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[rorkor]

Originally Posted by roundel335

What's the UTQG rating on the all-season Nittos? I have Conti DW on both my cars, and as I recall, they're rated at 340, which is way better than the typical 220-280 of other performance summer tires. I was skeptical about how you could have both grip and longer wear on the same performance tire, but their assymetrical tread compound apparently works quite well. I have also had great luck with GoodYear Eagle F1 Assymetrics, but the Contis ride a little better.

Regarding Sears, they actually carry good tire brands, and their installers are on par with the big tire chains. Plus - remember that Sears has some of the best tools you can buy - Craftsman - with a lifetime guarantee. Now, I probably wouldn't go there for any type of repair work, but for a flat tire or new tires, I would give them a shot. I just happen to have an excellent Discount Tire place closer to me than Sears.

To satiate the masses, yes, UTQG can vary slightly between manufacturers, but no more than 10-20 for the right comparable tires.

The Motivo is a Dry-Wet-Ice/Snow tire so it compares to the DWS from Conti, not the DW. I go over the pass to Bakersfield and out to the high dessert so I need a tire with some ice/snow capability without the hassle of full blown snow sets.

The DWS has a UTQG of 540 and a tread wear warranty of 50k miles.

The Motivo has a UTQG of 560 and and a tread wear warranty of 60k miles.

Now that said, my set is staggered so the warranty on the rears is immediately cut in half. So right there, the Motivo pulled ahead even with a close UTQG. Also, Nitto has been using some of the best rubber in the world as most people don't know they are owned by Toyo and are basically thier high performance arm in the US, score second point for Nitto's. They are made in the USA and the first to use a completely revolutionary manufacturing process.

The Conti's are asymetrical too but also directional so they cannot be rotated from side to side to make up for irregular wear on my staggered set. I learned this with the stock set of Conti Pro Contact 3's where my left rear wore 20% faster than my right rear and I couldn't do anything about it but change the tires out 100 miles after their weak (in comparison) 20k warranty on the staggered rears.

All this said, it was a personal choice as I had a chance to ride on the DWS in our families 335 first and found them loud and weak on cornering. The Nitto's are quiet, like eerily so, even after a few thousand miles on them.

Come summer, I will likely toss on a set of Stay Puff Man PS2's as they are still the greatest summer/wet track tire I have used on a Bimmer. (Let's the Super Sport dogs loose)

[Kolyan2k]

Originally Posted by rorkor

To satiate the masses, yes, UTQG can vary slightly between manufacturers, but no more than 10-20 for the right comparable tires.

i wonder where you got that 10-20 figure from ? not saying you wrong, just curious.

warranties are also not that simple by the way, its simple marketing. if your warranty is 50k miles, you are not getting new free tires at 49k if fact you never gonna get anything free from them

[rorkor]

Originally Posted by Kolyan2k

i wonder where you got that 10-20 figure from ? not saying you wrong, just curious.

I have talked to a lot of tire guys and it is one of the things I ask every time. The trick is finding a proper comparison tire. Just like any industry, everyone is trying to find a way to be different. Usually by aggressive compounds. In the all weather market, it is more in tread design than compounds and since top performance is already sacrificed so the UTQG is usually closer as they are all going for a harder, longer lasting compound that wont freeze. Any tires hitting the 500+ rating are at the far end of the field and there is less room to play in that arena to rate higher.

One for One comparison of UTQG's is like finding the "G" spot, no two are alike and you will really never know for sure. Close is good enough. In the case of tires, what the manufacturer is willing to warranty them for after designating the UTQG is what really matters. In the case of Nitto vs. Conti, Nitto backed theirs with an extra 10k miles.

Yes, a treadwear warranty only offers a pro rated discount on new, but they factor the hit on their claims by the UTQG rating and internal longevity testing. That is another reason I buy the free replacement vouchers from my tire shop, don't have to worry about the difference, I just get a new set when/if they don't meet my expectations.

[Dark_Knight_335]

Originally Posted by rorkor

I have talked to a lot of tire guys and it is one of the things I ask every time. The trick is finding a proper comparison tire. Just like any industry, everyone is trying to find a way to be different. Usually by aggressive compounds. In the all weather market, it is more in tread design than compounds and since top performance is already sacrificed so the UTQG is usually closer as they are all going for a harder, longer lasting compound that wont freeze. Any tires hitting the 500+ rating are at the far end of the field and there is less room to play in that arena to rate higher.

One for One comparison of UTQG's is like finding the "G" spot, no two are alike and you will really never know for sure. Close is good enough. In the case of tires, what the manufacturer is willing to warranty them for after designating the UTQG is what really matters. In the case of Nitto vs. Conti, Nitto backed theirs with an extra 10k miles.

Wow, excellent info my man. Thank you.

[Kolyan2k]

Originally Posted by rorkor

I have talked to a lot of tire guys and it is one of the things I ask every time. The trick is finding a proper comparison tire. Just like any industry, everyone is trying to find a way to be different. Usually by aggressive compounds. In the all weather market, it is more in tread design than compounds and since top performance is already sacrificed so the UTQG is usually closer as they are all going for a harder, longer lasting compound that wont freeze. Any tires hitting the 500+ rating are at the far end of the field and there is less room to play in that arena to rate higher.

One for One comparison of UTQG's is like finding the "G" spot, no two are alike and you will really never know for sure. Close is good enough. In the case of tires, what the manufacturer is willing to warranty them for after designating the UTQG is what really matters. In the case of Nitto vs. Conti, Nitto backed theirs with an extra 10k miles.

Yes, a treadwear warranty only offers a pro rated discount on new, but they factor the hit on their claims by the UTQG rating and internal longevity testing. That is another reason I buy the free replacement vouchers from my tire shop, don't have to worry about the difference, I just get a new set when/if they don't meet my expectations.

how does warranty work with staggered tires ? I know some companies completely void your warranty in this case because in order to keep the warranty you must have proof of tire rotation and correct alignment etc.
ps. Nitto tires with 60k warranty have 1 year less warranty then Contis with 50k. < thats as far as i know.

[rorkor]

Originally Posted by Kolyan2k

how does warranty work with staggered tires ? I know some companies completely void your warranty in this case because in order to keep the warranty you must have proof of tire rotation and correct alignment etc.
ps. Nitto tires with 60k warranty have 1 year less warranty then Contis with 50k. < thats as far as i know.

Most tires that are staggered are also directional so you cannot rotate them at all, they just wear off in one spot, that is why some manufacturers wont warranty a staggered set. Non OEM and OEM tires that do carry the warranty for staggered setup usually cut the treadwear warranty by 50%.

OEM brands have to offer a staggered warranty as they come on the car that way and the car manufacturer would not shod a car with rubber they can't make a claim on in a mass market environment if they don't stand up in their first cycle.

Non OEM and OEM tires that do carry the warranty for staggered setup usually cut the treadwear warranty by 50%. So a 60k warranty is now a 30k warranty.

I have never hit the age cut off of a warranty on tires, i drive 20k to 35k miles a year, so I see the wear patterns faster than 90% of drivers (calm down, I know there are serious road warriors in these forums). No tire is universal to seasons, which is why I put an AW tire on my car even in southern california. IMO, not set of tires can last 5 years safely.