[hades]

If you've got the subs and want to get the best from them, the other option is to do a bit of rewiring; get a bigger sub amp with variable gain, and run the subs off that, e.g. Alpine MRP-M352 gives 200W into 4 Ohms or 350 into 2 Ohms, and has speaker level inputs, all for £100 for Car Audio Direct.

Gives you the option of using your existing Alpine amp as two channel just for the front door speakers and tweeters, or should be feasible with a little more wiring to use it to run the rear speakers should you wish.

[Steveo]

Originally Posted by hades

Gives you the option of using your existing Alpine amp as two channel just for the front door speakers and tweeters, or should be feasible with a little more wiring to use it to run the rear speakers should you wish.

Is the BMW Alpine upgrade Amp bridgeable?

[hades]

Doesn't look it - you'd just end up not using two channels (or doing a bit of re-wiring and using them for the back doors)

[vintagevrs]

Hey all,

I have an E92 and as with a lot of people I am disappointed with the standard sound system. I would agree with Hades in the fact that for the price BMW charge for the Alpine kit you could get a better aftermarket kit fitted by a ICE specialist and this is what I am going to do. Thinking of getting an Alpine 4 Ch amp fitted powering the under seat subs and door speakers. Also replacing the front speakers with a set JL 4" coaxials. Will the coaxial speakers perform as good as components in your opinion? I prefer the look of the components but at the end of the day it is about the sound.

Also, reading about the 6FL USB connection that I do not have. I have the standard CD player in the car with no I-drive. If this kit is installed can you still browse Artist/Genre/Playlist etc using the smaller screen on the standard radio. From what I gather you can but not sure how well this works. If anyone has this set up what do you think of it?

The 6FL set up with I-Drive seems to work well as per a video posted on youtube.

Thanks for your help

[gIzzE]

If going for an aftermarket set up I wouldn't choose an Alpine amp, get a Genesis or Audison, or even one of the new Vibe Litebox Class GH amps.

Coaxials will be a waste of time, and if you get the correct trim components will look exactly the same.

[vintagevrs]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

If going for an aftermarket set up I wouldn't choose an Alpine amp, get a Genesis or Audison, or even one of the new Vibe Litebox Class GH amps.

Coaxials will be a waste of time, and if you get the correct trim components will look exactly the same.

Cost also comes into the equation. I am not looking for anything too expensive but something that will provide a vast improvement on the stock system. The litebox seems to sell on the fact that it is small but the size of the amp is less important than price to me as there is loads of room in the boot.

I do not understand the statement that coaxials will be a waste of time? If I put coaxials in I will not need to replace any trim as they will be replacing the stock door speakers? As these speakers are quite high in the door I would imagine they are high enough to allow the tweeters within them to perform.

However, if you guys think that components will outperform coaxials then I would be interested to hear. From what I have been told so far is that for the same money for a basic pair of components a decent set of coaxials can be got, and because the location of the door speakers is quite high then coaxials would be better. Looking at JL CL-400x

[gIzzE]

Well the stock tweeter location is not great, but far better than having it any lower, but that is your choice.
Have you made sure it can be mounted properly?? A poorly mounted coaxial will sound worse than the stock speaker.
Plus the speaker you are looking at, I take it you meant the C2-400X?, is only rated at 35w and has an efficiency of 84.5db which is extremely low.
The stock speaker is around 90db, as are the subs, so with a 5db drop you are talking half the volume with the same given power.

Just seems like a really poor choice, did your installer recommend them??
What amp??


The Litebox amps have been reviewed and compared against some very decent amps, like the Genesis amps, and been given a glowing report.
The size is a bonus, and it was probably the size that got them looking at Class GH in the first place, just turns out that it has worked really, really well.

I would just try and avoid a digital amp full stop, too many problems with interference and you won't know whether it effects you until it is all installed.

[vintagevrs]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

Well the stock tweeter location is not great, but far better than having it any lower, but that is your choice.
Have you made sure it can be mounted properly?? A poorly mounted coaxial will sound worse than the stock speaker.
Plus the speaker you are looking at, I take it you meant the C2-400X?, is only rated at 35w and has an efficiency of 84.5db which is extremely low.
The stock speaker is around 90db, as are the subs, so with a 5db drop you are talking half the volume with the same given power.

Just seems like a really poor choice, did your installer recommend them??
What amp??


The Litebox amps have been reviewed and compared against some very decent amps, like the Genesis amps, and been given a glowing report.
The size is a bonus, and it was probably the size that got them looking at Class GH in the first place, just turns out that it has worked really, really well.

