E90Post
 


GetBMWParts
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General Automotive (non-BMW) Talk + Photos/Videos > Buying cars 2-3 years old "certified used"



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-18-2017, 08:08 AM   #1
expidia
Second Lieutenant
expidia's Avatar
64
Rep
273
Posts

Drives: 2016 X5 35i
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Upstate New York

iTrader: (0)

Buying cars 2-3 years old "certified used"

Sure many will chime in here saying its a gimmick . . . from a host of former bad experiences . . . I beg to differ

Good article discussing the specifics of what each car brand offers as a used car warranty.
The last 3 cars I bought were all CPO which also allows the warranty to be transferred to the next owner which I did when I sold my Daughter my last SUV.

These warranties allows me peace of mind buying from a dealer with one year coverage plus remaining drive train coverage (from when the car was purchased new) rather than buy from a potential shyster used car salesman (been there done that). I think my state's used car laws they to warranty for 30 days.

But they have tricks to cover issues up to get over that 30 days period.
Or worse buying from a private party and get zero warranty coverage.

This article from car and driver has a link at the bottom and clicking on the logo shows the terms of each brand.

I have found buying CPO from a dealer has allowed me to buy cars in like brand new condition like my X5 and Audi Q5 (wife's). Each bot 1-2 years old and purchased at a 25% discount from new.

My 2016 X5 had an MSRP around 60k when new and I picked it up from the BMW dealer for 45k with only 14k miles on it. After 2016 I think BMW has shortened their warranty coverage somewhat.

If this article has been previously posted here then ignore it.

* I have no relationship with car and driver. I just happened to come across it to forward to my daughter who was buying a 2014 CPO Toyota Odyessy just yesterday from a Toyota dealer.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...ograms-feature
Appreciate 2
      07-18-2017, 11:12 AM   #2
MGM135is
Primo Generalissimo
United_States
410
Rep
1,299
Posts

Drives: 135is #399
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: DC and Raleigh areas

iTrader: (0)

Financially, at the time, I wasn't in a position to pay $51K for the 135is when it came out. I was patient and waited for a CPO and paid about 35% less than I would have new. I think you can't blindly buy CPO. You still need to inspect it and make sure it is actually in "like new" condition. I noticed minor issues when I bought and made sure the dealer made them right. It's also nice to be able to drive the extra miles under coverage compared to a regular warranty. The dealers have "guides" to follow from the manufacturer, and things like tires and brakes may be barely in spec, so you may have a brake job sooner than you think or other wear and tear maintenance that might not be covered under a warranty.
Appreciate 1
      07-18-2017, 03:13 PM   #3
expidia
Second Lieutenant
expidia's Avatar
64
Rep
273
Posts

Drives: 2016 X5 35i
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Upstate New York

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MGM135is View Post
Financially, at the time, I wasn't in a position to pay $51K for the 135is when it came out. I was patient and waited for a CPO and paid about 35% less than I would have new. I think you can't blindly buy CPO. You still need to inspect it and make sure it is actually in "like new" condition. I noticed minor issues when I bought and made sure the dealer made them right. It's also nice to be able to drive the extra miles under coverage compared to a regular warranty. The dealers have "guides" to follow from the manufacturer, and things like tires and brakes may be barely in spec, so you may have a brake job sooner than you think or other wear and tear maintenance that might not be covered under a warranty.
True. When I bought my Toyota Highlander 2 years ago from a toyota dealer as a CPO 2012 they gave me their check list of all the things they check off in their certified inspection.
This car looked and smelled brand new. As soon as I test drove it I knew it was mine. I never even opened the hood. Then a few weeks later when I was checking the washer fluid level I opened the hood and battery acid was strewn all over the place and you could tell it was all dried on as to its been there for a while.

So I was BS as their check list was a farce. These twits just went through and checked off all the blocks "and never even opened the hood".

I asked for the dealership manager or owner and showed them under the hood. They put in a brand new different branded battery from the one that was in there which from my toyota forum the battery that was in there OEM many had issues of leaking.

So they went through all the check list again and made things right. Plus I transferred the CPO for free to my daughter when I sold her the highlander banck in feb.

I gotta tell you . . . its a nice feeling bringing the BMW of South Albany and understandably back several times for two different issues and parts had to be ordered each time. One for the tailgate rattle and the other for a broken wire in the parking sensors in the front bumper which they had to remove the entire bumper facade to replace the harness.

