[SIKH335]

So 600whp without any inline booster pump or fuel system hardware mods and the run is nicely placed in the mud 12's afr. Seems the other Tuners need to work a lot harder. For there lean mean machines. Lol

[bootay]

Yep, no fuel mods, just $10k in single turbo mods.

[SIKH335]

Originally Posted by bootay

Yep, no fuel mods, just $10k in single turbo mods.

That's a joke of a statement. Wanna add up FBO with stacked tunes and RB's with install.

[CaptainInsano]

Chump change.

[Tzu]

Originally Posted by SIKH335

So 600whp without any inline booster pump or fuel system hardware mods and the run is nicely placed in the mud 12's afr. Seems the other Tuners need to work a lot harder. For there lean mean machines. Lol

Maybe you refuse to read/beleive the history, but the procede couldn't run 12 AFR accross the board until about a year ago. For 3-4 years it could only run 13.5 in the mid tapering down after that. And mind you, the vishnu boys were the first to tout a "fueling cap", while also promoting the unit to be in full control of fueling. Dzenno came in with higher HP testing on cobb with no "limit" seem whatsoever and informed everyone of the DME "limit" which can be unrestricted with a flash. Lo and behold, shiv who was very adament against a flash due it its "drawbacks" for MANY years, recently released a flash. What does that tell you? Also feel free to look up lean runs on the old v2 untis and the Evo forums.

Remember all your bickering about how flashes are insubordinate to piggies about 2 weeks ago? Have you accepted that your DME has flashed fueling tables yet?

[bootay]

Originally Posted by SIKH335

That's a joke of a statement. Wanna add up FBO with stacked tunes and RB's with install.

Sure - if we start from scratch, the single turbo setup is over $10k...

FMIC - 400
DP - 400
Intake - 100
Cobb AP - 900 with pro tuning (no need to stack tunes)
That's $1800 for FBO, add $300 for install of FMIC/DP/Intake for $2100

Add RBs for $4000 installed (easily the worst bang for the buck out there - $4k for 50rwhp)

That's $6100, installed and cooking, from stock. Stacking tunes adds $500 or so.

Parts alone for single-turbo setup are:
$9300 for Vishnu stuff (not including halfshafts or suspension or other stuff that isn't directly related to power)
$900 for flex-fuel sensor add-ons
$900 for same intake/fmic/dp as non-Vishnu setup.
Brings you to $11,100 for parts alone, install will be thousands more.

So:
270rwhp -> 450rwhp (FBO+E85) = $2100 (non-vishnu)
270rwhp -> 500rwhp (FBO+E85+RB Turbos) = $6100
or
270rwhp -> 600rwhp (Vishnu Single Turbo E85) = at least $13k

If you want 600rwhp, you gotta pay. But you look a little silly claiming that RB comparison is a joke when it's well under half the cost...

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by bootay

Sure - if we start from scratch, the single turbo setup is over $10k...

FMIC - 400
DP - 400
Intake - 100
Cobb AP - 900 with pro tuning (no need to stack tunes)
That's $1800 for FBO, add $300 for install of FMIC/DP/Intake for $2100

Add RBs for $4000 installed (easily the worst bang for the buck out there - $4k for 50rwhp)

That's $6100, installed and cooking, from stock. Stacking tunes adds $500 or so.

Parts alone for single-turbo setup are:
$9300 for Vishnu stuff (not including halfshafts or suspension or other stuff that isn't directly related to power)
$900 for flex-fuel sensor add-ons
$900 for same intake/fmic/dp as non-Vishnu setup.
Brings you to $11,100 for parts alone, install will be thousands more.

So:
270rwhp -> 450rwhp (FBO+E85) = $2100 (non-vishnu)
270rwhp -> 500rwhp (FBO+E85+RB Turbos) = $6100
or
270rwhp -> 600rwhp (Vishnu Single Turbo E85) = at least $13k

If you want 600rwhp, you gotta pay. But you look a little silly claiming that RB comparison is a joke when it's well under half the cost...

"At least $13k"?
Not sure where you got your numbers from or why you are comparing a flexfuel fuel system to one that is not. If you compare apples to apples:

600whp single turbo:
VFF 62mm 6,750.00
PROcede Professional N54 745.00
3_5MAP Sensor_Kit 150.00
Cheap FMIC 400.00
Ceramic BB_Upgrade 595.00
YStyle Downipe 250.00


TOTAL 8900.00+install

You don't need the pwm meth kit, intakes or downpipes. And at this relatively low boost (16-21psi), you shouldn't need axles, a clutch or other drivetrain upgrades any more urgently than with a 500whp RB car. And it will still give you another ~100whp to grow with additional supporting mods. The RB car, in comparison, will already maxed out, running at higher backpressure levels, at higher cylinder temps and with a generally less enticing exhaust note

I suggest being more careful when trying to make a point about comparative pricing.




