[gaza01]

So mrs is due a new car and has taken a fondness to the X5.

Anybody have any experience of them? Anything to look out for when buying second hand?

Thanks

[old grey steve]

E53 spec or E70 spec Shaun?

[gaza01]

Originally Posted by old grey steve

E53 spec or E70 spec Shaun?

E70 spec Steve

[old grey steve]

Ah right, well we see a fair few of them these days both pre and post face lift. The most annoying thing I can say is the electric hand brake unit can play up, coding and software updates can help but if this is unsucessful at over £700+VAt to supply plus fitting plus initilisation just for a bloosy handbrake its a lot of money, the fault shows on the dash plus of course is on the cars error report. Give me an old fashioned handbrake lever anyday but that wouldn't work with BMW's modern centre console layout would it

Another thing we see a lot of with these and the 5 series for that matter is this




split punctured rear suspension air bags, £206+VAT each to supply(this picturs from a 530GT)but they look alike(these 530GT bags are $434+VAT each)they are however easy to fit, which is a blessing but need to be decompresed and set up again via diagnostic to ensure no faults are present but apart from that they are straightforward really. If the pump fails(and they do these are over £740+VAT to supply)we've seen countless X5's with their arse ends on the deck we done a fair few pumps plus left/right bags, the bags split the pump works overtime until it gives up, the location of the pump doesn't help as its subseptable to dirt water and all that.



On the air suspension front again leaks can take place in the pipe work too, which can be a sod to locate.

Some X5's have a spring set up on the rear along with a control unit too



but we don't see that many if any of these.

Front suspension struts aren't as common but they aren't unheard of either, you'll either have conventioanl of the level control VDCset up but on the suspension the common air bag issues seem to lie on the rears. On the fronts check anti roll bar drop links too as these are common too.

Therefore if your X5 has traditioanl springs dampers its all straightforward stuff.

Again on the front end front tension struts don't seem to not last too long either they resemble the E46 eye bushes for the amount of times they seem to need changing(I think part of this issue is the drive where speed humps/pot holes are driven over as if theysimply don't exsist)likete E90 ones they aren't exactly cheap(over £90+VAT from somewhere like Euro's over £150+VAT from BMW)adn they do have an effect on the front tyres. You'll feel a thud/knock off throttle and under braking which is more pronounced than anything you've felt from the E90 series.

Seen a few seat block issues too(there are several seat block options of rhte car)depending on what cars chosen we've seen a couple where when driven the seat all on its own moves up/down or forward/backwards all on its own. Software updates are available and can help cure the issue failing that the seat block module is around £240+VAT requires the seat to be unbloted so that you can remove repalce the old block and also needs coding to the car.

PDC issues aren't uncommon but the same problems here exsist on all the BMW's the X5's just seems a bit more prone to these issues(unless its the drivers that even with them have a knack of hitting things)we've seena fair few that have nudged something lightly the PDC sensor gets disturbed causing an error sometimes your lucky and the PDC sensor can be saved sometimes the damage is to the bumper which requires come internal cosmetic care to allow the PDC to sit correctly in the recess. But you know how expensive these are.

Tempting as it is glass roofs look great cassettes are a comon issue on thes they fauil they aint cheap (£900+VAT with ease)and take an age to remove repalce the early 07-07/57 plate cars seem to be the worst offenders here plus they rattle too and we've had the occassional leak too.

Talking of leaks door membraines can also leak look for puddles in the rear footwells for instance, remove the door card and you'll see the issue normally at the bottom towards the rear of the door, we've seena good few where someones had the card off and had a go with various stuff such as mastick to cure the issuem the membraines aren't that expensive(£50ish+VAT from memory)plus get their tape as its rather good.

Interior door cappings can actually peel off, the Ali ones with heat on the back doors can or seem to go dry and the Ali section peels away from the rest of the finisher, I've seen these bonded only to pull away, like the rest of BMW range these finishers aren't exactly cheap at over £100+VAt from memory.

They chew rear tyres at an alarming rate inner edges make the 335 rears seems like they last an age, I've seen may a rear tyres turned to toast due to the inner edges where the rest of the tread has some serviceable life left.