Each time I go there they wash and vacuum the car for me. I'm telling you they treat me like royalty and best of all when it comes time to sign the bill they say "no charge to you for todays work as its covered under warranty".

Nothing like a 1 year bumper to bumper. Nothing like the old days of buying used cars from friends that owned used car dealerships that would fill the crankcase with STP to get them by the 30 day warranty. To cover up oil burning through worn rings,

CPO now for me. . . first class or coach . . . your choice!

This was Northway Toyota's Latham NY idea of a 160 point check list . . .
Attached Images
  

Last edited by expidia; 07-18-2017 at 03:22 PM.
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 04:10 PM   #4
The Wind Breezes
Major
361
Rep
1,312
Posts

Drives: 135i N55 DCT
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: USA

iTrader: (0)

Dealers are just as dishonest as some asshole running a used car lot out of a trailer. In fact, your best bet on finding an honest car sale is a private seller, because then there's a small chance they'll be honest (with dealers of any type that chance is 0).

If you're straining yourself to buy a used, expensive car and can't afford any repairs out of hand then maybe CPO is worth it. But, real talk, do you in fact need that kind of expensive liability in your life? Forget your neighbors and peers and get a Honda. There's nothing worse than people who strain their finances for a "nice" car.

Here's the best way to buy cars: if you have a lot of money and buy multiple cars for fun and can afford to fix them, fuck CPO and dealers because unless you make really bad choices you'll come out way ahead over paying the gigantic and ridiculous markup on dealer-sold CPO cars. Really, the dealer markup is quite extreme over the equivalent car purchased from a private party, CPO or not...so when you combine that with their complete dishonesty...fuck dealers.
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 04:42 PM   #5
expidia
Second Lieutenant
expidia's Avatar
64
Rep
273
Posts

Drives: 2016 X5 35i
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Upstate New York

iTrader: (0)

Oh sure. First off most people don't sell great cars privately. A great car always goes to a family related sale or an office associate etc.

Even good cars that are traded in at dealerships off leases or towards another car most great ones get scooped up by someone who works there family etc. Many good ones dont even go to an ad etc.

It's like real estate. Many great deals don't ever make it to the multi listing book. But hey, what do I know . . . I've only been buying and selling cars for 52 years.

Try and go back to your private party and ask him to make good for something that went bad a week after you bought it. I'm sure he would love to hear all about your issue from you and of course, I'm he'll make good on that $1,000 plus repair.

I'd rather pay a little extra for the CPO insurance and be covered for a year by BMW and most of the drive train for 7 years from the date the car was new, at least for my 2016 coverage.

As to driving a Honda . . . I lost my wallet a few weeks ago along with the entry key to my preferred ground floor private entrance spot. So just my luck the only guy who could replace my card was in europe for the next two weeks. So they allowed me to park in the regular "open to the public" or the monthly parkers section which is 6 levels high and to just sign the back of the ticket each day when I leave until he gets back.

Each floor has a slant to it. No way am I "ever" parking next to another car especially on a slanted floor.

So I chose to drive up to the roof top each morning and park flat with no other cars around. I didnt care as the garage has an elevator.

But the point to my story is . . . each night driving around in circles from floor to floor I was tracking how many luxury cars I was passing on the way down. I can say that my 2016 X5 was "the nicest" of all the cars I was passing every day for two weeks all the way down to the exit.

There is something to be said for the feeling of getting out of my X5 and walking across the street to my office and again looking forward to the drive home.

its like how much better I feel all day in a $60 necktie from bloomingdales then a past season $9.99 tie from marshalls.

I'm in the Capital of NY. Its not NY city or LA but there is a lot of affluency here. In the private ground floor section almost every car is a luxury car. There a 129k 7 series. No hondas, hyundai's or kia's though!

Like I said in my first post . . . "first class or coach" for some of us.

