[pikemike420]

Originally Posted by Rydawg1

^ +1 please elaborate on this subject!

Would like to know more too.

I like the idea of the flash tunes over piggy back if it is undetectable, but I believe they should all be in the $400-$500 range at most to be competitive as you can get 50%-75% of your original investment back from the piggyback units, and they have more features.

Like the fact that the stock ECU controls it though.

[onesuperboi]

How is the flash undetectable? Anyone that would drive the car, including the techs at the BMW service, will know right away that the car is more powerful than stock.

At least with GIAC, you could switch to the stock map for service.

[pikemike420]

Is it or is it not???

[MarkD]

Originally Posted by pikemike420

Is it or is it not???

Is what ?

Of course a dealer can detect a flash tune. Either by the increase performance, or they can read it and send it in for analysis. If I can read a 335i ECU and tell you if it is stock or not, don't think that BMW can't.

[techlogik]

Originally Posted by MarkD

Is what ?

Of course a dealer can detect a flash tune. Either by the increase performance, or they can read it and send it in for analysis. If I can read a 335i ECU and tell you if it is stock or not, don't think that BMW can't.

If you can't switch back to a stock map like GIAC, yes, the extra power would be noticeable if they jumped on it.

The dealer can't detect a flash tune. It is rumored that they would need to open a PUMA case and if requested, upload the DME to BMW and they have ways to tell. But, this has yet to be proven by anyone or have that happen and posted details on the forum.

I don't doubt BMW HQ can detect it, but it hasn't happened yet. Of course, flash tunes haven't been out very long, time will tell.

[DefactoM6]

I wouldn't question Mark D. on this. He knows just a little bit more about tuning BMW DMEs than you.

[Alext]

I think what a lot of people are after in the N54 flash product offering is a FLASH AT HOME solution.

Personally I can't wait for a company to bring a FAH product to market...like for the Subarus etc.

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Just wanted to clarify the detectable/undetectable questions/concerns.

BMW NA can definitely decipher what is in your DME, whether they receive a file or the DME itself.

A local dealership can not, IE: there is no hardware like a piggyback and a local dealer does not have the hardware/software to perform such tasks, they can not read and see what is in your DME but have the ability to overwrite it with updates should there be one.

So , to be clear it can not be hidden from BMW NA but a local dealer will not see it in a case of an oil change etc... Although as mentioned if the dealer steps on it it will be obvious the vehicle has more performance than a stock model.

I hope I have answered and clarified the questions/concerns pertaining to that topic.

[pikemike420]

Thanks Jean!

Originally Posted by Jean@ActiveAutowerke

Just wanted to clarify the detectable/undetectable questions/concerns.

BMW NA can definitely decipher what is in your DME, whether they receive a file or the DME itself.

A local dealership can not, IE: there is no hardware like a piggyback and a local dealer does not have the hardware/software to perform such tasks, they can not read and see what is in your DME but have the ability to overwrite it with updates should there be one.

So , to be clear it can not be hidden from BMW NA but a local dealer will not see it in a case of an oil change etc... Although as mentioned if the dealer steps on it it will be obvious the vehicle has more performance than a stock model.

I hope I have answered and clarified the questions/concerns pertaining to that topic.

[techlogik]

Originally Posted by Jean@ActiveAutowerke

Just wanted to clarify the detectable/undetectable questions/concerns.

BMW NA can definitely decipher what is in your DME, whether they receive a file or the DME itself.

A local dealership can not, IE: there is no hardware like a piggyback and a local dealer does not have the hardware/software to perform such tasks, they can not read and see what is in your DME but have the ability to overwrite it with updates should there be one.

So , to be clear it can not be hidden from BMW NA but a local dealer will not see it in a case of an oil change etc... Although as mentioned if the dealer steps on it it will be obvious the vehicle has more performance than a stock model.

I hope I have answered and clarified the questions/concerns pertaining to that topic.

Thanks for confirming this. This is what I have been saying in these types of threads. The dealer itself has no method/tools. But BMW NA most likely does, and if so, they can catch it.

Worst case, take the hard core mods off...flash DME back to stock, take car to dealer to be really safe if something major goes wrong that requires warranty work.

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Originally Posted by techlogik

Thanks for confirming this. This is what I have been saying in these types of threads. The dealer itself has no method/tools. But BMW NA most likely does, and if so, they can catch it.

Worst case, take the hard core mods off...flash DME back to stock, take car to dealer to be really safe if something major goes wrong that requires warranty work.

You're welcome.

Ultimately we always recommend going back to stock before a trip to the dealer, especially should warranty work be involved. There is just the added benefit of having no hardware involved and having everything tweaked and upgraded through the factory DME.

[onesuperboi]

Originally Posted by Jean@ActiveAutowerke

You're welcome.

Ultimately we always recommend going back to stock before a trip to the dealer, especially should warranty work be involved. There is just the added benefit of having no hardware involved and having everything tweaked and upgraded through the factory DME.

