[andymc0001]

On Friday morning i was called out to work. Once on the motorway i was stopped by a police patrol car and told i had no insurance. I renewed my policy on Thusrday morning so was covered, the police said it wasn't showing up on the pnc so they issued me with a producer and seized my car there and then.

I spoke to my insurance and they told me they updated the MID at 2359 on Thursday night so the police hadn't updated there system at 0320 when they stopped me.

My problem is i had to take the afternoon off work also my wife to collect me from Manchester, then i had to pay £150 to release my car. Who do i claim off?

[SO8]

My understanding is that the 'police' system is actually the insurer's system - not a separate one that they update ... issues I have known are always down to the insurers not dealing with their information promptly.

My guess is that it is down to your insurance company.

[Carrera RSR]

Police information was wrong, as were the police to confiscate the car at 0320 in the morning as neither of you could prove with a call into the insurance firm either way. I would prepare a letter to the chief of the force and issue them the costs and inconvenience caused. If no reasonable reply then its of to the solicitors for some legal clout.

[andymc0001]

The insurers Liverpool Victoria update the system MID (motor insurance database) everynight at 2359. The police use PNC which takes their information from the MID. Either way i don't understand how i got a 7 day producer and had my car seized.

[Baby Dave]

It's not the fault of the police. Your insurance company are at fault. They should have updated their computer system. They have clearly lied to you with regard to them updating the system. They are now liable for all your out of pocket expenses. The police system is the same used by the MIB

[Baby Dave]

Carrera, As a driver when stopped by the police it is up to you to prove you have valid driving documents, not the other way round

[andymc0001]

I did later when i had to show them to release my car, just not at 0320 in the morning. Incidently my wife googled the MID whilst i was in the police car and it was listed as covered. The policeman stated it wasn't on the PNC.

[zedman]

Originally Posted by Baby Dave

It's not the fault of the police. Your insurance company are at fault. They should have updated their computer system. They have clearly lied to you with regard to them updating the system. They are now liable for all your out of pocket expenses. The police system is the same used by the MIB

it's entirely the fault of the 5-0, they had no reason other than short sightedness to seize your car, they have 'ways' of finding out and numbers that they ring to check, if they couldn't be arsed then thats their fault. And all especially so if the OP's wife saw it on the MIB whilst it was seized.

(p.s. not 5-0 bashing, got above info from my friend in the trade'

They are now liable for all out of pocket expenses.

[SO8]

Originally Posted by zedman

it's entirely the fault of the 5-0, they had no reason other than short sightedness to seize your car, they have 'ways' of finding out and numbers that they ring to check, if they couldn't be arsed then thats their fault. And all especially so if the OP's wife saw it on the MIB whilst it was seized.

(p.s. not 5-0 bashing, got above info from my friend in the trade'

They are now liable for all out of pocket expenses.

They use the MIB info ... and the phone numbers they use are either the MIB themselves or the individual insurance companies - none of whom are 24/7.

If in any doubt they shouldn't seize but issue a ticket for No insurance which can be cancelled if the car is indeed proved to be insured.

In my experience Insurance companies are not 100% honest when it comes to saying exactly when cars are shown on the system as covered. Maybe they are telling the truth in this case - but there is a big chance they are not.

[Jon D]

Originally Posted by andymc0001

On Friday morning i was called out to work. Once on the motorway i was stopped by a police patrol car and told i had no insurance. I renewed my policy on Thusrday morning so was covered, the police said it wasn't showing up on the pnc so they issued me with a producer and seized my car there and then.

I spoke to my insurance and they told me they updated the MID at 2359 on Thursday night so the police hadn't updated there system at 0320 when they stopped me.

My problem is i had to take the afternoon off work also my wife to collect me from Manchester, then i had to pay £150 to release my car. Who do i claim off?

Sorry to hear your tale, but it's good to know that the police are ever vigilant in preventing serious crime.
And as a riposte to the expected, I fully accept that insurance/road tax dodging, speeding and other motoring offences are against the law, but so is burglary and violent crime in towns and residential areas - but where do we see a greater police presence?

[Carrera RSR]

Originally Posted by Baby Dave

Carrera, As a driver when stopped by the police it is up to you to prove you have valid driving documents, not the other way round

And that's what a seven day producer is all about!!

There is no law to state all your documents should be on your person but you must produce when requested. I am sure at 9am on Friday morning the OP could have printed his cover note/documents and visited a local nick. To have your car seized at 3.20 in the morning is inexcusable unless other issues were present.

The computer can and does get it wrong, its only as good as the info input on it from humans!! I have been on the receiving end of the same issue. Computer said no, copper said no, a visit home to collect docs and they say YES! No impounded car this time though.

[rsmallwo]

Thats real bad luck, most make you feel alittle sick. All that hassle and you where innocent of any wrong doing.

Would it have been different if you had your insurance documents on you at the time.

Maybe we should all be carrying our documents when the switch over week occurs to account for such admin issues.

[hmi1750]

What happened to innocent until proven guilty? It seems that discretion was not used here and the Police have been given powers greater than their capacity of judgement.

[Jon D]

Originally Posted by andymc0001

On Friday morning i was called out to work. Once on the motorway i was stopped by a police patrol car and told i had no insurance. I renewed my policy on Thusrday morning so was covered, the police said it wasn't showing up on the pnc so they issued me with a producer and seized my car there and then.

I spoke to my insurance and they told me they updated the MID at 2359 on Thursday night so the police hadn't updated there system at 0320 when they stopped me.

