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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Tracking, Autocrossing, Dragstrip, Driving Techniques > Procede + 335 = Porsche Hunter (?)



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      10-23-2007, 05:44 PM   #23
S4to335
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Hegemony...

Yeah, Tracquest was my favorite group to teach for before they got divided into Chin Motorsports and Northern California Racing Club. Excellent track time...especially for us instructors.

DrewKo:

A lot of uninformed people show up at track events thinking they will be able to race..and we are real upfront with "this is not a race, or racing school". The distinction is big in my book. My girlfriend can never get it right..I gave up trying to fix that one. She says "are you going racing this weekend?" (heavy sigh) "No, honey, I am teaching high performance driving this weekend...I sold my race car 3 months ago, remember, I dont race anymore"
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      10-24-2007, 09:18 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S4to335 View Post
My girlfriend can never get it right..I gave up trying to fix that one. She says "are you going racing this weekend?" (heavy sigh) "No, honey, I am teaching high performance driving this weekend...I sold my race car 3 months ago, remember, I dont race anymore"
That's a conversation that I'm quite familiar with, though I've never owned a race car.

DrewKo,

Feel free to show up that weekend. Panoz used to allow passengers. In fact, they were one of the only events that allowed non-instructor/student passengers. I'm not sure if they will now that Barber has taken over.

If it's still allowed, you're welcome to ride for a session. I don't claim to be a master driver, but it may be fun to see how someone else does it. Some friends of mine from another site will be there also in various cars, mostly porsches.
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      10-24-2007, 10:35 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegemony View Post
That's a conversation that I'm quite familiar with, though I've never owned a race car.

DrewKo,

Feel free to show up that weekend. Panoz used to allow passengers. In fact, they were one of the only events that allowed non-instructor/student passengers. I'm not sure if they will now that Barber has taken over.

If it's still allowed, you're welcome to ride for a session. I don't claim to be a master driver, but it may be fun to see how someone else does it. Some friends of mine from another site will be there also in various cars, mostly porsches.
Cool man, many thanks! I definitely would like to ride along in your car for a run. I'll put the event on my calendar and see if the date works out closer to that time. I might call Panoz and see if guests in the car are permitted. The only issue could be my wife's 40th b'day...its tough fitting celebrating that into all of the other Dec. events this year.
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      10-25-2007, 12:48 AM   #26
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Way off topic.... but did you watch that video? That chick passed a crotch rocket in a VAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I about pissed myself I was laughing so hard. Sorry. Just couldn't believe it.
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      11-16-2007, 02:40 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by SineQuaNon View Post
I'll probably get flamed for this since it's my first post, but I'm going to post it anyway. I will also add the caveat that I am a certified Porschefile. My previous ride was a Boxster S, but I bought the 335 when family needs made it necessary for a more practical car. I never even considered a BMW until I read about the 335. I had always liked the M3, but for the price I always thought the Boxster S was a more fun car (I'll probably get flamed for that too!).

Anyway, I took my Crimson Red MT e90 335 to Putnam Park in Indiana a couple of weeks ago to run with the Central Indiana PCA (buddy of mine has a 996 Targa). I was expecting to run toward the back of the pack due to the soft suspension of the 335, my RFTs and the fact that 911s are no slouch in the power department. To my amazement I was able to easily run down all of the Porsches (no Turbos in my group) on the straights and hang close enough through the corners so that I was running faster lap times than them. There was also an e39 M5 out there, but he really didn't have a chance - 335 was considerably faster on the straights and through the corners. I was pleasantly surprised that my Baby Bimmer did so well.

This has gotten me to thinking that with a bit of suspension work (PSS9 & H&R rear sway), together w/ a non-staggered setup of 255/35/18s on lightweight 8.5" rims all around, I should be considerably faster than all but the fastest 911s. Maybe a brake upgrade later on, but I didn't really have any trouble w/ fade; although, the temperature was in the 60s, so that probably had something to do w/ it. I wouldn't have believed it until I experienced it, but the 335 can make a very good track car.

With a few more upgrades I hope to change my thread title from "Porsche Hunter (?)" to "Porsche Killer!". Now that would be fun! The 335 really is a stealth beast!
Check out my other post on 255 race rubber and how I did against an instructor driving a 997 on race rubber.

The performance of a 335i is truly phenomenal. I would caution against the rear sway though, if you go non-staggered. I ran some fast times with it, but I felt like I was always on the verge of oversteer and I also let out a smokebomb from the inside rear on most corners. Maybe I'm faster with it, but I kinda wish I didn't have it now that I run non-staggered on track.

ugh. ~$2k for an LSD next.
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      01-31-2008, 02:26 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by leftcoastman View Post
Check out my other post on 255 race rubber and how I did against an instructor driving a 997 on race rubber.

The performance of a 335i is truly phenomenal. I would caution against the rear sway though, if you go non-staggered. I ran some fast times with it, but I felt like I was always on the verge of oversteer and I also let out a smokebomb from the inside rear on most corners. Maybe I'm faster with it, but I kinda wish I didn't have it now that I run non-staggered on track.

ugh. ~$2k for an LSD next.