I would just try and avoid a digital amp full stop, too many problems with interference and you won't know whether it effects you until it is all installed.

Thanks for the reply. Yeah I am going on what the installer has recommended. They are a reputable installer in my area so would be confident that the coaxial would be mounted correctly. He also said that they would put some dynomat around the underfloor subs to help them. Since speaking to the installer I am thinking of trying the install myself as there are people on here that know what they are talking about and I hope could help me. I have never done this sort of thing before, but did manage to convert the tape deck on my 350z to work with a line in for my ipod using forum help which I was happy with!

Not sure what to do now, I wouldnt mind trying the install myself but would worry I would get stuck.

The only reason I questioned the lite box is that one of it's selling points is the size but from what I understand you are now saying is that it still out performs larger amps for the same price?

Yeah I meant the C2-400X, was told that it is a good coaxial and would outperform components in the same price range given the high speaker location.

I am really open to suggestions, especially ones that a novice like me could try and tackle to install.

Thanks again

[gIzzE]

If it were me, and this is what I am doing in my 123d at the moment is....

2 channel Litebox
L7 Tweeters

and.....that's it.


This will get the speakers and subs being driven properly, and will improve he sound no end, if I then feel the need to add Earthquake subs, when funds recover, I will buy another 2 channel amp, probably a used Genesis Stereo 100, use that to drive the mids/tweeters and use the Litebox to drive the 2ohm Earthquakes in stereo with 120watts each.


I wouldn't write off the stock speakers, it is the lack of amplification that makes them sound crap, I have heard them being driven with a £900 Audison amp and they sounded seriously sweet.
I just can't see the point of adding a pair of cheapish coaxials myself.

[E92Fan]

The other problem with going with coaxials in the standard locations is that there is ZERO chance of getting any height, or staging, with the sound. It really will just be 'left' and 'right' with nothing in the middle, and all the sound around your knees. Not good at all. Even the stock mirror housings are a poor location as they're too close to the listener, but they're much better than down below.

[TMP]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

If it were me, and this is what I am doing in my 123d at the moment is....

2 channel Litebox
L7 Tweeters

and.....that's it.


This will get the speakers and subs being driven properly, and will improve he sound no end, if I then feel the need to add Earthquake subs, when funds recover, I will buy another 2 channel amp, probably a used Genesis Stereo 100, use that to drive the mids/tweeters and use the Litebox to drive the 2ohm Earthquakes in stereo with 120watts each.


I wouldn't write off the stock speakers, it is the lack of amplification that makes them sound crap, I have heard them being driven with a £900 Audison amp and they sounded seriously sweet.
I just can't see the point of adding a pair of cheapish coaxials myself.

So what will the L7 and Liteamp setup cost gIzzE?
Where would you put the amp btw...is it an easier install?

[nottsE90]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

If it were me, and this is what I am doing in my 123d at the moment is....

2 channel Litebox
L7 Tweeters

and.....that's it.


This will get the speakers and subs being driven properly, and will improve he sound no end, if I then feel the need to add Earthquake subs, when funds recover, I will buy another 2 channel amp, probably a used Genesis Stereo 100, use that to drive the mids/tweeters and use the Litebox to drive the 2ohm Earthquakes in stereo with 120watts each.


I wouldn't write off the stock speakers, it is the lack of amplification that makes them sound crap, I have heard them being driven with a £900 Audison amp and they sounded seriously sweet.
I just can't see the point of adding a pair of cheapish coaxials myself.

Hi gIzzE,

I’m a complete newbie to car audio and hoping you can answer a couple of questions regarding the recommendation you made above.

My system is the basic bmw 6 speaker setup (2 door, 2 subs, 2 in the parcel shelf)

Firstly you recommend the 2 channel amp –

am I right in thinking this will only power 2 out of the 6 speakers and therefore leaving the other 4 to run off the head unit?

which of the 2 speakers would be connected to tha amp?

Or would it be wired in a certain way to power all 6 speakers?

Would it not be better to buy a 4 channel amp? – reason I ask is purely down to the number of speakers in the car.

I’m not sure when and why you would choose a 2 channel amp over a 4 channel amp.

Please correct me if what i've written above is wrong, I’m a complete novice to car audio and have never attempted to do anything like this before so please be gentle if i'm asking stupid questions.

[gIzzE]

The front speakers are wired in series, so you have the subs and mids running off the front channel of your head unit.

You could add this amp to that and use it to power the subs and mids, and also add a pair of tweeters.

I never bother upgrading rear speakers anyway, even when I have a 4 or 5 channel amp I always turn the volume down to the point where I can't hear them and reduce the frequencies above 5khz so it doesn't drag the sound stage back.