*

[3-Serious]

Very impressive!! I know this topic has been beaten to death but do you think one day we will be able to run 100% e85?

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by nickkg37s

Very impressive!! I know this topic has been beaten to death but do you think one day we will be able to run 100% e85?

That's what we are working towards.

[3-Serious]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

That's what we are working towards.

Good stuff looking forward to seeing the progress!

[turo]

Awesome, now do the same for the N55! (especially since it looks like the RB-turbo upgrade won't be an option on this platform! )

[CaptainInsano]

Originally Posted by Tzu

Maybe you refuse to read/beleive the history, but the procede couldn't run 12 AFR accross the board until about a year ago. For 3-4 years it could only run 13.5 in the mid tapering down after that. And mind you, the vishnu boys were the first to tout a "fueling cap", while also promoting the unit to be in full control of fueling. Dzenno came in with higher HP testing on cobb with no "limit" seem whatsoever and informed everyone of the DME "limit" which can be unrestricted with a flash. Lo and behold, shiv who was very adament against a flash due it its "drawbacks" for MANY years, recently released a flash. What does that tell you? Also feel free to look up lean runs on the old v2 untis and the Evo forums.

Remember all your bickering about how flashes are insubordinate to piggies about 2 weeks ago? Have you accepted that your DME has flashed fueling tables yet?

Yup flash and piggyback. Pick and choose the best features between the two. My god does it work well.

[bootay]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

"At least $13k"?
Not sure where you got your numbers from or why you are comparing a flexfuel fuel system to one that is not. If you compare apples to apples:

600whp single turbo:
VFF 62mm 6,750.00
PROcede Professional N54 745.00
3_5MAP Sensor_Kit 150.00
Cheap FMIC 400.00
Ceramic BB_Upgrade 595.00
YStyle Downipe 250.00


TOTAL 8900.00+install

You don't need the pwm meth kit, intakes or downpipes. And at this relatively low boost (16-21psi), you shouldn't need axles, a clutch or other drivetrain upgrades any more urgently than with a 500whp RB car. And it will still give you another ~100whp to grow with additional supporting mods. The RB car, in comparison, will already maxed out, running at higher backpressure levels, at higher cylinder temps and with a generally less enticing exhaust note

I suggest being more careful when trying to make a point about comparative pricing.




*

Leaving off meth, dps, and intake saves some $$ for sure, but you're again spending nearly double to have basically the same rwhp. Yes, room to grow, but I can claim the same about a FBO pushing 450rwhp for $2100...lots of room to grow, and it's 1/5 of the cost. Just saying that when one of your supporters laughs about comparitive prices, they need to be careful...you are pushing big numbers, but you're paying big numbers too.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by bootay

Leaving off meth, dps, and intake saves some $$ for sure, but you're again spending nearly double to have basically the same rwhp.

Please explain what you are saying. I'm not following.

Yes, room to grow, but I can claim the same about a FBO pushing 450rwhp for $2100...lots of room to grow, and it's 1/5 of the cost.

At 450whp, there is no room to grow with the stock turbos. So I'm not sure what you arguing.

Just saying that when one of your supporters laughs about comparitive prices, they need to be careful...you are pushing big numbers, but you're paying big numbers too.

Likewise, I encourage you to stop making up numbers when trying to make a point. Your claim of "At least 13K" versus an actual $8900 is indicative of someone who isn't putting time into doing the actual research when it comes to supporting their argument.

Shiv

[Joshboody]

Originally Posted by Tzu

Maybe you refuse to read/beleive the history, but the procede couldn't run 12 AFR accross the board until about a year ago. For 3-4 years it could only run 13.5 in the mid tapering down after that. And mind you, the vishnu boys were the first to tout a "fueling cap", while also promoting the unit to be in full control of fueling. Dzenno came in with higher HP testing on cobb with no "limit" seem whatsoever and informed everyone of the DME "limit" which can be unrestricted with a flash. Lo and behold, shiv who was very adament against a flash due it its "drawbacks" for MANY years, recently released a flash. What does that tell you? Also feel free to look up lean runs on the old v2 untis and the Evo forums.