Last edited by expidia; 07-18-2017 at 04:47 PM.
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 04:50 PM   #6
Matt@EuroJerks
Second Lieutenant
96
Rep
231
Posts

Drives: 2013 135i
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: CT

iTrader: (1)

Drain the swamp.
Appreciate 1
      07-18-2017, 05:00 PM   #7
mrcheezle19
First Lieutenant
182
Rep
386
Posts

Drives: e30 turbo
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: lake elsinore

iTrader: (0)

Being a Sales Manager at a dealership I can tell you that we do put every effort into making a CPO or any used car worth it's extra price. We do stupid amounts of recon on all our used cars to make sure people won't have issues in the near future. But not all dealerships are created equal.
__________________
Present: M2 Mineral Grey 6MT

Past: BMW e30 m52 turbo 628whp/558wtq
Appreciate 1
      07-18-2017, 05:01 PM   #8
Matt@EuroJerks
Second Lieutenant
96
Rep
231
Posts

Drives: 2013 135i
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: CT

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrcheezle19 View Post
Being a Sales Manager at a dealership I can tell you that we do put every effort into making a CPO or any used car worth it's extra price. We do stupid amounts of recon on all our used cars to make sure people won't have issues in the near future. But not all dealerships are created equal.
What brand is that?
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 05:07 PM   #9
Mike991M4
Second Lieutenant
108
Rep
245
Posts

Drives: 2017 M4
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Loganville, GA

iTrader: (0)

bought my last 2 991s CPO. 2 years old with 4 years left of warranty and 35% off list.
__________________
1986 300ZX
2009 370Z Racecar
2013 991 C2S
2015 Cayenne Diesel
2017 M4 Competition
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 05:22 PM   #10
expidia
Second Lieutenant
expidia's Avatar
64
Rep
273
Posts

Drives: 2016 X5 35i
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Upstate New York

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike991M4 View Post
bought my last 2 991s CPO. 2 years old with 4 years left of warranty and 35% off list.
Dat's what I'm saying! I'm on my 3rd CPO and I hope they don't change this type of extended warranty coverage for CPO buyers. The brands are already shortening their coverage on new cars.

Most new car buyers don't realize the hit new cars take the first couple of years.

Most people lease because they can't come up with a big enough down payment that can lower their monthly payment on a luxury car with a 60 month loan. I put down 25k on my 2016 BMW which was like 2% interest rate . . chump change

Also, its tough for most to come up with a big down payment especially if you need two family cars upgraded around the same time as we did.

Saving 35% off the bat on cars that are the same as new is the best deal in town.
Good job

Last edited by expidia; 07-18-2017 at 05:27 PM.
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 05:48 PM   #11
Kolyan2k
Major General
321
Rep
5,215
Posts

Drives: 2006 S2000
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Boston

iTrader: (1)

Some or many franchise dealers are honest, they usually have nothing to hide and make ton of money. Smaller used car dealers are dishonest, it's a sales job and you will go out of business pretty quickly if you are 100% honest. I like buying private party or if I see CPO deal, I grab that. My last 2 CPO BMWs were 50% off MSRP with only like 28-30k miles
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 07:30 PM   #12
NickyC
Brigadier General
1450
Rep
3,165
Posts

Drives: Z4M Roadster - God's Chariot
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Somewhere I don't want to be

iTrader: (14)

2-3 yo CPO BMWs are where the deals are at. New and fleases forget it.
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 08:01 PM   #13
mrcheezle19
First Lieutenant
182
Rep
386
Posts

Drives: e30 turbo
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: lake elsinore

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt@EuroJerks View Post
What brand is that?
Ford dealership.
__________________
Present: M2 Mineral Grey 6MT

Past: BMW e30 m52 turbo 628whp/558wtq
Appreciate 0
      07-18-2017, 08:09 PM   #14
Z K
Brigadier General
Z K's Avatar
United_States
734
Rep
4,034
Posts

Drives: E90 M3, MK6 GLI
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: San Francisco

iTrader: (3)

I think buying a CPO car can be a good deal if you make sure you inspect what you are buying but I would rarely pay a premium for a CPO car over a non-CPO used car.

I've seen CPO cars in terrible shape. One had dog hair all over the rear seats and across the dashboard, it had dents all across the roof. It looked like pets (dogs?) walked over the roof causing little dents where it stepped. This was a "CPO" car that somehow passed their BS 1000 point inspection and was "cleaned". Sure, you get the extra warranty... but no way would I call that a good buy at a few thousand over an equivalent used car.

I would say, inspect the car as you would any used car. A CPO car is nothing special in my book. My only consideration is the extra warranty of a CPO car. If you feel like paying for the extra warranty is worth it, then go for it - otherwise it is just any other used car.