Top glove box lids can play up too and they aren't cheap plus they are a bit of a sod to change from memory, talking of this look fore the 6 stack in hte glovebox area, these fail over £400+VAT rare and are a little fiddly to get out but in this day and age perhaps who cares eh

Engine wise its about the same as the rest of the 3.0d range TBH commendably I haven't really seen any turbo issues, but as they share a lotof their engine stock with the other BMW's in the range it does surprise me, but that's us I dare say they happen like the 3 & 5 series. So nothing really to say on this a fair few have been driven in towns therefore DPF's and all that stand out a lot wouldn't have been driven that hard a lot of X5 customers don't seem to react to anything until hte light comes on therefore we usually when they are serviced nedd to spend a bit of time and TLC bringing them back to health, oil serivces seem way way to long for instance, X5 customers simply it seems put the key in and drive and know little lese.

Again on the engine front they seem to be very subseptable to glow plugs and control units for instance, but then again so do the 530d's but again on the 5's you get the same key in and drive mentaility Seen a few with HPFP issues too nad various fuel rail presure issues but the same again goes for the rest of the range with the 3.0 d engine in tow. Fuel pump/sender unit in the tank can play up you've got 2 in the tank under the rear seat to contend with the right handsome unit is the most common but (both are over £250+VAT)a smell of fuel can sometimes refer to the fact they've been looked at before and when refitted haven't been seated quite right.

Drivetrain wise they are stronger than the E53 spec for sure gearboxes have have the usual fit(software update plus adaptation reset can/will help)as will fluid/sump change. The driveshafts at the front can suffer from CV boots where they split inner boots are of course more grief than the outers but life it's predecessor these do come up from time to time. The gearbox/transfer box seem more robust then the E53 too but the transfer case can as per X3's suffer from glitches within the unit and its electronic monitoring, you can do a transfer case serrvice(1.2 litres of fluid from memory)which can help along with if available software update and reset. Rear diff on these seems or from what I've seen anyway far more robust then the E53.

Rear axle bushes can play up detectable on the drive you're feel a wayward action/thump from the rear but again more robust then the previous car but if a repairs needed time consuming.

Wheel bearings don't seem too bad tobe fair on these usual routine re discovering if you're unlucky.

Brakes. Ah brakes these cars chew them IMO seen many an X5 gave new pads on worn discs to keep costs down. On MOT brakes throw up re efficiency on occasions which is worth bearing in mind I guess. They can throw up binding/calliper issues on the front usual signs apply(steering shaking etc.)but to change its all straightforward at the fronts on the rears with that electric handbrake the obvious applies re setting these up.

Headlight washers can play up that's a bumper off job to get access but its an easy spot Shaun.

A lot of the cars again suffer elecrical issues you can look a the battery(under the boot floor in the centre to see if its exhausted)they seem good for around 4 odd years if your lucky then they play up IBS cable issues aren't unheard off either various control units can play up but when battery and/or IBS cables are replaced normal service is usually resumed. Usual symptoms are clocks resetting theirselves, loss of radio stored stations. They do when checked suffer various instrument cluster faults but these are glitches and usually clear.

As a drive they are bloody good though I love driving them they make superb long distance transport. I could think of more to say but the negitives are outweighed by hte dynamics of the car as a drivers tool, which for its size is good.

And you did say you wanted to know something about them

[Sensible_]

Wow lol. Now that's a reply!

[gaza01]

Steve u never cease to impress me!!! Thank you so much for the detailed reply!
Lots of issues there. Not sure now! Lolol

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by gaza01

Steve u never cease to impress me!!! Thank you so much for the detailed reply!
Lots of issues there. Not sure now! Lolol

They are a good cars Shaun, if you can get a 7 seater they are great news(though on RHD UK spec)I understand due yo a lack of take up they were phased out by 58/09 plate release, I've seen a few advertised without the cars being mentioned as 7 seaters, the later more upto date F series models I believe have re established the 7 seater route(though we won't see these girls a little while)

What I think I said before re servicing and money on these in my mind applies, every 3rd oil service oil, air, fuel filter(unless filter is in tank-on later models)applies, breathers get neglected(later cars 09 platers from memory have revised set up)and we've seen many with visible sweating on pipe work and under inlet manifold proving the breathers at fault. Many have been through the dealer network in their life yet this hasn't been attended too.

Swirl flsos are the later spec, where fitted these are a lot stronger than the first/second generation ones but if fitted IMO are worth changing.

But I do like em Shaun. Go in though eyes wide open service regularly expect to an extent the unexpected and look very very carefully at things like tyres and as the wheels are big enough the things like brake disc condition(check gif lips and scores) apply and are easily dine brakes can cost a fortune on these more so than the 335i

[DaveCR]

So.. I was wondering about X5 s myself.. now I Know!

[Russbmw]

Nice reply Steve!

To add my tuppence, as a recent e70 owner (yes, my missus wanted one as well).

