Sponsored by The Tire Rack

[rsyed]

There is a spare wheel for the e90. I was offered the spare wheel (of course, a very thin wheel) plus a new inside compartment that goes under my boot - loved the idea. BUT when he quoted the price to me, I opted to buy the EUR 100,- BMW pump plus spray.

oh ja, they quoted 700 EUR for the retrofit...

[Kilgore Trout]

Originally Posted by noro

I like this, it must be new. Guess what, I am getting this too.

The slime kid is available at target for $29. Costco.com also sells it.

[mike-y]

Originally Posted by Xiaofeng

Would America's Tire (Discount Tire in Colorado) void your warranty if you bring it to them to have it patched, even if you tell them to remove the temporary plug and use theirs? What about if you use the Slime stuff?

You would probably have to ask your local Discount Tire about that. In my case, I stopped in to have a tire plugged (because I have the warranty), but they were really busy, and said it would be an hour before they could get to my car. So I went down the street to a gas station and had the service guy put a plug in it.

Months later, I got another nail in the same tire and stopped by my America's Tire place again to get it fixed. this time they were able to do it right away, but when they saw the old plug in there, they told me the warranty was void, so I had to buy a new tire. Their reasoning was that the stuff used in some tire plugs causes the steel belts inside the tire to corrode/rust, which can affect the integrity of the tire. Makes sense, but I don't know how true this really is. Maybe if I went back a day or two after the plug, they would have still honored the warranty, but I don't know.

I've used some "fix-a-flat" goo stuff (like the slime) before, but left it in the tire until it was worn down enough to change. They said next time just let them fix it, but never mentioned anything about the warranty. I didn't think to ask, since I was buying new tires anyway.

[BMWs4ever]

I have had 2 flats in 26 years of driving which I figure is about 950,000km. The two flats I did have were really bad spots to change a tire. I changed both of those flats myself however, I would have opted for a run flat in both situations. The only thing I really hate about runflats is the price.

[TofuTurkey]

Originally Posted by Xiaofeng

Actually, since we're talking about alternatives to spares, has anyone used something like this before?

http://www.slime.com/product_151_Tir..._(1034-A).html

Although the Slime sealant says it is TPMS safe, there are other sealants (such as the one in the Continental kit) that say they may damage TPMS sensors. As such, I'm still somewhat hesitant in pumping that goo into the tire and risk clogging or damaging a sensor.

If these plug kits work, I think I'd rather carry one of these plus a compressor for emergencies. Anyone else have the same thoughts, or are my concerns unfounded?

So.... I just hit a pothole. Like 2 hours ago. It took less than 10 seconds before the TPMS light went on, and less than 20 before I can tell, without getting out of the car, that the tire has gone completely flat.

I'm on a small road, with a small parking lot just by the side, so I pulled in there and looked at the tire. It's totally flat. I can't see any damage, so I thought, "Maybe I'll try pumping it up, and see if that'll get me home." I'm just a couple of miles away anyway.

I have one of those BMW mobility kits, with compressors + sealant. I've used the compressor before, and I've changed tires many times before too. The manual says it won't work for punctures more than 4mm. I can't tell whether it's more than 4mm, I don't even know where or what "it" is. Sure I can jack the car up, take off the wheel, and check. I look at the sealant, look at the falling snow, think about how quickly the tire deflated, and called BMW SOS. Takes max 70 mins I'm told, but at that time I was also curious about how Assist would work.

In the meantime, I tried the compressor. Tire is totally flat, pressure doesn't go up, I can hear hissing. Falling snow, hands going numb. Looked at the manual again, "When tire puncture is detected, stop immediately and use the kit. If tire pressure goes to zero, then kit won't work." Should I jack up the car and see if it inflates? Can't think, head going numb. Thank goodness I've already called BMW SOS, and that I've still got half a tank of gas.

I'm going to start thinking about getting a donut again... no need to think, always the same actions: change tire. Works 100%. I'm interested to know the percentage of tire punctures where run-flats still work.

P.S. I thought a little about whether the sealant will mess up the TPMS or not, but it's very little. Most of my thoughts were about whether the sealant would work at all. Unfortunately, I have no experience with that. Maybe I'll try this tomorrow, the flat tire's still on the car.

P.P.S. So now I'm running through the scenario again, but suppose I have run-flats on. I can't see the damage, how do I know if it's still okay to drive with the run-flats? What if I'm driving on run-flats, and the damage is really so bad that halfway home the entire tire comes off leaving me driving on the bare rim? How can I tell?

[npolite]

Originally Posted by mike-y

but when they saw the old plug in there, they told me the warranty was void, so I had to buy a new tire. Their reasoning was that the stuff used in some tire plugs causes the steel belts inside the tire to corrode/rust, which can affect the integrity of the tire.

While this is possible I just think this is another excuse for them to void the warranty. Just like if you don't bring it in to them to rotate the tires and you do it yourself(Another reason why car manufactures should have a spare). Those shops use the same plug that the garage down the street use.