A lot of dealers will throw on a CPO certification so they can mark the car up and sell it for more... little or nothing is done to the car.
__________________
Auto Detailing Enthusiast!
Appreciate 0
      07-22-2017, 10:27 AM   #15
Superpop
New Member
2
Rep
11
Posts

Drives: 2012 S550
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Newcastle, WA

iTrader: (0)

The reason a CPO car is more is because the dealer is including an extended warranty that they have to BUY from the manufacturer. It has very little to do with the inspection or fixing of a few issues, that is an afterthought as far as they are concerned. You are paying for the warranty, which by the way on most european cars is well worth the money.
Appreciate 1
      07-22-2017, 04:54 PM   #16
1Bad540
Enlisted Member
2
Rep
30
Posts

Drives: Many Bmws
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Newyork

iTrader: (0)

all depends on the dealer, butttt Id say most cpo cars are worth the extra price. I have bought 2 cpo 7 series and a cpo benz s550, and a few others....in my experience after selecting the car and obviously inspecting it myself 1st, is the dealer keeps the better lower mileage cars. All of mine came w new brakes and new tires, my benz had just come from a major service where they did brakes,tires,trans fluid, and all fluids in the car. I gladly pay more for these type of cars. They also all came from large well known dealers w solid history.
Appreciate 0
      07-23-2017, 04:15 AM   #17
Stealth_Bomber
Private
2
Rep
66
Posts

Drives: 2014 BMW 535 M Sport
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: South Fla

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrcheezle19 View Post
Being a Sales Manager at a dealership I can tell you that we do put every effort into making a CPO or any used car worth it's extra price. We do stupid amounts of recon on all our used cars to make sure people won't have issues in the near future. But not all dealerships are created equal.
So what the heck does CPO cover I was given a vague engine and transmission come on there has to be some fine print. i wasnt given any literature or info on what it entails and covers vs NOT covers. Can anyone elaborate?
Appreciate 0
      07-23-2017, 05:13 AM   #18
kpewpew
Second Lieutenant
kpewpew's Avatar
United_States
88
Rep
289
Posts

Drives: 2011 E92 M3 ZCP
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: San Francisco, CA

iTrader: (0)

~10 years ago, I bought a CPO E46 as my first car. Everything was great until I installed new wheels with wider tires. It rubbed in the rear fenders, but the previous owner who used them on his E46 didn't get rubbing.

I attributed it to bad luck and rolled the fenders. Later, the speakers in the car no longer played any sound. When I brought it into the dealership for warranty repair, they told me it's not covered because the car was previously in the accident with the rear end being replaced. Looking with the trunk open, there was non-factory welding and it appeared that there was a pretty involved repair which was the cause of the leak.

After much hassle and negotiation, they agreed to repair the leak and replace the amplifier which was flooded and damaged. Buyer beware - you still need to do your homework and some dealers will pass off bad cars whether it be intentional or not.
__________________

2011 AW E92 M3 | DCT/Comp/Prem/Tech/CF roof
Rotora BBK 6p/380mm + 4p/355mm | Titan 7 T-S5 | TE37 SL BE | MPSS 265/285 | Bimmerworld street exhaust | Vorsteiner type II diffuser | OEM M-Perf front splitters, trunk spoiler, edition front + side grills | Lux H8 160 | Slambo/Level3 alu undertray
Appreciate 0
      07-23-2017, 07:55 AM   #19
MGM135is
Primo Generalissimo
United_States
410
Rep
1,299
Posts

Drives: 135is #399
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: DC and Raleigh areas

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kpewpew View Post
~10 years ago, I bought a CPO E46 as my first car. Everything was great until I installed new wheels with wider tires. It rubbed in the rear fenders, but the previous owner who used them on his E46 didn't get rubbing.

I attributed it to bad luck and rolled the fenders. Later, the speakers in the car no longer played any sound. When I brought it into the dealership for warranty repair, they told me it's not covered because the car was previously in the accident with the rear end being replaced. Looking with the trunk open, there was non-factory welding and it appeared that there was a pretty involved repair which was the cause of the leak.