C'mon. You said the flash is undetectable, yet anyone will know the car is not stock when you drive it. The techs that service the cars at BMW will drive the car.

Now, you're recommending that you flash to stock before going to the dealer. Of course that's going to be undetectable, but who is going to shell out a couple of hundred for each visit?

Now, if you offered a map switcher like GIAC, then that would be another story.

Just be honest with this detectability issue. No flash tune is undetectable, unless you flash a stock map.

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Originally Posted by onesuperboi

C'mon. You said the flash is undetectable, yet anyone will know the car is not stock when you drive it. The techs that service the cars at BMW will drive the car.

Now, you're recommending that you flash to stock before going to the dealer. Of course that's going to be undetectable, but who is going to shell out a couple of hundred for each visit?

Now, if you offered a map switcher like GIAC, then that would be another story.

Just be honest with this detectability issue. No flash tune is undetectable, unless you flash a stock map.

Tuning your stock DME leaves no evidence that can be "seen" by a "local dealer". No hardware to be seen and do not have the ability to see what is in your DME at their facility (posted earlier in this thread).

Driving the car is a non issue but the problem is techs like to rag on cars that come in for service and that is where the problem lies (posted earlier in this thread).

Regardless if you have a flash loader or our tune should you leave it in, you're taking the same risk.

It all depends on what your warranty is worth to you, after market parts come with a certain amount of risk if you are still under warranty. No warranty, no problem.

How is a "flashing a stock map" undetectable? there will be performance increases as all tunes/flashes start with your stock map to begin with.

Certain (most) BMW dealers are looking for hardware inside of the engine bay (IE: piggybacks) as that is their only immediate means of finding after market tuning/tampering. A tune has creates no hardware changes or additions.

[Clarkson]

Originally Posted by Jean@ActiveAutowerke

Tuning your stock DME leaves no evidence that can be "seen" by a "local dealer". No hardware to be seen and do not have the ability to see what is in your DME at their facility (posted earlier in this thread).

Driving the car is a non issue but the problem is techs like to rag on cars that come in for service and that is where the problem lies (posted earlier in this thread).

Regardless if you have a flash loader or our tune should you leave it in, you're taking the same risk.

It all depends on what your warranty is worth to you, after market parts come with a certain amount of risk if you are still under warranty. No warranty, no problem.

How is a "flashing a stock map" undetectable? there will be performance increases as all tunes/flashes start with your stock map to begin with.

Certain (most) BMW dealers are looking for hardware inside of the engine bay (IE: piggybacks) as that is their only immediate means of finding after market tuning/tampering. A tune has creates no hardware changes or additions.

The ECU knows about the boost.. and a jb board can plug in to the obd2 port and show the boost running or a tech puts at BT cable on.. They should be able to see it shouldn't they? What is a BT unlimited cable going for?

I know it's a stretch but to say they can't see it is almost as much of a stretch.

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Originally Posted by Clarkson

The ECU knows about the boost.. and a jb board can plug in to the obd2 port and show the boost running or a tech puts at BT cable on.. They should be able to see it shouldn't they? What is a BT unlimited cable going for?

I know it's a stretch but to say they can't see it is almost as much of a stretch.

Well they literally can't see. Whether they can figure it out or not is a different story.

Hope that clarifies everything.

[onesuperboi]

Originally Posted by Jean@ActiveAutowerke

Tuning your stock DME leaves no evidence that can be "seen" by a "local dealer". No hardware to be seen and do not have the ability to see what is in your DME at their facility (posted earlier in this thread).

Driving the car is a non issue but the problem is techs like to rag on cars that come in for service and that is where the problem lies (posted earlier in this thread).

Regardless if you have a flash loader or our tune should you leave it in, you're taking the same risk.

It all depends on what your warranty is worth to you, after market parts come with a certain amount of risk if you are still under warranty. No warranty, no problem.

How is a "flashing a stock map" undetectable? there will be performance increases as all tunes/flashes start with your stock map to begin with.

Certain (most) BMW dealers are looking for hardware inside of the engine bay (IE: piggybacks) as that is their only immediate means of finding after market tuning/tampering. A tune has creates no hardware changes or additions.

I said flash a stock map, meaning flashing the stock map instead of your custom flash before service.

My point is that as a pro, you said a flash is undetectable. It's not and you shouldn't advertise as so.

Now, you say that if your tune is left in, it's at your own risk for detection and loss of warranty.

With a piggyback, you can remove it and clear the codes. The car is returned to stock and the tech has no reason to inquire unless there are other mods on the car or has some sort of suspicion.

With your tune left in, it will be easy to feel the extra power and the tech will know right away that the car is not stock.

[dlbrooks18]

Originally Posted by cuban335i

Jean you guys should be working on an upgraded turbo kit for the n54! not software for the stock n54...

+1

[Jean@ActiveAutowerke]

Here is a recent dyno from Lutz Performance in Lutz Florida.

[onesuperboi]

Why is it so wavy?

[kebertE90]

active autowerke active processor 2 for bmw 335i n54 for sale