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      01-19-2012, 06:58 AM   #331
Orion4
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Don't hold your breath for a constructive response from "Mr RealDeal".
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      01-19-2012, 07:04 AM   #332
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i keep checking e90post for updates

very curious how this turns out as I like David vs Goliath stories too.

You have our support Arguru
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Originally Posted by Orion4
Don't hold your breath for a constructive response from "Mr RealDeal"
+1

we can probably expect more rhetoric, name calling, and threats. Real class act if you ask me.

lets see what happens since it seems the pot has been stirred.

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      01-19-2012, 07:56 AM   #333
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[QUOTE=arguru;11178260]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post

Hey Leaker,

The car is in my garage. I've been using it as now that it's been PROPERLY diagnosed and fixed by a competitor BMW dealership.
Then whats with the big battle?
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      01-19-2012, 08:07 AM   #334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post

Then whats with the big battle?


cliffs:

wants Penske/BMW NA to be accountable for their actions, in this case, inaction

Last edited by MDyDinanM; 01-19-2012 at 08:20 AM..
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      01-19-2012, 08:37 AM   #335
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I'm calling it now - some day this will be a case study in an MBA program on how NOT to handle a customer/product issue in the new world of social media:

-In just over a month, this has almost 40,000 views - if I had to venture a guess, it is probably one of the fastest growing threads on E90post ever.

-Tons of views on jalopnik and other cross posted/shared sites.

-It will forever be accessible in google (and likely be pretty high ranking in search engines).

There are times as a company when it is best to let an insignificant social media post go and ignore it - often they will go away after a small bang. This is not one of those times. As another poster mentioned above - social media has taken down governments and large corporations before - I'm not saying that is going to happen here, but sheesh, they need to stop the hemorrhaging.

In the end, you can use situations like this to solidify customers or drive them away. I had an issue with my E46 that my dealer tried to ignore and told me to live with - BMWNA stepped in and took good care of me. I'm now in my third BMW in 9 years - BMWNA won me over with the way they handled it. But if I didn't know how BMW treated me and instead came across this thread - I'd be nervous to buy one, particularly from Penske...

Rich
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      01-19-2012, 08:57 AM   #336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdyaman View Post


cliffs:

wants Penske/BMW NA to be accountable for their actions, in this case, inaction

I've followed from the beginning....when he said all he wanted was his car fixed. Fighting the good fight? Gimme a break.

Quote:
Originally Posted by richpike View Post
I'm calling it now - some day this will be a case study in an MBA program on how NOT to handle a customer/product issue in the new world of social media:

-In just over a month, this has almost 40,000 views - if I had to venture a guess, it is probably one of the fastest growing threads on E90post ever.

-Tons of views on jalopnik and other cross posted/shared sites.

-It will forever be accessible in google (and likely be pretty high ranking in search engines).

There are times as a company when it is best to let an insignificant social media post go and ignore it - often they will go away after a small bang. This is not one of those times. As another poster mentioned above - social media has taken down governments and large corporations before - I'm not saying that is going to happen here, but sheesh, they need to stop the hemorrhaging.

In the end, you can use situations like this to solidify customers or drive them away. I had an issue with my E46 that my dealer tried to ignore and told me to live with - BMWNA stepped in and took good care of me. I'm now in my third BMW in 9 years - BMWNA won me over with the way they handled it. But if I didn't know how BMW treated me and instead came across this thread - I'd be nervous to buy one, particularly from Penske...

Rich
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad he got his car fixed, but from what I read this entire thread is based on a mistake reading codes and then a discussion/argument that ensued that nobody (from here) witnessed but the OP. He seemed calm in the beginning but got progressively more angry. Maybe he misinterpreted Penske managers comments, maybe he lost it on the guy. None of us were there. BMW and all dealerships are in the business of making people happy. If they don't they will go out of business. Simple. There are always going to be mistakes made and differing of opinions. All I am saying to all of you that are jumping on this "take down BMW and Penske" bandwagon is that there are always 3 sides to every story....his , theirs and the truth.
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      01-19-2012, 09:19 AM   #337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad he got his car fixed, but from what I read this entire thread is based on a mistake reading codes and then a discussion/argument that ensued that nobody (from here) witnessed but the OP. He seemed calm in the beginning but got progressively more angry. Maybe he misinterpreted Penske managers comments, maybe he lost it on the guy. None of us were there. BMW and all dealerships are in the business of making people happy. If they don't they will go out of business. Simple. There are always going to be mistakes made and differing of opinions. All I am saying to all of you that are jumping on this "take down BMW and Penske" bandwagon is that there are always 3 sides to every story....his , theirs and the truth.
I agree with that to a certain extent, but I would add that they want to meet their customers requirements and make them happy so long as it is profitable.