After much hassle and negotiation, they agreed to repair the leak and replace the amplifier which was flooded and damaged. Buyer beware - you still need to do your homework and some dealers will pass off bad cars whether it be intentional or not.
This is why you ask for the maintenance records and run a carfax. If there’s no accident in either of those records then they can’t come back and say that. I chalk that up to being a first time car buyer and not knowing to do your homework. I have had to learn some life lessons that way too.

I wouldn’t buy a CPO with any type of accident even if they said it was just “cosmetic” because even that can be bs. Remember you are paying a little extra for CPO, and manufacturers market these cars just as good as new. You should expect that the car you’re buying is in the highest condition relative to other comparable non CPO cars at other dealers if you’re paying a premium. Always, always, always ask for the documentation that backs up what they are telling you and matches the history they provide (i.e. one car owner, purpose of trade, any recalls performed etc.).
Appreciate 0
      07-23-2017, 10:30 PM   #20
1Bad540
Enlisted Member
2
Rep
30
Posts

Drives: Many Bmws
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Newyork

iTrader: (0)

people often dont understand what a cpo car is.....Doesnt matter that the car still has/had cpo coverage. I consider it a cpo car when u bought it yourself at a bmw dealer and it was certified cpo from that dealer.
Appreciate 0
      07-24-2017, 01:22 AM   #21
kpewpew
Second Lieutenant
kpewpew's Avatar
United_States
88
Rep
289
Posts

Drives: 2011 E92 M3 ZCP
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: San Francisco, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MGM135is View Post
This is why you ask for the maintenance records and run a carfax. If there’s no accident in either of those records then they can’t come back and say that. I chalk that up to being a first time car buyer and not knowing to do your homework. I have had to learn some life lessons that way too.

I wouldn’t buy a CPO with any type of accident even if they said it was just “cosmetic” because even that can be bs. Remember you are paying a little extra for CPO, and manufacturers market these cars just as good as new. You should expect that the car you’re buying is in the highest condition relative to other comparable non CPO cars at other dealers if you’re paying a premium. Always, always, always ask for the documentation that backs up what they are telling you and matches the history they provide (i.e. one car owner, purpose of trade, any recalls performed etc.).
Yup, exactly that - first time car buyer and had no idea what I was doing. I'm glad I've learned that lesson as now I'm more careful on my bigger, better purchases.
__________________

2011 AW E92 M3 | DCT/Comp/Prem/Tech/CF roof
Rotora BBK 6p/380mm + 4p/355mm | Titan 7 T-S5 | TE37 SL BE | MPSS 265/285 | Bimmerworld street exhaust | Vorsteiner type II diffuser | OEM M-Perf front splitters, trunk spoiler, edition front + side grills | Lux H8 160 | Slambo/Level3 alu undertray
Appreciate 0
      07-24-2017, 06:57 AM   #22
phil_
First Lieutenant
35
Rep
311
Posts

Drives: Panamera Turbo S
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada

iTrader: (1)

I've saved boat loads of money buying CPO. 2 x M5's (E60 and F10) and currently driving a CPO Panamera Turbo S.

My experience with BMW and Porsche CPO has been great. Never had something not covered outside of wear and tear items. I've had very bad experiences with 3rd party warranties in the past and will never do that again.

The inspection process is greatly overrated, they do they obvious checks: tires, brakes etc... and in my experience will miss small stuff they shouldn't. In any case you just bring it in and get it fixed.

Choosing the car is a lot more difficult, you have to be very patient and wait for a low mileage / good condition car. Buying higher mileage will give you a discount when buying but depending on the time you keep the car you might take a big hit re-selling a high mileage premium car.

When I search for cars, I cover my entire country (Canada). Shipping a car is not that expensive and if you find a gem, it's well worth the effort.

Finally don't over pay. Most CPO cars are advertised with a healthy profit. Specifically M cars. Dealers will most often invest $5k or more for tires, brakes and general re-conditioning. And then tack on another $10k for profit. Prices might be slightly lower else where, this is in Canada.

I personally finance (Typically 5 years) and just calculate what I will owe in 2-3 years and compare to projected used car prices. If it's around what you will owe then it's a good deal. If you're way off, then walk away. Something is not right.

I also found most dealers don't want used (out of warranty) high end cars period. Even BMW didn't want a pristine E60 M5 with no warranty. They auction them off. Unless you sell privately expect to get near auction prices for a trade-in.
__________________
Retired: '13 M5, '08 M5, '08 335
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:28 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST