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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis > BMW performance brake system



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      10-25-2014, 08:19 PM   #1
srbarnes4ever
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BMW performance brake system

Is there one for pre LCI E90 335? I saw several sets on getbmwparts.com but all referenced 330, 328 and 323 series...what options are there? I like the gold 6pot calipers and cross drilled brakes.
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      10-26-2014, 05:57 PM   #2
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Try stoptech, bermbo, or wilwood. I believe all three are available in that combo.
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      10-26-2014, 06:06 PM   #3
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I've read from a few sources that the BMW Performance Brake System is just a set of 135i calipers painted gold, says "BMW Performance" on them, and they come with some different rotors. Basically, you'd be saving a lot of money by finding some used or reman'd 135i calipers instead.
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      10-26-2014, 07:03 PM   #4
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when i was a BMW tech i put the bmw performance brake system on a 135i. same exact part number stamped into the calipers. save your money and just find a set of used 135 calipers. they are just painted yellow and say "BMW Perfomance" on them like the other member mentioned.
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      10-26-2014, 08:14 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam View Post
I've read from a few sources that the BMW Performance Brake System is just a set of 135i calipers painted gold, says "BMW Performance" on them, and they come with some different rotors. Basically, you'd be saving a lot of money by finding some used or reman'd 135i calipers instead.
So 135s came with 6 piston front calipers? Will see if I can cross ref part numbers. If the rotors have a BMWW PN that would be nice to have also. They appear to be drilled and slotted and if Bzmzw approved then I am not overly worried about cracks or longevity. Thanks for the intel.
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      10-26-2014, 09:09 PM   #6
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I was told by a BMW master tech that the 135i calipers are straight bolt-on to the 335i.

He suggested getting them if I ever wanted to upgrade as they're 6 piston.
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      10-27-2014, 07:35 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karbon View Post
I was told by a BMW master tech that the 135i calipers are straight bolt-on to the 335i.

He suggested getting them if I ever wanted to upgrade as they're 6 piston.
+1

They will work on all e92 coupes. I was told that they work with 17 inch wheels, but if you have 16 inch winters, you have to be careful and look at offsets and stuff.
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      10-27-2014, 07:53 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srbarnes4ever View Post
So 135s came with 6 piston front calipers? Will see if I can cross ref part numbers. If the rotors have a BMWW PN that would be nice to have also. They appear to be drilled and slotted and if Bzmzw approved then I am not overly worried about cracks or longevity. Thanks for the intel.
Yup, 135s have 6-piston calipers. They're very good. I've heard that the fronts are definitely a direct fit onto the E90, but I don't know about the rears. Something about the parking brake not fitting, which would make sense since the rotors are 1" smaller.
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      10-27-2014, 08:02 AM   #9
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I think reduce rotor size will be a down grade, many people suggest not to do it. Unless you just want the look.
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      10-27-2014, 08:54 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Fred_Boosted View Post
I think reduce rotor size will be a down grade, many people suggest not to do it. Unless you just want the look.
There's a lot of controversy around it, with a lot of opinions. I would like to legitimately have an engineer explain which would be better.

My thought process is this:

A larger rotor does mean greater cooling efficiency and also generally translates to more pad contact, but does the 135i rotor have more pad contact as a whole since the pad is larger than the 335i? My thinking is that, even though the rotor is smaller, there is a larger area being gripped. With the following scenario, keep in mind that extremes are used for comparison purposes only.

Consider riding a skateboard down the street. You want to stop, so you put your foot down on the recently-paved road to drag against it. Think of your foot as a brake pad, and the road as a brake rotor. If I have a massive size 18 shoe pushing down on the pavement, I am going to be increasing the amount of friction being applied. If I have a size 10 shoe of the same rubber compound pushing down on the pavement, I am decreasing the amount of friction being applied. The harder I press down on the shoe, the more of my forward momentum I am converting into heat. The larger the area of the shoe, the better it can distribute heat both around itself and the pavement, and the more grip I am gaining to slow the skateboard down.

There are also other factors as well. Let's say I decide to use a size 14 shoe, but the size 14 shoe has extremely durable 120 grit sandpaper for the sole. I'm going to stop faster than the size 18 shoe made of soft rubber, holding all other factors constant (force applied, pavement condition, etc.).

So, translating this back into vehicle braking force: could I achieve the same stopping power as two pads of the same compound, but one with a larger area, by using a more aggressive pad bedded onto my 335i brakes?

A more aggressive pad bedded onto 335i brakes would be similar to:

- Sandpaper as a sole
- Gritty road conditions

Instead of spending close to $1,000 on a brake set, it sounds like it would be better to just use some different pads.

Is this line of reasoning correct?