That said, in terms of making people happy, here is another story of an abused BMW customer:

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...16-months.html

and its corresponding Jalopnik article:

http://jalopnik.com/5628903/bmw-deal...ner-out-of-27k

Cliffs: Dealer took car for joyride during an oil change, totaled the car, lied about what happened, dealer or BMW NA wouldn't help. Owner took it to court and won. Owner will never buy another BMW again b/C of the way he was treated.
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      01-19-2012, 09:34 AM   #338
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The car is fixed. You paid a deductible under CPO. You got a receipt. You said all you wanted was an explanation of what was broke right ? That should spell it out. Post that receipt. Either I missed the armchair diag and owe you a set of wheels, or you are humming this whole board. Post the receipt, the emails from BMW or admit your little extortion scheme snowballed on you. I'm in AZ, working at an indy. I'll meet you at the shop of your choice and pay cash for your wheels if I'm wrong. My money is where my mouth is. Is yours?
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      01-19-2012, 09:48 AM   #339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post
He seemed calm in the beginning but got progressively more angry. Maybe he misinterpreted Penske managers comments, maybe he lost it on the guy. None of us were there. BMW and all dealerships are in the business of making people happy. If they don't they will go out of business. Simple.
progressively angry!!! dude he demonstrated a lot of patience... I'm flabbergasted at the notion that OP wasnt patient enough.

And which world are you living in... seriously? There is no company in the world which is in the business of "making people happy". Its all driven by bottom line ($)... every engineering decision is dictated by the "cost" associated with it. Its implementation depends upon the probability of causing a serious accident and then settling it versus the cost of engineering the fix in all cars impacted.
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      01-19-2012, 09:52 AM   #340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TherealdealBMW View Post
The car is fixed. You paid a deductible under CPO. You got a receipt.
since you're so intimately involved and aware of all the details, why dont you first tell us who you're... DICK ....
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      01-19-2012, 09:59 AM   #341
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[QUOTE=arguru;11178260]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post

Hey Leaker,

The car is in my garage. I've been using it as now that it's been PROPERLY diagnosed and fixed by a competitor BMW dealership.
sooooooo....what was the problem with it??? hello, talk about burying the lead!
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      01-19-2012, 10:29 AM   #342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TherealdealBMW View Post
The car is fixed. You paid a deductible under CPO. You got a receipt. You said all you wanted was an explanation of what was broke right ? That should spell it out. Post that receipt. Either I missed the armchair diag and owe you a set of wheels, or you are humming this whole board. Post the receipt, the emails from BMW or admit your little extortion scheme snowballed on you. I'm in AZ, working at an indy. I'll meet you at the shop of your choice and pay cash for your wheels if I'm wrong. My money is where my mouth is. Is yours?

Last edited by MDyDinanM; 01-19-2012 at 04:23 PM..
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      01-19-2012, 10:30 AM   #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post
there are always 3 sides to every story....his , theirs and the truth.
I totally agree with you on this. My point is BMW/Penske has let this get WAY out of hand - there is a lesson there for other businesses on how to react to customer/product issues in social media - what they have done so far is not the right answer. Interestingly, in my experience they still have an opportunity to right the ship - we'll see what happens!

-Rich
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      01-19-2012, 11:31 AM   #344
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Never buying a car from any Penske dealer or letting anyone I know.
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      01-19-2012, 11:34 AM   #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bavarian13 View Post
Never buying a car from any Penske dealer or letting anyone I know.
+1
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      01-19-2012, 11:42 AM   #346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bavarian13 View Post
Never buying a car from any Penske dealer or letting anyone I know.
+2
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      01-19-2012, 11:42 AM   #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arguru
Hey Leaker,

The car is in my garage. I've been using it as now that it's been PROPERLY diagnosed and fixed by a competitor BMW dealership.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MM328i
sooooooo....what was the problem with it??? hello, talk about burying the lead!
No kidding. Arguru post what was broken and what the dealer fixed. If you do not I will assume that there was nothing wrong with the steering and you are just looking for $$.
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      01-19-2012, 11:44 AM   #348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjg View Post
No kidding. Arguru post what was broken and what the dealer fixed. If you do not I will assume that there was nothing wrong with the steering and you are just looking for $$.
if he was looking for money, he would have filed a lawsuit already or started that process. So far it doesn't seem that he has, at least none that has announced.

