[rismo]

Hi Guys,

I was wondering if besides BMW, any of the aftermarket tuners would come up with an improved water cooling system for the x35?

Some questions I have:

- Would it be better to improve the water or the oil cooling of the engine when tuned?
- If non of the tuners would bring an improved water cooling kit, why would that be?

Thanks!

[rismo]

Nobody with some thougths? :-)

[J.P.]

I don't think it would hurt..
I would be more curious to see the price..

[veightkiller]

^^+1 and i haven't seen a aftermarket parts that improves cooling

[jeho]

i think this is what we REALLY NEED especially for the guys who track (road course)...
the LIMPs are not always caused by oil temps but water temps i believe...

[stressdoc]

It's complex stuff. You can do the simple thing and use some waterwetter, but beyond that it gets tricky. BMW (and Alpina, Dinan, et al) adjust the software control of the water pump. The new BMW Performance tune will include both software and hardware fixes. That looks to be the clear easy solution for now.

[dlbrooks18]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

It's complex stuff. You can do the simple thing and use some waterwetter, but beyond that it gets tricky. BMW (and Alpina, Dinan, et al) adjust the software control of the water pump. The new BMW Performance tune will include both software and hardware fixes. That looks to be the clear easy solution for now.

+1, totally agree with you. I'm going to say again that a flash is better suited for tracking, and IMO Dinan offers the best solution for cooling with their tune that increases water pump flow and host of other tweaks to keep the car running reliably strong consistently for longer periods of time w/o overheating coupled with upgraded FMIC and oil cooler.. no limp modes reported for that video of the M3 vs. Dinan 335 performance test

[jeho]

Originally Posted by dlbrooks18

IMO Dinan offers the best solution for cooling with their tune that increases water pump flow and host of other tweaks to keep the car running reliably strong consistently for longer periods of time w/o overheating coupled with upgraded FMIC and oil cooler.. no limp modes reported for that video of the M3 vs. Dinan 335 performance test

I didnt go for the Dinan because 2 members were still getting LIMPS with Dinan at the track. Even with their flash, it still limped at the track WTF?

[dlbrooks18]

^ did they have the Dinan FMIC and oil cooler as well? This is a MUST for tracking purposes..

[jeho]

this car tracks fine without limp modes without a tune, so by adding a dinan flash tune only, you would limp? what good is that alone then? nothing? just daily driving and straight line 1/4 drags?

I hope some company comes out with some upgrades for water cooling soon

[leftcoastman]

Originally Posted by dlbrooks18

+1, totally agree with you. I'm going to say again that a flash is better suited for tracking, and IMO Dinan offers the best solution for cooling with their tune that increases water pump flow and host of other tweaks to keep the car running reliably strong consistently for longer periods of time w/o overheating coupled with upgraded FMIC and oil cooler.. no limp modes reported for that video of the M3 vs. Dinan 335 performance test

Increasing the water pump duty cycle will do absolutely nothing to help high water temps.

When you're pushing 230+ water temps on track, the pump is already running 100%.

The reason why the Dinan doesn't limp on track is that it essentially becomes a stock tune when temps start rising. S4to335 with his Dinan tune couldn't outdrag a stock car.

[leftcoastman]

FYI - what I'm going to try this year is 80% distilled, 20% coolant and a bottle of water wetter. Water is better at dissipating heat than coolant.

Last year, I ran the stock coolant mix (50/50?) and dumped a bottle of water wetter in there. Verified with data logging, this did absolutely nothing.

[jeho]

let us know the results ^

thanks for that info, i was going to try 50/50 with water wetter but i guess thats a no no now

[tinnsoldaten]

Isn`t it only to find a point of the oil/water loop , connect a radiator with fan , add the extra liquid that the extra radiator with hose use ? Basically extend the cooling loop and deploy an extra radiator.

What would happend if one did something like this ? Would it work ? Is it harmful in any way?

But next issue , where could this be installed , where is it room for it?

[leftcoastman]

Originally Posted by tinnsoldaten

Isn`t it only to find a point of the oil/water loop , connect a radiator with fan , add the extra liquid that the extra radiator with hose use ? Basically extend the cooling loop and deploy an extra radiator.

What would happend if one did something like this ? Would it work ? Is it harmful in any way?

But next issue , where could this be installed , where is it room for it?

Would probably work. Your last sentence details the problem.

[rismo]

Thanks for the replies!

The reason that I stated the question, is related to my track experiences, a stock 335 just get's to warm on itself.
Having a tuned 335 on the track is like an early christmas with all the warning lights on the dash.

Besides that, the first thing BMW did, was not improving the oil cooler (which is high on my todo list) but the water cooling.

So from there, to get this car really trackable, after proper tyres and suspension, cooling the car would the next thing to do, even before tuning the engine.
The idea of tinnsoldaten, extending the water loop with a radiator and maybe an additional fan would probably lower the water temp/ keeping it longer "less warm".
I believe BMW also introduced a new water pump.
But what I know from water and pumps (I should as Im from Holland :-)) is that the volume / amount of water does not matter to the pump. So extending the circuit would
at least keep the car longer away from overheating.....

[rismo]

Originally Posted by leftcoastman

Would probably work. Your last sentence details the problem.

You have space in the front of the car near to the drivers position.

The oil radiator is on the same spot but at the passenger side.

If you extend your oil circuit, they also put the additional radiator near to the drivers side at the front wheel.

[tinnsoldaten]

I was thinking of the area behind front fender , where some install their cold air intake , front of wheel , driver side.

Or just simply mount radiators to underside of hood , install some CF grill of some sort to let heat out. Would involve some long routing of hoses though....

[leftcoastman]

I see the driver's side "OC location" as working. I guess I don't see it making much of an impact, given the size. I would rather put a thicker radiator in the stock location. THere's a company out of Australia that sells it already. Don't have link handy, though.

If you mess with driver's side OC location, just make sure the brake cooling isn't compromised. If you start running Rcomps and race pads, you will start begging for more brake cooling.

[dlbrooks18]

Originally Posted by J86

this car tracks fine without limp modes without a tune, so by adding a dinan flash tune only, you would limp? what good is that alone then? nothing? just daily driving and straight line 1/4 drags?

I hope some company comes out with some upgrades for water cooling soon

Not true, the stock car has issues at the track and will limp if you push it too hard.. running a piggy will only cause limp to occur a lot sooner. That being said, a Dinan flashed car can still limp but less likely if you have upgraded FMIC and oil cooler, but limp isn't all bad, would you rather blow your engine?

Agreed that more upgrades for cooling mods are needed. From what I've read, looks like BMW has this in the works.

[F104]

I wonder if the vented Vorsteiner hood would bring advantages. I still believe the engine bay 'inlet' area thru the radiator / intercooler is much larger then the 'outlet' area. Except for some tiny holes into the wheel wells, and some flow thru the transmission tunnel, I don't see where the hot air goes out which must adversly affect airflow thru radiator and IC, fan running or not.
Some large vents in the hood could significantly improve airflow

[stressdoc]

We will see the details of what BMW's solution is shortly. I am curious about the change in the fan and where they put the additional radiator.