[dlpuette]

Here's a great way for a 3'er with non-RFT's to have a donut:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=297373

[TofuTurkey]

I thought about the case for run-flats again. Let's use the same tire mishap scenario for two different cases: one with normal tires + spare, the other with just run-flats. You run over something on the road, TPMS goes off, etc.

1. In the first tens of seconds, when the tire begins losing pressure, till you detect that and safely pull to the side of the road, run-flat tires do a better job of keeping you safe since the stiff sidewalls enables the driver to maintain better control. So, the BMW engineers traded off (increased cost of run-flats+weight) for safety in those tens of seconds, which makes sense.

2. After you pull to the side of the road, you can either (a) change your tire to use the spare, (if you are using normal tires) or (b) continue on the damaged run-flat. BMW engineers decide to go with (b), so they decided to trade off

(convenience of not having to change tire + cost of run-flats + weight)

with

(reduction in safety), since we're comparing driving on a spare to driving on damaged run-flat tire.

What kind of engineer makes that sort of decision?

For the best possible safety score, BMW should have gone with run-flats, plus have a spare. In any case, BMW should not have told people to continue driving on damaged run-flats, but to stay put and call BMW Assist.

[scottp999]

For anyone reading this and wanting to know a good solution for a spare:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=86651

[noro]

The only thing I would disagree with in your post is that an "engineer" made that kind of a choice. When BMW engineers were making choices we were seeing cars like the original M Coupe (based off of Z3 Coupe), E30 M3, 2002Tii etc. Unfortunately nowdays the final product that comes out of the factory has a lot more input from marketing folks.

Originally Posted by TofuTurkey

I thought about the case for run-flats again.
Let's use the same tire mishap scenario for two different cases: one with normal tires + spare, the other with just run-flats. You run over something on the road, TPMS goes off, etc.

1. In the first tens of seconds, when the tire begins losing pressure, till you detect that and safely pull to the side of the road, run-flat tires do a better job of keeping you safe since the stiff sidewalls enables the driver to maintain better control. So, the BMW engineers traded off (increased cost of run-flats+weight) for safety in those tens of seconds, which makes sense.

2. After you pull to the side of the road, you can either (a) change your tire to use the spare, (if you are using normal tires) or (b) continue on the damaged run-flat. BMW engineers decide to go with (b), so they decided to trade off

(convenience of not having to change tire + cost of run-flats + weight)

with

(reduction in safety), since we're comparing driving on a spare to driving on damaged run-flat tire.

What kind of engineer makes that sort of decision?

For the best possible safety score, BMW should have gone with run-flats, plus have a spare. In any case, BMW should not have told people to continue driving on damaged run-flats, but to stay put and call BMW Assist.

[swartzentruber]

I have to say I agree with the rant. I bought the 5 series donut, and I'm sure it will work fine, but it really takes a ton of trunk space. Why not engineer the trunk with space for a spare, and sell the spare as a option? Then, they could sell the car with either runflat+no spare, runflat+spare, regular tire+no spare, regular tire+spare. Give the customer a choice.

It's not like RFTs are superior tech in every way, they are a tradeoff between a bit more safety + no need to change a spare with heavier weight, stiffer ride, noisier ride (typically), extra cost. I'd even pay extra to have a spare and ditch the RFTs. For those of you saying "get over it" as if it's the wave of the future -- well, do you see any other luxury car makers embracing or making any strong move to RFTs? My guess is the runflat generation is going to be completely replace by some type of truly superior tire tech, and BMW is going to end up looking stupid for embracing them.

[captainaudio]

Originally Posted by PNF

Do these really work?

Yes,
They work very well.

[DHS]

Originally Posted by swartzentruber

I have to say I agree with the rant. I bought the 5 series donut, and I'm sure it will work fine, but it really takes a ton of trunk space. Why not engineer the trunk with space for a spare, and sell the spare as a option? Then, they could sell the car with either runflat+no spare, runflat+spare, regular tire+no spare, regular tire+spare. Give the customer a choice.

It's not like RFTs are superior tech in every way, they are a tradeoff between a bit more safety + no need to change a spare with heavier weight, stiffer ride, noisier ride (typically), extra cost. I'd even pay extra to have a spare and ditch the RFTs. For those of you saying "get over it" as if it's the wave of the future -- well, do you see any other luxury car makers embracing or making any strong move to RFTs? My guess is the runflat generation is going to be completely replace by some type of truly superior tire tech, and BMW is going to end up looking stupid for embracing them.

Cadillac is even worse. What you get with the CTS is a dime store compressor and a can of green goo.

[GearRex]

No one is bothered by the fact that you have to pay $400.00 every time you get a nail on your tire? Please, don't give me the "it's a BMW" line... Furthermore, if your tires are halfway through their wear life, you might wind up paying another $400.00 for the matching tire for the other side.

What bothers me is that according to Bridgestone, the RTF tires are repairable as long as it meets some requirements. The following text comes from the Bridgestone Warranty booklet - page 26 (http://www.bridgestonetire.com/warra...anty_US_EN.pdf):

"...RFT tires are not repairable in any of the following situations:
• If the tire was operated with inflation pressure less than 15 psi (100 kPa).
• Abrasion or other damage is present on the exterior tread, sidewall or bead areas.
• Abrasion, wrinkling, or separation is present on the tire interior.
• Any condition or damage is present that disqualifies repair of a conventional tire.

