colonel 95 Rep 1,659 Posts Drives: 2009 335i Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: NC iTrader: (8)	well add me to the list - i just ordered the professional cable.
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