Water ingress in these cars seems to be a nightmare.

The panaoramic roof is a nice option, but from experience, is a ballache, as BMW still seem unable to produce a sunroof drainage system that doesn't block.

I found a lake in the drivers footwell not long ago. Front a-pillar drain completely blocked, and water had been running down the inside of the trim (completely undetectable), behind the dash and filling up the car. Had to have it cleared out using a garage air line, I couldn't do it manually as the tube takes a tortuous route down to behind the wheel arch - and where it runs isn't shown on any BMW diagrams or anything....by the way.

The door "vapour" seals are not vapour seals, they are water seals. They also have a habit of coming unstuck from the door, allowing water to drain into the car instead of out. Discovered the rear drivers side passenger door had this issue and was filling up the rear of the car. Door card is easy to remove (although has white and blue trim clips, and the blue ones are allegedly single use.....I couldn't see why though, but had bought new ones anyway), and I simply siliconed the 2" part where it had come detached.

Where the cabin air filter (pollen filter?) is fitted on the passenger side of the engine bay (beneath the scuttle plastic trim) - if that filter box is not clipped in properly, water can run down around the filter housing and find its way in to the heater vents - so you'll have water dripping out of the footwell vents below the glovebox area. The filter housing clips up onto the bulkhead, and needs to be perfectly located or this water running around the filter housing gets in.

Finally, the engine bay drains (you have to remove the scuttle plastic trim to get them), they too get gummed up with leaves and general debris.

The one on the drivers side is easy to get too. Best to remove, clean and refit. The one on the passenger side, you have not a hope in hell of getting out without removing the entire ECU container thing. Again, ballache. If you have hands like Jeremy Beadle, you might be able to scoop some rubbish out, but getting the drain out like on the other side is near impossible.

Oh, and wheel arch liner (incase you're trying to find the bottom of the sunroof drains) is held on my non-reusable plastic rivets - so dont' go taking any out without having any new ones.........like i did.

Rear light clusters on the bootlid are like any other BMW ones, they get old and start leaking - so go dull/black and horrible inside. The rear light cluster on the body itself can also come apart (like the e46 ones used to) and leak. They are held in with black sticky cack that is a nightmare to get off. You can't re-use it either, as it'll be caked in years of grime and so won't stick the new light...hurrah! BMW changed the seal arrangement to a traditional foam seal (obviously realising their error) on the LCi models, but the lights are the same basic shape, so there's no issue what age e70 you have.

I found a place online, can't remember the name off the top of my head, but they sell OEM manufactered replacements (for all BMWs) and were less than half the price of BMW dealers.

Get one with all the options (ie: dynamic suspension, dynamic drive, adaptive xenons, heads up display, etc) if possible, as there are a lot of poverty spec ones out there, so the high spec ones definitely hold their value better. Ours literally has virtually everything....honestly...so I will be answering yes to any of the smart arses that try to make out otherwise!

HTH

[gaza01]

Faaaark me!
This really isnt looking good is it?
It all just sounds like heap of nightmares!

Appreciate all the responses tho. Very thorough and in depth!

[dy63]

a friend told me the twin turbo ones are cheaper on road tax...

Also have heard of the handbrake problem too. i took one to london and back from west midlands, £50 there and back which isnt bad at all.

[dobbo99]

interesting reading.

my best friend had an e70, we took 4 people and golf stuff in it on a weekend away and it was great. unfortunately they had it 4 months and spent at least one week of those months in the dealership. it put me off.
one of the guys I work with is now on his 2nd e70, and both have been faultless, hes had a diesel and is now on a petrol V8.
so guess you get good and bad.

are the older ones (e53's) any better?

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by gaza01

Faaaark me!
This really isnt looking good is it?
It all just sounds like heap of nightmares!

Appreciate all the responses tho. Very thorough and in depth!

When you write things out Shaun they usually look bad in real life I've seen worse, but if you've got a 3 series, 5 series and an X3, X5 one thing I'd say is the X model will consume more money, but I've got X5's on my books that go on and on and never really create any issue in terms of expenditure apart from service and routine maintenance

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by dobbo99

interesting reading.

my best friend had an e70, we took 4 people and golf stuff in it on a weekend away and it was great. unfortunately they had it 4 months and spent at least one week of those months in the dealership. it put me off.
one of the guys I work with is now on his 2nd e70, and both have been faultless, hes had a diesel and is now on a petrol V8.
so guess you get good and bad.

are the older ones (e53's) any better?

E53's are more simplistic but again do chew money in most of the areas described. X5 v say an E39 5 Series Estate the 5 series will be more manageable for instance but a lot of E53's are dogs poorly maintained or people who own them haven't got the finds to keep them on the road fully maintained and we see loads of them.

Rear axle bushes (4 of them over £120+VAT to supply) the job involves rear axle to be dropped exhaust to be dropped bet on a good 5.5 hours labour, symptoms are a wayward rear end or knocking/thumping under load or when coming off throttle/going over bumps, if its really bad we can actually make the rear wheels move for and aft front to back

[Russbmw]

Oh, and according to an ex-BMW chief tech (who has now set his own business up), and a few other BMW contacts I have, the other main culprit for water ingress into the cabin is the rear screen washer - as the hose runs through the middle of the car along the transmission tunnel.

This hose can dry out, crack and leak - so if the sunroof drains aren't overflowing into the car, or the vapour guards aren't directing water into the car, you can fill the cabin up yourself by simply pumping water in from the screen wash.

Genius.

Hose is utterly inaccessible without stripping the entire interior out.

If you're hooning through screen wash, then that will probably explain why.

Morale - don't use the rear washer....in fact, take the fuse out or disconnect the hose at the pump.

I wouldn't say they are bad cars to be fair, but as mentioned, go into it with your eyes open and in the knowledge that they are expensive to maintain. This is what I had to emphasise to the wife, because I don't want her moaning to me that she's not got the money to look after it - as I'm sure as shit not paying for it!

The 3 ltr diesel does shift the lump of a thing at a surprising rate really. In sport mode it does take off at a very respectable rate. With the dynamic suspension, you can select sport mode, which stiffens it up and if handles well fora 2t+ car.

If you run it down until the fuel light comes on, you're looking at at least £110 to fill up. It's no slouch really, and you fly along motorways in quiet comfort - but it will do at best 30-35 mpg at motorway speeds. Overall a mixed urban/motorway tankfull will see you getting about 350 miles. Road tax on our 07 plate is £485....she had that nice reminder this week...LOL!

It's not only the cost you have to consider fairly basic things like, if you want to change the brake pads (a simple DIY job) - is the trolley jack you have (a) strong enough and (b) have enough lift to get the wheels off the ground.

Speaking of which, if you fancy a giggle - enquire anywhere about the cost of 20" runflats that are 245 wide at the front and 315 wide at the rear!! Our one needed 4 tyres. We put normal ones one thanks...a snip at £750 for all for in comparison.

You have to remember, these are £60k+ cars new. They are not aimed at Joe Average, they are for people with a lot of money who don't have any desire to so much as change a light bulb themselves, they pay a dealer to do it. It frustrates me how much stuff you can't really do yourself without either special tools or serious diagnostic kit just to reset something - because nuts and bolts are fairly straightforward!

I'd have an e70 over an e53, purely because even early e70s like ours has a lot of the modern creature comforts if spec'd up, and the styling inside is obvioulsy much more inline with all the modern range - whereas the e53 is basically e39 revamped, so a bit old hat.

[gaza01]

Russ yr last post made me laugh!! Lolol!

Problem is we need a 7seater. With 1 11yr old, 1 10mth old and the possibility of another baby, 2 car seats in the rear doesnt leave enough room for the 11yr old.

Need to explore other options out there before committing to the X5 given the amount of issues they have.

[335d Rocco]

Not dismissing the replies to the OP in any way, but wouldnt any car of any make or model have a list of potential problems??

The replies to the op have been great, very informative but im just trying to look at it from another angle ☺

Or maybe ive missed the point and the op is being put in the picture of the potential expense as well as the potential problems

[dobbo99]

but they still sound more reliable than a range rover

[Russbmw]

Originally Posted by Uk 330d

Not dismissing the replies to the OP in any way, but wouldnt any car of any make or model have a list of potential problems??

The replies to the op have been great, very informative but im just trying to look at it from another angle ☺

Or maybe ive missed the point and the op is being put in the picture of the potential expense as well as the potential problems

I'm sure they would, and I'm also sure anyone (who is even slightly enthusiastic about their cars) looking to buy any model/brand car would also be asking the same question on the relevant forums.....so I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, to be honest?

[gaza01]

Originally Posted by Uk 330d

Not dismissing the replies to the OP in any way, but wouldnt any car of any make or model have a list of potential problems??