Run-Flat Certified Retailers will fully inspect your tire, inside and out, to determine if the tire can be repaired. Tire damage is not always visible from the outside and the tire must be removed from the wheel for a complete inspection. For more information, see “Tire Repairs” in this manual.

Note: Some vehicle manufacturers do not recommend using repaired tires. Consult your vehicle owner’s manual or contact the vehicle manufacturer before operating a repaired tire on your vehicle..."

The trouble is that neither the dealership, nor the Bridgestone Certified Repair Center, will repair these tires. The Bridgestone dealers will take a look but they will always tell you that you need new tires...

Consumers should have a choice!!!

[-=Hot|Ice=-]

Originally Posted by S4to335

The more I have this car..the more I get pissed that the car doesnt come with a spare..and doesnt even come with a place to put a spare if I bought one for the car. I hate runflat tires due to lack of performance..removed them almost immediately...and now have to carry a track wheel/tire in my trunk...with a jack..and tool box (breaker bar, 17mm socket, torque wrench, and a few other odds and ends) just to be safe. AND my rant extends to bitchin about how I now have no room for anything else in my trunk. I am sorry BMW...but you should at least have kept the hole for a full-sized spare or a mini-spare. Many of us HATE "heavy" runflat tires.

[/rant]

Consider an Audi or a Mercedes maybe?

[Kilgore Trout]

Originally Posted by E93_Rzr

No one is bothered by the fact that you have to pay $400.00 every time you get a nail on your tire? Please, don't give me the "it's a BMW" line... Furthermore, if your tires are halfway through their wear life, you might wind up paying another $400.00 for the matching tire for the other side.

What bothers me is that according to Bridgestone, the RTF tires are repairable as long as it meets some requirements. The following text comes from the Bridgestone Warranty booklet - page 26 (http://www.bridgestonetire.com/warra...anty_US_EN.pdf):

"...RFT tires are not repairable in any of the following situations:
• If the tire was operated with inflation pressure less than 15 psi (100 kPa).
• Abrasion or other damage is present on the exterior tread, sidewall or bead areas.
• Abrasion, wrinkling, or separation is present on the tire interior.
• Any condition or damage is present that disqualifies repair of a conventional tire.

Run-Flat Certified Retailers will fully inspect your tire, inside and out, to determine if the tire can be repaired. Tire damage is not always visible from the outside and the tire must be removed from the wheel for a complete inspection. For more information, see “Tire Repairs” in this manual.

Note: Some vehicle manufacturers do not recommend using repaired tires. Consult your vehicle owner’s manual or contact the vehicle manufacturer before operating a repaired tire on your vehicle..."

The trouble is that neither the dealership, nor the Bridgestone Certified Repair Center, will repair these tires. The Bridgestone dealers will take a look but they will always tell you that you need new tires...

Consumers should have a choice!!!

Are the tires really $400 each? I don't have ZSP although I upgraded to 17" tires. I've looked at tirerack.com and it is $200 for a replacement - which is only a bit more than a I paid for the tires on my Acura TSX.

[Kilgore Trout]

Originally Posted by DHS

Cadillac is even worse. What you get with the CTS is a dime store compressor and a can of green goo.

True, but the Caddy does have a well for a spare, and the options sheet also has a $250 option for one. So, CTS drivers can at least opt for a spare if they want one.

[captainaudio]

In theory the run flats are a good idea but I think it is rather obvious that there is still a lot of development to be done. As has been discussed here ad naseum they are very unpleasant on bad surfaces and have a number of other disadvantages. In fact other than the run flat feature they seem to be inferior to regular tires in every respect.

CA

[GearRex]

Originally Posted by Kilgore Trout

Are the tires really $400 each? I don't have ZSP although I upgraded to 17" tires. I've looked at tirerack.com and it is $200 for a replacement - which is only a bit more than a I paid for the tires on my Acura TSX.

The prices from Tire Rack for the 335i E93 with Sports Package (18" wheels):

Bridgestone Potenza RE050A RFT
Front:
$259.00 ea.

Rear:
$353.00 ea.

After that you must add Shipping + Mounting / Balancing bringing the totals to almost $310 / $400.00 per tire!!

[Kilgore Trout]

Originally Posted by E93_Rzr

The prices from Tire Rack for the 335i E93 with Sports Package (18" wheels):

Bridgestone Potenza RE050A RFT
Front:
$259.00 ea.

Rear:
$353.00 ea.

After that you must add Shipping + Mounting / Balancing bringing the totals to almost $310 / $400.00 per tire!!

I guess the situation is a little differnent for the non-sports package. I have 17" 225/45s all around. I can get some Continental Summer or All season, and it would cost less than $800 for the set (without mounting). When you consider that the Potenza 960s on my TSX cost $170 each, it seems like a small premium to me.