You could buy the 4 channel version, but I would use this to drive the mids and tweeters and then use the other 2 channels to drive the subs, and I think I would upgrade to Earthquake subs if I did that. No way would I bother doing anything to the rears, when you get the front right you don't need rears full stop.

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by TMP

So what will the L7 and Liteamp setup cost gIzzE?
Where would you put the amp btw...is it an easier install?

Sorry missed this.

L7 tweeters are about £60, and the Litebox amp is around £180 discounted including all the wiring.

It is as easy as the Alpine upgrade, just use the instructions for that.

[vallance5]

IMO if you want to improve your sound you have to get rid of the stock speakers as they are wafer thin rubbish. It would be a waste of money to buy an amp and not change the speakers. would be like having a ferrari with a fiesta engine. I have diamond audio D3 coaxial speakers (because i didnt want to start cutting the car up) and there is almost no difference between them and the component versions. As for the height, the E9X speakers are relatively high in comparison to other cars so there isnt much of a problem with that. As for powering the rears as has been said have it set up right in the front and you dont even need rears. But all this depends on how much you want to spend.

[gIzzE]

I sort of disagree with that, I would always do the amp first and see what you think, listening to the stock mids with L7 tweeters running of a £900 Audison it sounded seriously good.

[vallance5]

Thats my point tho why spend £900 on an amp and leave in probably £30 speakers. If you take them out and look at them they are pieces of paper with miniscule magnets. If you think it sounded good with them imagine what it would sound like with half decent speakers.

[gIzzE]

What I am saying is the really poor part is the amp, the speakers will always make a difference of course, but I think you have to be careful with speakers.

I have heard some Diamond HEXs at £400 in an E90 with a Genesis amp and they didn't sound as good as the standard speakers with the L7 tweeters, which is what he already put in.
Why?? Because he was struggling to get them mounte properly.

In the end he got someone to sound deaden his door panels and more importantly he got a custom mount made for the speakers, it then sounded awesome.
But it just shows poorly mounted speakers will not sound as good as the cheap tat that are in there but mounted properly.

[vintagevrs]

Guys,

Just thought I would let you know that last week I got my standard system in an E92 upgraded by a professional ICE company. They have replaced the front speakers with co-axials, sound deadened the doors, fitted an amp in the boot that powers the new co-axials as well as the under seat "subs". Also fitted an Ipod cable that charges the ipod as well as taking the audio from the ipod's line out.(Not the head phone jack)
They had worked on E90 BMWs before but this was their first e92 and they had to spend alot more time fitting the speakers than anticipated due to the depth restrictions. However, now the job is done the car looks completely stock but the sound has improved dramatically.
As for the component Vs Coaxial debate, I don't believe there would be a huge difference in the sound when mounting tweeters compared to the set up I have. Two previous cars had component set up, one of which was running a JL sub in the boot with components up front.

All this was fitted for a lot less than BMW would charge and I would rather a professional fitter worked with the system rather than a BMW technician following a set of instructions.







The amp is a Alpine PMX-F640 4 channel car amplifier and the speakers are Alpine SPG-10C2 - 10cm speakers. Not the most expensive kit but has achieved exactly what I wanted.

Hope this helps anyone thinking of doing similar.

[vallance5]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

What I am saying is the really poor part is the amp, the speakers will always make a difference of course, but I think you have to be careful with speakers.

I have heard some Diamond HEXs at £400 in an E90 with a Genesis amp and they didn't sound as good as the standard speakers with the L7 tweeters, which is what he already put in.
Why?? Because he was struggling to get them mounte properly.

In the end he got someone to sound deaden his door panels and more importantly he got a custom mount made for the speakers, it then sounded awesome.
But it just shows poorly mounted speakers will not sound as good as the cheap tat that are in there but mounted properly.

To be honest mate having them properly fitted is a given for it to sound better.

[vallance5]

vintagevrs your system looks good. i would always go with professionals fitting a system over BMW. Similar to mine with the amps in the false floor in the boot, thats what i wanted aswell improved sound but still looking stock.

[vintagevrs]

Yeah thanks Vallance, nothing OTT but the improvement was huge. The installer had explained to me before the work that he could not be sure how big an improvement this would make because of how poor the standard system was and how hard it was to incorporate an aftermarket solution. I suppose his standards are well above mine and that's why he is in the business not me. I am more than happy!

Looking at your set up from your sig......did you install the components in the standard BM locations? Where is the sub? Does the bass travel ok through from the boot?