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BMW 1-series M vs Porsche Cayman R video review
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05-27-2011, 07:38 AM | #2 |
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I still don't understand all these comparisons involving the Cayman R. Just because it's a performance car introduced within roughly the same period doesn't mean you should be drawing up comparisons.
Let's see: on one hand, we've got the 1M; a four seater, front-engined sports coupe. On the other, a two-seater, mid-engined sports car that costs (according to Sutcliffe in the vid) 12k pounds more. Hardly a comparison if you ask me, but I'm sure it was made due to the circumstances of these cars' time of introduction. Give me the Cayman R any day of the week if we're forgoing practicality.
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05-27-2011, 08:16 AM | #3 |
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Is it unfair to compare it with the Cayman R? Yes and No.
Yes because the two cars aren't direct rivals to each other, not in a month of Sundays would anyone cross shop these two cars, that and the fact that one is a proper performance coupe that has been taken a step closer to a trackday tool. But here is where the No comes into play, the very fact that the 1M is being compared continuously with this car shows that on sheer ability and entertainment it isn't that far off, yes it's controls don't feel quite as percise, yes it's not quite as polished a performer but it's bloody close and for a fraction of the price. On sheer looks alone I reckon BMW have hit the nail on the head with what they want it's perception to be, i.e. a mean little fu@ker that you don't want to mess with. It's engine/exhaust note doesn't live up to the way it looks, though an aftermarket exhaust will probably help here but it's a shame it's an extra expense that really needs to be allowed for. The only niggle about the 1M in my opinion and was part of Steve's opening comments was that it's scary to drive quick and that you need to know what you are doing or in other words it will take no prisoners if you over step the mark. Because of this fact there will be many who will love to own this car though won't necessarily have the ability to drive it properly. Bodyshops the world over with do a roaring trade because of this. |
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05-27-2011, 08:23 AM | #4 |
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^ The fact of the matter is that many on here could probably not handle a Corolla at it's limits much less a 1M.
It seems so much weight is put on 0-60 and 1/4 mile times just to brag at the gym or what not. Not so many "drivers" on here as straight line numbers nuts. Whatever rocks your dingy.
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05-27-2011, 02:54 PM | #5 | |
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Last edited by Robert; 05-27-2011 at 03:20 PM.. |
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05-27-2011, 04:24 PM | #6 | |
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The number of d1cks that feel this is the car for them because they have some misguided belief they can drive with probably learn very quickly and expensively that they made the wrong choice and will either end up getting rid or driving less aggressively. |
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05-27-2011, 04:39 PM | #7 | |
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1.) I think the 1//M is a closer competitor to the Cayman R than you and others acknowledge. In the United States in particular, the price difference is ~$15,000 more (approximately the same price as an E92 M3) for the Cayman R. Also, the 1//M is arguably set up the best for the track out of all the //M cars - it's relatively light on frills, bells and whistles in comparison to the M3 and the old M5. 15 grand is not a small pocket of change, but it certainly places the car in the mind of a car shopper, particularly when both cars have a similar purpose (and similar power output, for that matter!) 2.) Despite the video, I think the 1//M would be far easier to drive than the Cayman R. I don't have a great deal of experience at the wheel of a mid or rear-engined vehicle, but I'd imagine that a front-engined, rear wheel drive car is far easier to maintain close to the limit than the former two options. Just seeing all the Youtube videos of porsches encountering lift-off oversteer is enough to convince me of this! |
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05-27-2011, 05:27 PM | #9 | |
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If you take a look from a different perspective which is if I am ready to drop 70-80k, wouldn't I cross shop with a GTR and Vette more than 1M? The lens everyone looks through here is I want a 1M now lets justify why it is a better buy than others.
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05-27-2011, 05:29 PM | #10 | ||
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Not knocking the 1M because I really love the look of this thing, I am finding it to be far more desirable than the M3 I use to own and can bet you that if this had been around at the time then I doubt I would have bought the big brother. But after having an M car I having final got owning one out of my system I doubt I'll be back any time soon. That is unless they final offer awd as an option, only then will I have another look. |
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05-27-2011, 08:18 PM | #11 |
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Footie and Shift:
It seems that I had a few misconceptions about the drivability of a mid-engined sports car. I always knew that the mid-engined setup would be quicker, but I imagined it would be harder to drive at the limit - it's comforting to hear this is not the case. Also, do note that I am NOT questioning the performance ability of the Cayman. I would at the drop of a hat take a Cayman R over the 1//M, it's not even up for debate in my mind. I just hope that Porsche sticks with a large lineup of naturally aspirated engines - although that is wishful thinking. Footie, I wonder if the complaints that reviewers have about the 1//M stems from the aggressive torque curve? BMW likes to tout that the engine delivers near-maximum torque at very low RPMs, and I wonder if this contributes to its instability in comparison to the M3. It's very disappointing in my mind, given how easily the M3 can be driven to its limits. I always thought this had to do with the suspension and tire setup in an M3 being set up for slight understeer - but perhaps I was wrong. |
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05-27-2011, 10:29 PM | #12 |
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The 1M's twitchiness is more likely attributable to its short wheel base and high levels of grip. Smaller (shorter) RWD platforms tend to be snappier at the limit. With as much underrated power as the 1M is making (dynoed 330+ rwhp and 360+ rwtq), there's no doubt that you'd have to understand how to drive in order to have fun. I think I'd appreciate it that much more, although it's worth mentioning that I'm a fan of ridiculous tail-out antics over outright laptimes.