The replies to the op have been great, very informative but im just trying to look at it from another angle ☺

Or maybe ive missed the point and the op is being put in the picture of the potential expense as well as the potential problems

For me this the replies are exactly what i was after. I understand your angle and yes it is another way of looking at it but what u wanted was common issues and where possible costs of making good so that i can then make a decision based upon my circumstances.

Eg...our drive is quite steep so the e brake thing makes me worry. Also the water ingress for me is big no no...on any car. 1 reason why i sold my vert. The other issues dont worry me that much as we dont do that much mileage so if im lucky and choose an ok one to start with i may not incur as much in terms of maintenance bills.

But yes all cars have long lists of common issues...like my 335i but to me they are all manageable and thats what i wanted to find out about the X5s

[Russbmw]

Originally Posted by gaza01

Russ yr last post made me laugh!! Lolol!

Problem is we need a 7seater. With 1 11yr old, 1 10mth old and the possibility of another baby, 2 car seats in the rear doesnt leave enough room for the 11yr old.

Need to explore other options out there before committing to the X5 given the amount of issues they have.

I would imagine anything of the same ilk as the X5 will have it's fair share of expensive issues. Heavy, luxury cars = expensive when something does wrong ....hence BMW warranty (drivetrain only option ) is £140 a month on a 3.0d X5, compared to £40 a month on my newer 335i.

7 seats doesn't necessarily mean 4x4 though. I know the E class Mercs come in 7 seat flavours (as do the Volvo's), not sure if the e60 5 series did?

Oh, and I meant to say about the sunroof (and Steve's comment about they fail) - yes they can break, but usually it is due to neglect, and the mechanisms getting gummed up. So if you keep an eye on it, and make sure the runners/gears are kept clean and free form debris - as well as giving a little lube every now and then, they should be fine.

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by Russbmw

Oh, and according to an ex-BMW chief tech (who has now set his own business up), and a few other BMW contacts I have, the other main culprit for water ingress into the cabin is the rear screen washer - as the hose runs through the middle of the car along the transmission tunnel.

This hose can dry out, crack and leak - so if the sunroof drains aren't overflowing into the car, or the vapour guards aren't directing water into the car, you can fill the cabin up yourself by simply pumping water in from the screen wash.

Genius.

Hose is utterly inaccessible without stripping the entire interior out.

If you're hooning through screen wash, then that will probably explain why.

Morale - don't use the rear washer....in fact, take the fuse out or disconnect the hose at the pump.

I wouldn't say they are bad cars to be fair, but as mentioned, go into it with your eyes open and in the knowledge that they are expensive to maintain. This is what I had to emphasise to the wife, because I don't want her moaning to me that she's not got the money to look after it - as I'm sure as shit not paying for it!

The 3 ltr diesel does shift the lump of a thing at a surprising rate really. In sport mode it does take off at a very respectable rate. With the dynamic suspension, you can select sport mode, which stiffens it up and if handles well fora 2t+ car.

If you run it down until the fuel light comes on, you're looking at at least £110 to fill up. It's no slouch really, and you fly along motorways in quiet comfort - but it will do at best 30-35 mpg at motorway speeds. Overall a mixed urban/motorway tankfull will see you getting about 350 miles. Road tax on our 07 plate is £485....she had that nice reminder this week...LOL!

It's not only the cost you have to consider fairly basic things like, if you want to change the brake pads (a simple DIY job) - is the trolley jack you have (a) strong enough and (b) have enough lift to get the wheels off the ground.

Speaking of which, if you fancy a giggle - enquire anywhere about the cost of 20" runflats that are 245 wide at the front and 315 wide at the rear!! Our one needed 4 tyres. We put normal ones one thanks...a snip at £750 for all for in comparison.

You have to remember, these are £60k+ cars new. They are not aimed at Joe Average, they are for people with a lot of money who don't have any desire to so much as change a light bulb themselves, they pay a dealer to do it. It frustrates me how much stuff you can't really do yourself without either special tools or serious diagnostic kit just to reset something - because nuts and bolts are fairly straightforward!

I'd have an e70 over an e53, purely because even early e70s like ours has a lot of the modern creature comforts if spec'd up, and the styling inside is obvioulsy much more inline with all the modern range - whereas the e53 is basically e39 revamped, so a bit old hat.

Ah forgot the rear wiper yes not unheard off same on a 5 TBH too, E39/E53 comparison's about right the later ones are IMO better to drive(though larger)like comparing an E46 with an E90 I guess.

But I do like them they make ideal transport but you've got to go in I guess with the knowledge of these can/may cost, we see the odd Range Rover/ Range Rover Sport here as well and they also cost money. Guess it goes with the territory