[s.myrr]

[Kongen71]

This thread is a disgrace to the tuning community – what a shame. Like me I guess 90% have no clue what you are talking about throwing technical statements around. On top of that it seems personally attacking each other is the best way of defense in most cases.

Focus on your own product and stop throwing mud at the competition – it’s sickening. We are all adults and will base our decisions individually on what we believe is right. State the facts and leave personal experience to the customer.

Like most on this forum I guess I’m excited about the next item on my bucket list – reading, researching and comparing until I finally make my decision and hit the “purchase” button makes my heart pound - just like standing next to a long time waiting challenge at the red light waiting for green (like I did yesterday SL55AMG and 996-4s – won against both btw ). Nothing beats that feeling.

Reading this thread totally destroys that fun – what a shame

Sorry for my English – it’s not my first language.

[ducati955]

Originally Posted by Kongen71

This thread is a disgrace to the tuning community – what a shame. Like me I guess 90% have no clue what you are talking about throwing technical statements around. On top of that it seems personally attacking each other is the best way of defense in most cases.

Focus on your own product and stop throwing mud at the competition – it’s sickening. We are all adults and will base our decisions individually on what we believe is right. State the facts and leave personal experience to the customer.

Like most on this forum I guess I’m excited about the next item on my bucket list – reading, researching and comparing until I finally make my decision and hit the “purchase” button makes my heart pound - just like standing next to a long time waiting challenge at the red light waiting for green (like I did yesterday SL55AMG and 996-4s – won against both btw ). Nothing beats that feeling.

Reading this thread totally destroys that fun – what a shame

Sorry for my English – it’s not my first language.

i agree, what tune do u have bro?

[CT_335i]

Originally Posted by Kongen71

On top of that it seems personally attacking each other is the best way of defense in most cases.

I do agree a little, but all of us here who are new to the 335i benefit when the older forum members who understand the history of the tunes post a little.

From my standpoint, tuning your own car is not something to be taken lightly. Cost really should not be an issue but the reliability/safety of the tune is key. Since the tunes are not OEM and do not undergo the rigorous statistical testing to understand the limits and issues, getting said tunes is risky.

When a salesperson sells products such as these, he/she better understand the product well. Throwing out terms that cause confusion (not because we as a collective lack intelligence but because we don't work in the performance car business) is misleading and doing a disservice to the customer.

We sometimes equate the use of these terms as 'knowledge' since we don't know better (See Madoff and all other Ponzi schemes). The persons who posted highlighted that they would prefer Terry to answer (which I agree) vs. Mike and highlighted no real ill malice towards the JB tune. I think that's good for us all and I support their actions.

[wonsungnabi]

Originally Posted by Kongen71

Focus on your own product and stop throwing mud at the competition – it’s sickening. We are all adults and will base our decisions individually on what we believe is right. State the facts and leave personal experience to the customer.

+ 100000000

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by Ilma

You guy's need to be careful about trying to tell Mike he is incompetent to be arguing at this level.

I posted yesterday about his failure to wire up a simple plug & play harness for me and this is how he responded:


"Whats your issue

I don't get the personal attack. I have done nothing but help you and you post this crap? First I am hearing of a wiring issue. If I miswired something why wouldn't you tell me but bring it up a year and a half later?

You really are unbelievable.

Mike"

I do understand how he feels about me for posting these things, but the point is it's time to give up this facade of pretending. That is why I am sharing my experiences. I find it completely incredible that someone who makes fundamental wiring mistakes and has to be told that the BT tool can only log stock boost levels, can then turn around and argue on these forums at the levels of an experienced programmer/tuner.

Those who know Mike, know that he does not have the depth of knowledge nor the background of a trained engineer or a tuner.

That is what my problem is.

I would much prefer that E90 reinstate Terry and let him debate directly rather than going through a proxy like Mike who obviously is not always Mike.

Classy like always Don..

Mike

[Kongen71]

Originally Posted by CT_335i

I do agree a little, but all of us here who are new to the 335i benefit when the older forum members who understand the history of the tunes post a little.

From my standpoint, tuning your own car is not something to be taken lightly. Cost really should not be an issue but the reliability/safety of the tune is key. Since the tunes are not OEM and do not undergo the rigorous statistical testing to understand the limits and issues, getting said tunes is risky.

