[Super Nova]

Hey guys,

As some of you may or not know I was in an accident at Miller Motorsport Park in Utah on May 19th at an open track day that has resulted in my car (my beautiful BMW Dinan stage 2 2007 335i crimson red coupe) being totalled.

As if this was not traumatic enough, State Farm as of yesterday has denied my claim due to a tiny policy exclusion involving high speed driving in my policy. The worst part is that my agent, who I've worked with and trusted for 7 years has thrown me under the bus by claiming we never spoke about my track driving events before I did them.

The fact is, I called him in the spring each year for the past three and specifically asked him about doing driving schools and open track days and every single time he read the policy and said to me I was fine as long as I wasn't racing, competing or time trailing of any kind. Now that the shit has hit the fan and his bosses have come asking, he's saying we never had those conversations in order to save his own ass. Even though every time I said "Are you sure? I'm willing to buy additional coverage if need be." He always said "No. You're covered."

I don't know what to do. I've contacted a lawyer who handles these kinds of cases but I'm afraid I'm just not that hopeful. I'll fight it as best I can. We haven't spoken about the specifics of the case yet, but I feel utterly despondant boys. It sucks being stabbed in the back like this.

Any ideas or help would be very welcome.

On the positive, I wasn't injured at all (except for a small powder burn on my right thumb from the airbag). I'm looking to get a used BMW motorcycle in the meantime.

Attached below is the pdf of my policy and the exclusion (19b) in question. Sorry it's upside down!

My only hope is that "high speed" is vague enough to fight.

Hope you're all having a good summer so far...better than mine anyways...

Jim

[Big Windy]

Jim,

Wow, man. That is a terrible story. Glad you are okay, but sounds like State Farm is raping you hard core. "Lawyering up" is the best thing that you can do at this point and have them help you to fight the loop holes. Keep us posted. Sorry I can't offer any good advice...

[MDCTFTW]

Usually insurance doesn't cover things like auto crosses and track days do they? I don't think you'll win in court.

[LOLrance]

Sorry to hear about your situation. Keep us posted on what happens. I happen to be covered by State Farm as well and my agent assured me multiple times that HPDE's are covered. He said that as long as it is not a Timed event or any type of Competitive Racing then i will be fine.

Originally Posted by MDCTFTW

Usually insurance doesn't cover things like auto crosses and track days do they? I don't think you'll win in court.

[judec]

well, sorry to hear about your situation. bad news is that the exclusion in 19b imo really applies to your collision.
"...ON A TRACK DESIGNED PRIMARILY FOR RACING OR HIGH SPEED DRIVING. This exclusion does not apply if the vehicle is being used in a connection with an activity other than racing, high speed driving, or any type of competitive driving."

The fact is that Miller Motorsport Park in Utah is actually a track designed for racing or high speed driving and your activity actually is in a connection with high speed driving. E.g. HPDE is an abbrev. of High Performance Driving Event and while anyone could argument that he's attending the events for the sake of improving his driving skills for increased on-road safety, there is little to no chance of not qualifying it as high speed driving.

The other thing is that your agent possibly intentionally misleaded U (even if I dont understand why, as he could get extra money from your additional coverage fee). But this will be difficult to prove and he will be possibly lying in front of the judge, too.

[TurboFan]

I thought you were there for a defensive driving / car control class? That's not racing or competitive driving, and high-speed is very subjective.

[S4to335]

This is one reason Audi Club calls these events "Driver Safety Seminars", and does the car control skills at the event.

[Big Windy]

Originally Posted by judec

The other thing is that your agent possibly intentionally misleaded U (even if I dont understand why, as he could get extra money from your additional coverage fee). But this will be difficult to prove and he will be possibly lying in front of the judge, too.

impossible to prove unless you have tape recorded conversations.

[Gearhead999s]

I know that in Canada cars have been covered by their road insurance if it is a "Driver education " event with proper qualified instructors.If it is just a lapping day or a Solo type event you do not have any coverage.However that being said a friend on mine who destroyed his Ducati at a track day where there was no instruction believes that his road insurance will cover the bike and his agent is working on his behalf as it was stated in the rules that it was a non racing day.It will be interesting to watch.
The way that I look at it if I turf my car on track,it will be on my nickel and I do not have a problem accepting that.