My problem is i had to take the afternoon off work also my wife to collect me from Manchester, then i had to pay £150 to release my car. Who do i claim off?

Did you achieve a satisfactory outcome?
I agree with 'Carrera RSR' - a letter to the chief constable to begin with and legal advice if necessary.
Yet another example of heavy-handed policing - they don't do themselves any favours.

[ihpj]

Originally Posted by Baby Dave

Carrera, As a driver when stopped by the police it is up to you to prove you have valid driving documents, not the other way round

+1 - its quite black and white when it comes to something like this. And most (if not all) driving offences are down to the Driver/Owner to prove they are not guilty (rather the other way round).

The issue will be the time the Police checked the system. If the information was correct (IE: Insurance not shown as being held on PNC) then they are quite right to act. If it turns out not to be correct, then its not the Police's fault as the responsibility for ensuring accuracy of DB is with the Insurance Companies (they cant have it both ways!).

Yes the ticket/fine etc. will more than likely be cancelled - but other costs, down to your Insurance Company I'm afraid because the company used to recover and store the offending vehicle are private and they have incurred a cost.

I've had a couple similar instances, and you do get them now and again, but each has panned out as I have described. I would complain to the Ombudsman myself as your Insurance Company are under a duty to update the DB and other information in a timely manner.

[briers]

Originally Posted by ihpj

+1 - its quite black and white when it comes to something like this. And most (if not all) driving offences are down to the Driver/Owner to prove they are not guilty (rather the other way round).

The issue will be the time the Police checked the system. If the information was correct (IE: Insurance not shown as being held on PNC) then they are quite right to act. If it turns out not to be correct, then its not the Police's fault as the responsibility for ensuring accuracy of DB is with the Insurance Companies (they cant have it both ways!).

Yes the ticket/fine etc. will more than likely be cancelled - but other costs, down to your Insurance Company I'm afraid because the company used to recover and store the offending vehicle are private and they have incurred a cost.

I've had a couple similar instances, and you do get them now and again, but each has panned out as I have described. I would complain to the Ombudsman myself as your Insurance Company are under a duty to update the DB and other information in a timely manner.

Out of interest my mrs company car is insured by her company allowing lots of people to drive it. Husbands and partners are allowed to drive it too based on the managers approval, which I have.

I wouldn't be able to prove I was insured especially out of office hours.

What would happen in this case?

[willhollin]

Originally Posted by briers

Out of interest my mrs company car is insured by her company allowing lots of people to drive it. Husbands and partners are allowed to drive it too based on the managers approval, which I have.

I wouldn't be able to prove I was insured especially out of office hours.

What would happen in this case?

Dark alley and a large truncheon I expect.

[peterg1965]

Originally Posted by ihpj

The issue will be the time the Police checked the system. If the information was correct (IE: Insurance not shown as being held on PNC) then they are quite right to act. If it turns out not to be correct, then its not the Police's fault as the responsibility for ensuring accuracy of DB is with the Insurance Companies (they cant have it both ways!).

Sorry, but the Police are not always correct, they are fallible and this case goes to prove that. If this happened to me 'out of office hours' and I knew I was insured and the Police told me that I wasn't and seized my car I would be exceptionally angry. This would not be my fault, yet I would be the one massively inconvenienced and out of pocket. If this relies on the PNC being up to date but with a time lag to the MiD then it needs to be sorted.

[ihpj]

Originally Posted by peterg1965

Sorry, but the Police are not always correct, they are fallible and this case goes to prove that. If this happened to me 'out of office hours' and I knew I was insured and the Police told me that I wasn't and seized my car I would be exceptionally angry. This would not be my fault, yet I would be the one massively inconvenienced and out of pocket. If this relies on the PNC being up to date but with a time lag to the MiD then it needs to be sorted.

You would be right to be angry, but if at the time the action is taken the information is correct, then the ensuing actions are justifiable. Ys it's an inconvenience, but it surely isn't the Polices fault.

So if it isn't your fault and it isn't the Police's fault either - so who is left?

[ihpj]

Originally Posted by briers

Out of interest my mrs company car is insured by her company allowing lots of people to drive it. Husbands and partners are allowed to drive it too based on the managers approval, which I have.

I wouldn't be able to prove I was insured especially out of office hours.

What would happen in this case?

We're talking about having insurance or not. If it is a company car then all that is being checked is insurance status: does it have any recorded or not? If it does then the information can tell us who it is held by, the insurance company, provisions, named drivers etc. So as long as the car came up as having insurance, I'd suggest in your circumstances the type of policy would be an 'any driver' policy so that'd be fine.

What we're talking about is if 'no insurance' was flagged up.

[ihpj]

Originally Posted by willhollin

Dark alley and a large truncheon I expect.

Dude I don't wanna know what you do in your spare time in dark alleys ;0)

[briers]

Originally Posted by ihpj

We're talking about having insurance or not. If it is a company car then all that is being checked is insurance status: does it have any recorded or not? If it does then the information can tell us who it is held by, the insurance company, provisions, named drivers etc. So as long as the car came up as having insurance, I'd suggest in your circumstances the type of policy would be an 'any driver' policy so that'd be fine.

What we're talking about is if 'no insurance' was flagged up.

Thanks for clarifying

The car defiantly has insurance - was just unsure of how to prove I was allowed to drive the car. It is an any driver policy so I guess that is fine as the police would see this.