Second is that perhaps Arguru is still trying to determine what went wrong, and get an explanation from Penske/BMW NA (especially since Penske didn't diagnose his car correctly). Despite his car being fixed, I think so far he hasn't got that info, hence another one of his points in this thread.

or maybe i missed something?
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      01-19-2012, 11:49 AM   #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardJones View Post
Yes. This makes perfect sense to me and I don't understand why anyone would have a problem with it. It's a question that a few people have asked both here and in other forums but that I hadn't seen answered yet. In any situation where you have a problem, in order to resolve it you have to know what you want to happen to resolve it. There was much talk of the problem but it wasn't clear to me exactly what arguru actually wanted, so I asked specifically what it was. You seem to be implying that asking what to me is the most obvious, logical and relevant question is wrong in some way. Can you explain why it's wrong? Yes, it's a fact. You have a problem, you post it in a forum, people get angry about it and set out to post it to more forums to give it higher visibility. They literally "set out to publicise a problem by posting it on various sites on the Internet". It's happened a thousand times before and it will happen a thousand times again. As a result you will definitely get higher visibility of the problem (assuming it's something that resonates with people) and as a result of that you will definitely get more people coming along and reading the original posting of the problem and you will also get more people commenting on it. You seem to be implying that by pointing out this obvious fact that you must already know for yourself that I'm doing something wrong. Can you explain what is wrong with it?
Actually no. I definitely didn't question his credibility based on the fact that he found my post suspicious. I questioned his reasoning because he concluded that I was something I'm not based on such ludicrous evidence. Those are two very different things. One is suspicion of something: that it might be. The other is a firm conclusion that it is. You illustrated the difference quite well here...
  • matrix76 thought I sounded like a rep for BMWNA. That is suspicion.
  • You and darebornsolja thought it was getting interesting. That is suspicion
  • arguru immediately concluded that I was "cough cough BMW/Penske". That is not suspicion, it's a firm conclusion. Given that I already know I'm not BMW/Penske, I already know for an absolute and undeniable fact that he is wrong. So now that I know that he can very easily and very quickly draw the wrong conclusion how can I trust the rest of his conclusions to the same degree that I did before?
I'm not sure what you're asking. Do you want my name, my nationality, my age, my country - what exactly do you mean? Note that I've already told you what I'm doing here and that I've actually already done it (I asked a question).
Technically yes. But really I've made one post asking a completely logical question, one posts correcting a false allegation and then one post asking a (very valid and again very logical and obvious) follow up question. I think if you take a step back and think about it a little you'll see that it actually makes a lot of sense for someone to take the time to point out they aren't something that they've been falsely accused of, and then to try and reask the question that was ignored in favour of the false allegation, and then to ask a logical follow on question. It's very possible and quite likely that your natural reaction to this post will be to accuse me of all sorts of things because I took the time to answer your further allegations. Again though, I think if you take a step back and have a think about it you'll see that it's entirely logical for someone to answer questions that you specifically ask them.
The mere fact that you acknowledged and addressed these allegations causes me to believe you are neither BMWNA or Penske. I would like to point out that not once did you ask technical or automotive related questions. You are a 3rd party that represents them.

I'm sorry but why on earth would you not just blow off everyone's claims with a simple, "Here's a pic of my car." "My username on the other forum is X". Also, the time you spent to defend your identity, or hide it for that matter, makes it even more ridiculous. I swear no one I know will buy a Penske ever again. Ever. They're losing business the longer this goes.

I might as well flat out say it. I work in the legal industry, we know you've covered your bases but be careful. The admins of this site can get your email you used to register. I hope you read the user agreement.
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      01-19-2012, 11:51 AM   #350
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Yeah, Arguru, let's hear the problem and solution. Or is that buried somewhere in another post as that caught me by surprise.
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      01-19-2012, 11:51 AM   #351
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdyaman View Post
if he was looking for money, he would have filed a lawsuit already or started that process. So far it doesn't seem that he has, at least none that has announced.
What about arguru posting what the actual problem was. Demand that the facts be posted for all to see. That would be much more helpful than just +1 worthless posts.

Arguru already posted that another dealership fixed the problem. The problem has been fixed, so post what was fixed. Is that too much to ask?
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      01-19-2012, 11:54 AM   #352
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjg View Post
Arguru already posted that another dealership fixed the problem. The problem has been fixed, so post what was fixed. Is that too much to ask?
I think that is what he is still trying to determine and not getting an answer.

Or maybe i missed something?
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