[leftcoastman]

Wow man - I'm sorry to hear that the insurance agent turned on you like that. Trust but verify.

That said, I think you're in decent shape. Lawyer up, it's a gamble that would likely be worth it. The rule is vague and generally when rules/exclusions are vague, they are construed against the one who wrote them.

[lucid]

Sorry man. This blows. Let us know what your lawyer thinks.

I have insurance via Amica, and when I inquired about this, they went crazy, and instead of simply answering my question on the phone, sent me a long official letter claiming I would not be covered. Whenever I call for any policy issue, the person usually goes, "is this the car used in races"? And I go, "what the fuck are you talking about? I've never raced the car and never will..." This means they placed some kind of marker on my records. I am actually thinking about changing companies once the current policy expires as I am concerned they might try to somehow use this against me even for a regular claim related to street driving.

I don't have a ton of track experience, and tend to push things harder than I should (although I've managed to take it easy on the E92 M3 so far), so I am actually actively looking for an E36 M3 I can use as a track car so that I wouldn't mind if it was totalled on the track...

[gadget]

This is terrible.

Lesson learned- always get confirmtaion in writting.

Best of luck.

[sg335]

Sorry to hear about this situation. You probably have little to fight with as you were not attending a driver's education event, but only registered for an open track event without instruction and supervision. This is a good reason to drive with the BMWCCA as their DE events are instrctional and people who have had incidents actually have gotten coverage from their insurance companies.

How did the accident happen? It would be helpful to understand what went wrong so others can avoid your mistake.

[BRDHNTR]

Originally Posted by sg335

Sorry to hear about this situation. You probably have little to fight with as you were not attending a driver's education event, but only registered for an open track event without instruction and supervision. This is a good reason to drive with the BMWCCA as their DE events are instrctional and people who have had incidents actually have gotten coverage from their insurance companies.

How did the accident happen? It would be helpful to understand what went wrong so others can avoid your mistake.

+1

Good Luck

[sayemthree]

I would say if it was clearly a driving school with in car and classroom instruction you may have an arguement - if it was a open lapping day then you are likely screwed.

[BMWdrmz]

Originally Posted by sayemthree

I would say if it was clearly a driving school with in car and classroom instruction you may have an arguement - if it was a open lapping day then you are likely screwed.

Even then its still hard to argue. Ive heard of cases where its starts to get into the merits of the class room instruction. If the point of the instruction is to teach you the fastest way around the track and increasing your limits as a driver then you'll probably loose (so I heard). However, its really teaching you car control and driver skill in various situations and conditions in a closed course environment that happens to be a race track, then you may have a chance. I think thats why BMWCCA and others like Audi Club tend to focus their classroom sessions on techniques for car control and put a lot of effort in their classrooms to make them like seminars. I even noticed that the BMWCCA actually has instructors for all driver groups including advance, and they put you into siyuations to apply what you learned in the classroom.
I have no direct experience with this, but the above is what I've been able to gather from other people I've encountered that have gone through this situation. Easiest thing to do is buy a motorsport policy for HPDEs or buy a dedicated track car that you don't mind totalling. Good luck

[sg335]

details please...

[BMWdrmz]

Originally Posted by sg335

details please...

on which topic. The HPDE insurance or the stuff I've heard from other people who wrecked their cars on track. If its the first, check out WSIB Motorsport Insurance. They have a really good program and offer a pretty comprehensive coverage. Be aware they are a wholesaler. There are some advantages when buying a policy through a wholesaler and some disadvantages. You should research both and draw conclusions based on your needs. There a couple of other people around here that have a policy through them.

[darkphantom]

wow, sorry to hear this. Like aforementioned, why not say you were taking a defensive driving course...?

[sg335]

Super Nova's crash details...

[nicknaz]

sorry to hear about this man. get a good lawyer?

[Super Nova]

I'm working on it... Thanks for the support fellas... I'll keep you posted.