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05-28-2011, 04:39 AM | #13 | |
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Autocar's answer to the Cayman R vs 1M comparison
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And you know what, it is and it shows that BMW's decision to switch to FI didn't dull the experience one bit, neither did using a non dedicated M engine. What's important is offering the driving experience through the seat of the pants that defines an M car. Well done BMW. |
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05-28-2011, 03:28 PM | #14 |
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what an idiot. its a fucking Porsche, doesnt matter if its an 1m or M3 or M5 a Porsche is a Porsche its different then any other car. stupid video. id rather see the 1m go against a e92 M3
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05-28-2011, 06:46 PM | #15 |
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Calling Steve an idiot makes you sound like an ignoramus.
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05-28-2011, 07:14 PM | #16 |
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Not a Porsche fan at all unless it has a V10.
Thats why I love the 1M.. Way more practicality. Porsche=Overpriced (They are great cars but not my cup of tea.)
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05-28-2011, 09:18 PM | #17 | |
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IMO I don't think Porsche is overpriced at all, just some of their options are a little too expensive for what you get. But at the end of the day, it is a porsche you're dealing with. What IS overpriced though are the AMG models (CL, SL, and S class in particular).. ie - the CL 65 is $207,000... Oh and I absolutely love the Cayman R and I don't think the 1M is even close in comparison. To me the 1M is a 135i with a widebody, the performance power kit, and M3 suspension bits retrofitted to it. I should also let it be known that I would take a N/A engine over a boosted one any day of the week, so I may be a little biased even though I own a 335i
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05-29-2011, 12:07 AM | #18 | |
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You are the biggest hypocrite on this forum. WOW.. You drive a 335i Hey by the way start looking at new performance cars that are coming out, N/A engines are not the way to go anymore. The power and MPGs you get from a turbo is great! I was not trying to be mean.. Ps- u car looks great. My friend had a Porsche turbo (vert) and Now he has a CL 550. The CL AMG its a TT V12 pushing over 600HP for 200K. ONE HELL OF A DEAL.. If you think thats overpriced I would hate to hear what you think a Zonda is priced at.. Thats one hell of a deal (A TT V12 GOD might as well hand over the throne to u)
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"Speed never killed anyone its very important to get that straight, Speed has never killed a soul. Suddenly becoming stationary thats what gets people." - Jeremy Clarkson Last edited by NewYearsBoy; 05-29-2011 at 12:19 AM.. |
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05-29-2011, 12:19 AM | #19 |
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You could say most P-cars are overpriced simply based on the manufactuer's profit margins. They could easily afford to lower their prices a good bit. Then again, you're paying for nearly unmatched lvels of prestige and build quality. They're not unfairly priced, but their pricing strategy allows them to nickel and dime you to death, but that's at the consumer's hands as to how far they want to dip into their wallets.
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05-29-2011, 12:28 AM | #20 | |
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"Speed never killed anyone its very important to get that straight, Speed has never killed a soul. Suddenly becoming stationary thats what gets people." - Jeremy Clarkson |
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05-29-2011, 12:42 AM | #21 |
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If you feel Porsches are over priced then what must you not think of Ferarris. Afterall they offer not real performance advantage over Porsche yet cost a packet in comparison and are less reliable to boot.
Sorry for not understanding your logic, the CGT offers no performance enchancement over the GT2RS yet cost how much more. It seems that at times you champion value over image/prestige/status and yet your only Porsche that's worthy in your opinion is the most overpriced of them all. In a word ...... confused am I. |
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05-29-2011, 01:00 AM | #22 | |
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Forget the CGT.. Just a Porsche I like. But you get so much more from a Ferrari thats why they cost so much more. Look at the Top Gear times.. Also I am more of a day to day driver, I very rarely get to hit the track unless I am Invited. I like the CGT because of the # of them, The engine of course...(WOW WHAT A SOUND) and the design. I just feel every time I look at a Porsche and see the price I say "Damn for that price I could have ________" Hell I saw this today and got excited..
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