When a salesperson sells products such as these, he/she better understand the product well. Throwing out terms that cause confusion (not because we as a collective lack intelligence but because we don't work in the performance car business) is misleading and doing a disservice to the customer.

We sometimes equate the use of these terms as 'knowledge' since we don't know better (See Madoff and all other Ponzi schemes). The persons who posted highlighted that they would prefer Terry to answer (which I agree) vs. Mike and highlighted no real ill malice towards the JB tune. I think that's good for us all and I support their actions.

I agree with you and when it comes to selecting my next mod I rely more on the members feedback than the vendors. After selecting which way to go I'll rely on the vendor for technical support.

I also think it would benifit all on this forum if Terry would answer questions about he's own tune - ridiculous he needs to do it through third person. If just people would stop getting so personal

[Ilma]

Well I am quite willing to apologize to those who find my posts offensive, including of course Mike.

Like I said, I do understand how he feels, and I would feel the same way.

But he is different from the rest of us in that he is a vendor selling a competing product and as someone mentioned above, he bears the burden of credibility, whereas I am just a noob trying to understand these things like most of us here.

But I can't ignore my experiences with the BMS team and I can't say that I like the way they perpetuate this facade via Mike.

I know he means well, but I just don't feel it serves anyones interest to have a vendor with an enthusiasts background only, debating as if he is a tuner/engineer.

I have been following various aspects of these tunes for over a couple of years and the timing issue is still pretty fuzzy to me.

It would be nice to have some clarity and simplification rather than the market share protection agendas that the tuners engage in.

I thnk both sides have pieces of the puzzle and are right/wrong about certain aspects.

But I also know that is never going to happen with the vendors.

Which is why I try to learn things for myself and look to some of the obviously more informed members on here like Scalbert and a few others who obviously have solid backgrounds and qualifications........and others who obviously build engines for a living.

It's actually more about credibility than personality.

After all, if you needed surgery, would you go to a used car salesman?

[EDM92]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

Classy like always Don..

Mike

[fisherbln]

Wow, this thread went downhill fast. IBTL.

[cstavaru]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Not sure why mike is posting videos of a product that isn't yet available. And what's the point of showing timing advance without the ability to change it?

...the same point as showing the EGTs, for example ?

[AltecBX]

EGT & IAT are temp readings. You can't change those unless you add intercooler or methanol.

[EastCoast335i]

Originally Posted by ma1kmcn1

Nothing wants to make me buy a Procede or JB3 less than watching you two bicker back and forth like a couple of three year olds. What ever happened to professionalism?

Obviously that goes out the door when money is involved...

[CT_335i]

Originally Posted by scalbert

To all others. Terry (aka BMS) queried Shiv on the parameters of the original PROcede starting back in May of 2007 and even scoped a PROcede customer car to determine the resistor values in the fueling components. To the point of using the exact same resistors even though the ratio is just needed, not the actual values. Hence, the JB1 was born on or near July of 2007 with the JB2 coming out shortly thereafter. I would say that by most accounts, that is three years and not four. Point being, rounding should be done correctly.

There is more to the story but I don't care to go into it.

Read the above. This explains why both tuners get into a spat in threads.

Think about how you would feel if you were Vishnu.

Now think about where you want to be as a customer. Clearly one camp has more knowledge than the other, no?

Scalbert, thanks for this nugget of history.

If someone can refute this story, please step up.

[wtfmateim65]

Dear BMS,
please actively adjust my timing as my JB3 injects steroids into my car.

I wish we could've just had Cobb Accessports for our cars, so much easier.

[Forcefed3]

Originally Posted by BrianMN

By the look of the well-educated people's posts above, it doesn't seem so stupid does it?

Can you read? I said i LIKE my jb3. But BOTH jb3 and procede are great. Get your shit straight and come with a new answer.

[scrufy]

Where the hell is the popcorn icon when you need it?

The problem with Fanbois is you never get real information... Really pathetic as they dont understand the technology they have so their insecurity is more pronounced as they bow down to their favored vendor. just my opinion...
AND KUDOS TO kongen71 !