Last edited by Welcome to NBA Jam; 10-27-2014 at 09:00 AM..
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      10-27-2014, 09:06 AM   #11
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135 brakes on a 335 is a downgrade. The 135 set up on the front has less brake sweep area than the stock 335 set up. If you want better braking, try different pads with better tires.
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      10-27-2014, 09:50 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam View Post
Consider riding a skateboard down the street. You want to stop, so you put your foot down on the recently-paved road to drag against it. Think of your foot as a brake pad, and the road as a brake rotor. If I have a massive size 18 shoe pushing down on the pavement, I am going to be increasing the amount of friction being applied. If I have a size 10 shoe of the same rubber compound pushing down on the pavement, I am decreasing the amount of friction being applied. The harder I press down on the shoe, the more of my forward momentum I am converting into heat. The larger the area of the shoe, the better it can distribute heat both around itself and the pavement, and the more grip I am gaining to slow the skateboard down.
Don't forget to factor the weight of the person in your example. 4000lbs person with size 10 shoes will definitely require more stopping distant than if he or she is on size 18 shoes.
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      10-27-2014, 10:14 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam View Post
There's a lot of controversy around it, with a lot of opinions. I would like to legitimately have an engineer explain which would be better.

My thought process is this:

A larger rotor does mean greater cooling efficiency and also generally translates to more pad contact, but does the 135i rotor have more pad contact as a whole since the pad is larger than the 335i? My thinking is that, even though the rotor is smaller, there is a larger area being gripped. With the following scenario, keep in mind that extremes are used for comparison purposes only.

Consider riding a skateboard down the street. You want to stop, so you put your foot down on the recently-paved road to drag against it. Think of your foot as a brake pad, and the road as a brake rotor. If I have a massive size 18 shoe pushing down on the pavement, I am going to be increasing the amount of friction being applied. If I have a size 10 shoe of the same rubber compound pushing down on the pavement, I am decreasing the amount of friction being applied. The harder I press down on the shoe, the more of my forward momentum I am converting into heat. The larger the area of the shoe, the better it can distribute heat both around itself and the pavement, and the more grip I am gaining to slow the skateboard down.

There are also other factors as well. Let's say I decide to use a size 14 shoe, but the size 14 shoe has extremely durable 120 grit sandpaper for the sole. I'm going to stop faster than the size 18 shoe made of soft rubber, holding all other factors constant (force applied, pavement condition, etc.).

So, translating this back into vehicle braking force: could I achieve the same stopping power as two pads of the same compound, but one with a larger area, by using a more aggressive pad bedded onto my 335i brakes?

A more aggressive pad bedded onto 335i brakes would be similar to:

- Sandpaper as a sole
- Gritty road conditions

Instead of spending close to $1,000 on a brake set, it sounds like it would be better to just use some different pads.

Is this line of reasoning correct?
To answer the bolded part first yes you are correct. The amount of braking force achieved (assuming same size rotor and only increasing pad area) would be the same no matter what the size of the pad is. But increasing the friction with a better pad will increase you stopping force. The advantage of using a BBK is that you have a bigger rotor (increases braking force), bigger pad (increases heat dispersion), bigger caliper with more pistons (increases heat dissipation and applies force to the pad more evenly).

On street cars a BBK isn't necessary at all. The force generated by the brakes is enough to lock up the wheels. The limiting factor in braking force is becomes the tires.
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      10-27-2014, 10:43 AM   #14
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IMO if the performance brakes were an upgrade BMW would have listed them for a 335.
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      10-27-2014, 11:28 AM   #15
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Ah I see. Larger rotor = more leverage. The larger the radius of the disc, the greater leverage you have against the rotational force. Therefore, 135i brakes would likely be a downgrade
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      10-27-2014, 11:35 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by The Cleaner View Post
IMO if the performance brakes were an upgrade BMW would have listed them for a 335.
Agreed. It's another option in the catalog that they could make money off of, so why wouldn't they list it if it was an upgrade? It'd be especially convenient if it were the same parts from another car because they could advertise it as an upgrade but not need to develop/source different parts because they already did all that work for the other car.
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      10-27-2014, 08:21 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David1 View Post
135 brakes on a 335 is a downgrade. The 135 set up on the front has less brake sweep area than the stock 335 set up. If you want better braking, try different pads with better tires.

So BMzw offers this as a performance upgrade but it's not? For $1200 bux that is ridiculous. I actually didn't know the rotor OD was smaller....sounds like there are other, better options than this route....though I am confused with their marketing spin....
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      10-27-2014, 08:24 PM   #18
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Quote:
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IMO if the performance brakes were an upgrade BMW would have listed them for a 335.
Point very well made.
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