Remember all your bickering about how flashes are insubordinate to piggies about 2 weeks ago? Have you accepted that your DME has flashed fueling tables yet?

Development is a learning curve from piggy only, flash, and now combo setups. Currently Vishnu is doing a better job of mapping the DME in my opinion (evident in supporting 600hp 50/50 mix). DZ was claiming a hardware limit in fueling on BB with only 30% E85 on RBs, but I have a strong believe this is actually a tuning limit due to the limited 1D scalar in ATR. I'm sure Shiv has remapped the fueling to be more consistent throughout rpm/maf. All camps are definitely pushing the n54 though, which is great.

[King mode]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

"At least $13k"?
Not sure where you got your numbers from or why you are comparing a flexfuel fuel system to one that is not. If you compare apples to apples:

600whp single turbo:
VFF 62mm 6,750.00
PROcede Professional N54 745.00
3_5MAP Sensor_Kit 150.00
Cheap FMIC 400.00
Ceramic BB_Upgrade 595.00
YStyle Downipe 250.00


TOTAL 8900.00+install

You don't need the pwm meth kit, intakes or downpipes. And at this relatively low boost (16-21psi), you shouldn't need axles, a clutch or other drivetrain upgrades any more urgently than with a 500whp RB car. And it will still give you another ~100whp to grow with additional supporting mods. The RB car, in comparison, will already maxed out, running at higher backpressure levels, at higher cylinder temps and with a generally less enticing exhaust note

I suggest being more careful when trying to make a point about comparative pricing.
*

Shiv, I was under the impression that meth is manditory for the single setup? Is that changed now with the e85 testing?

[CaptainInsano]

Originally Posted by King mode

Shiv, I was under the impression that meth is manditory for the single setup? Is that changed now with the e85 testing?

I don't think meth was ever mandatory, we just weren't making enough power without it to be worth while. Until now.

[King mode]

^^ I see. Gotta love that e85

[son_of_siggy]

Originally Posted by bootay

but you're again spending nearly double to have basically the same rwhp. .

500rwhp vs 600+rwhp is not "basically the same rwhp". By those standards, an 11.00 sec 1/4 ET and 10.00 ET are basically the same 1/4 time right?

[sutter2k]

I think these are rather low estimates.
Not everyone has easy access to e85. Some places charge 300.00 for just install of downpipes. In addition, if someone got their their Cobb AP for 700.00, most protuners are going to charge ~500. Thats 1200.00(for AP + tuning). If you want a pump protune + a meth protune, it could be 500 for the base tune + 250 for the additional map.

Originally Posted by bootay

Sure - if we start from scratch, the single turbo setup is over $10k...

FMIC - 400
DP - 400
Intake - 100
Cobb AP - 900 with pro tuning (no need to stack tunes)
That's $1800 for FBO, add $300 for install of FMIC/DP/Intake for $2100

Add RBs for $4000 installed (easily the worst bang for the buck out there - $4k for 50rwhp)

That's $6100, installed and cooking, from stock. Stacking tunes adds $500 or so.

Parts alone for single-turbo setup are:
$9300 for Vishnu stuff (not including halfshafts or suspension or other stuff that isn't directly related to power)
$900 for flex-fuel sensor add-ons
$900 for same intake/fmic/dp as non-Vishnu setup.
Brings you to $11,100 for parts alone, install will be thousands more.

So:
270rwhp -> 450rwhp (FBO+E85) = $2100 (non-vishnu)
270rwhp -> 500rwhp (FBO+E85+RB Turbos) = $6100
or
270rwhp -> 600rwhp (Vishnu Single Turbo E85) = at least $13k

If you want 600rwhp, you gotta pay. But you look a little silly claiming that RB comparison is a joke when it's well under half the cost...

[nafoo]

Originally Posted by sutter2k

I think these are rather low estimates.
Not everyone has easy access to e85. Some places charge 300.00 for just install of downpipes. In addition, if someone got their their Cobb AP for 700.00, most protuners are going to charge ~500. Thats 1200.00(for AP + tuning). If you want a pump protune + a meth protune, it could be 500 for the base tune + 250 for the additional map.

Pro Tuning Freaks are considerably cheaper than 500/250.

[turb0mik3]

I don't know if I am allowed to put up a quote I got from FFTEC w/o shiv's tuning. It is slightly above 11k for people keeping track. Just to keep everyone honest.

Including installation and what not and NOT E85 'compatable'