$2k...? Alot of manual labor involved... you doing all the welding yourself? If not expect the over all cost to be closer to $4k
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      01-31-2008, 03:30 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
$2k...? Alot of manual labor involved... you doing all the welding yourself? If not expect the over all cost to be closer to $4k
I don't have a welded diff. Bolted FTW!
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      02-01-2008, 01:55 AM   #30
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You have to run in the advanced/racer group to have any real benchmark.
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Novice is easy to win.
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      02-01-2008, 02:02 AM   #31
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Yeah..I never put any credibility in a post about I beat this car..or I beat that at the track or at the stop light. Tons of reasons why someone might be faster or slower on the track. They could be cooling down there car...or having problems..or they just dont know how to drive fast on a track. If I was there..then I believe it.

Basically I have caught and passed lots of Porsches in numerous cars I have owned..but then again...a really well sorted out Porsche with a good driver..can haul ass.
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      02-01-2008, 11:03 AM   #32
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Come and run at a Porsche Owners Club event in SoCal and be humbled. Not unusual for the fast cars to lap you in a single run group session, even in a 1972 911
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      02-01-2008, 11:33 AM   #33
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My experience with turbo Porsches running in the instructor group was that they disappeared on the straightaways but I was back on their tails in three turns with my E36 M3 (chip, brakes, Koni's and Track tires). Once they let me past I was gone. Even at Road America.
The 335i is a better car and, for your class right now all really need is better pads and a cure for that understeer. Everyone badmouths the RFT's but their only problem is they are different.
Once you get comfortable in the car a Vishnu type upgrade and LSD will put you way out in front.
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      02-02-2008, 01:54 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by ZBMW View Post
My experience with turbo Porsches running in the instructor group was that they disappeared on the straightaways but I was back on their tails in three turns with my E36 M3 (chip, brakes, Koni's and Track tires). Once they let me past I was gone. Even at Road America.
The 335i is a better car and, for your class right now all really need is better pads and a cure for that understeer. Everyone badmouths the RFT's but their only problem is they are different.
Once you get comfortable in the car a Vishnu type upgrade and LSD will put you way out in front.

Yeah, a well sorted E36 is a great handling car. I was running time trials with James Clay at Road Atlanta in someone's well modded E36 and was in shock at how he tossed the car through the Esses, he literally threw the car around the turns, I just knew the car would spin, then it would grip and go the direction it was pointed, then I would blast past him on the straights, and he'd pass me again in the twisties, I know he got pissed after a while, but our lap times were almost identical with my fastest being .3 faster. Granted I was in a 550 hp car (while 3600 lbs), his car got moved to TTR for some reason, I think no Dyno sheets. But it was fun to watch and drive.

But I've learned a little more now so I wont be a road block in the twisties for those little quick buggers, though my car is still fat.


I'd like to give a 335 a run around Road Atlanta to see what it can do. I rarely got passed in my E39 M5 on dubs (LOL, yep). DE's are not a good gauge to compare cars unless the drivers are equal, the tires are similar etc. I used to pass Ford GT's, Z06's, and all kinds of cars in a 4200 lb car on 20's that had no grip and the brakes dead after two laps, and the clutch slipping. When you get to the most advanced groups all that changes because people know the limits of their car.
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      02-02-2008, 02:15 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by ZBMW View Post
My experience with turbo Porsches running in the instructor group was that they disappeared on the straightaways but I was back on their tails in three turns with my E36 M3 (chip, brakes, Koni's and Track tires). Once they let me past I was gone. Even at Road America.
The 335i is a better car and, for your class right now all really need is better pads and a cure for that understeer. Everyone badmouths the RFT's but their only problem is they are different.
Once you get comfortable in the car a Vishnu type upgrade and LSD will put you way out in front.
335i is a better car than a 911 turbo I passed 3 GT3 and 2 Turbos in both my E90 and E36 on the same day at the track. Moral of the story: Those particular Porsche drivers could not drive their cars to their potential. 335i a better car? No way. As an instructor, I asked the GT3 driver if I could take his car out for a few laps. I was 3 seconds quicker than both my cars after three laps of seat time.

RFT's only problem is that they are different you say? They suck for track work and won't last a day if you drive your car at 10/10th. I chunked out a pair after a single 25 minute session. Put some RFT's on your E36 and compare them to your track tires (unless your track tires are not R compounds).
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      02-02-2008, 02:32 AM   #36
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LOL........


I think he meant the 335 is better than the E36, I was going to comment as you did, but after I read it again I can see where he could have meant it the other way.
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      02-02-2008, 04:20 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sg335 View Post
Come and run at a Porsche Owners Club event in SoCal and be humbled. Not unusual for the fast cars to lap you in a single run group session, even in a 1972 911
Trust me..I have been around my fair share of really fast Porsches. I use to run with Todd Serota in his yellow cabriolet...and later in his GT2. The guys that show up to the Audi club events in Porsches are mediocre at best in NorCal. I have never run with PCA.
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      04-14-2008, 10:00 PM   #38
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yeah i'm not surprised that a 335 beat a targa but beat an e39 m5??....
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