[Kev]

I had a recent negative experience that I want to share with you guys:

I thought I wanted to order an S4 to replace my E55 late last year (Dec 2010), so I started asking around for the best price. Diane M. at Barrier Audi was the only one who accepted my offer for a MY2010 S4 custom ordered for invoice + 500. We went over the options multiple times before we confirmed the order (Phantom Black Pearl exterior, Black / Silver two-toned NAPPA leather interior, and every packages + options). She confirmed that my order was in and the car will be in bound in late March, early April.

We remained in contact over the next couple months and I was informed that my car has finally finished production and it was in-bound on a boat. Expected delivery is about 2 weeks at that point. She gave me the order sheet of the car and I immediately noticed that the NAPPA LEATHER option was missing on my order. I contacted her immediately and she was not sure whether it was ordered. Later, after a few phone calls, she confirmed that the car indeed did not have the nappa leather. Instead, it came with Alcantara inserts. Normally, I would be ok with that, but given my wife's strange qualms about Alcantara, I was not allowed to buy a car with Alcantara interior. I told her that I won't be accepting the delivery since it wasn't the car that I ordered. To her credit, she asked the service department if there is a way to retrofit the leather (of course not!). She pushed me a couple times saying that the car has so many options, it won't sell for a long time. However, I stood firm and the car eventually sold QUICKLY. There was some half-hearted apologies, but there was no offers to re-order the car or any form of compensation (e.g. early MY2011 delivery) for wasting my time.

Fast forward to August, I was once again looking for a replacement vehicle for my E55 AMG. I decided to give Barrier Audi another chance. So I got in touch with Diane again telling her that I am interested in re-ordering an MY2011 S4. I also reminded her that since they screwed up my order earlier in the year that I would like to order the car at invoice as a way of compensation. However, what I got in the email was nothing but attitude. She stated that she wants invoice + 800 (WTF!? now you want more money than what we previously agreed upon!?) because the demand for this car is so high (she said she delivered 3 that weekend). To compensate for the higher price, she said she MIGHT be able to find me an earlier build spot. I politely told her to go fly a kite.

It's a shame that Barrier Audi and its sales team would not own up to their own mistakes.

[98005xi]

thanks for sharing Kev. long time no see on here!

[Kev]

Originally Posted by 98005xi

thanks for sharing Kev. long time no see on here!

yeah, it's been a while since I was last here. Been busy with work and personal life. Good thing is I moved to the east side so I'll be closer to you guys.

[Eko]

sorry to hear you had such a bad experience... like every sales department, they have goods and bads. I had nothing but good experiences with them. maybe try a different sales person? haha i have a friend who does sales there. I'm not going to say I can guarantee things will work out better. But if you really are interested in getting that S4, PM me I can refer you to the guy I always worked with.

[R3dn3k Flyby]

Being in the automotive sales industry, I can advise there are both professional sales people and "sales people" at every dealership.

Honestly, it doesn't sound like Diane was out of line. Whether she made the mistake when placing the order, or if the mistake was made by Audi during production of the car, mistakes can and will happen especially when you're building a car with a lot of options. If you'd decided to go ahead and have her reorder the car to your specifications at the time the mistake was found, and had then asked for an additional discount, I'm fairly certain you would have received the answer you were looking for.

Markets change frequently in the automotive world. 3 months ago, I was whoring out Honda Pilots because I had 23 in stock with only 50 new cars in inventory total due to the situation in Japan. We're talking $1250 below invoice. Now I've got 1 in stock and there aren't many on their way currently. Now you're paying full MSRP at minimum if you want one.

You were given $500 over invoice by Barrier in 12/2010 when no one else would. 8 or 9 months later (4 or 5 months after the original car was delivered), you want her to sell the car for less than the original amount which was already less than anyone else wanted to sell it for. Beyond that, walking away from a car with $48k MSRP with no options whatsoever over $800 (Over invoice) is fairly ridiculous in my opinion. You were given a great deal the first time around. $300 more the second time around 8 months later is still a fantastic deal. As far as I know, Audi has been selling like crazy just like BMW, thanks to the shortages on the Japanese luxury brands.

Moving forward, I too have a friend that works as a sales rep at Barrier Audi, and if you'd like to give it another shot with someone other than Diane, feel free to pm me and I'll provide you with his info.

[m34SPD]

Originally Posted by Eko

sorry to hear you had such a bad experience... like every sales department, they have goods and bads. I had nothing but good experiences with them. maybe try a different sales person? haha i have a friend who does sales there. I'm not going to say I can guarantee things will work out better. But if you really are interested in getting that S4, PM me I can refer you to the guy I always worked with.

Nico? Probably the best sales person there.

[R3dn3k Flyby]

Originally Posted by jattditutti

Nico? Probably the best sales person there.

That's who I was referring to.

[SEXICAN]

Originally Posted by Eko

sorry to hear you had such a bad experience... like every sales department, they have goods and bads. I had nothing but good experiences with them. maybe try a different sales person? haha i have a friend who does sales there. I'm not going to say I can guarantee things will work out better. But if you really are interested in getting that S4, PM me I can refer you to the guy I always worked with.

I'm sure he is a really cool guy, right?

I'm sorry to hear about your not so good experience. If you want to try and give Barrier 1 last try to earn your business please PM me.

I know the experience will be different when you buy a car from a fellow car enthusiast!

[Kev]

Originally Posted by Eko

sorry to hear you had such a bad experience... like every sales department, they have goods and bads. I had nothing but good experiences with them. maybe try a different sales person? haha i have a friend who does sales there. I'm not going to say I can guarantee things will work out better. But if you really are interested in getting that S4, PM me I can refer you to the guy I always worked with.

No thanks. I completely lost interest in buying anything from Barrier at this point.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

Being in the automotive sales industry, I can advise there are both professional sales people and "sales people" at every dealership.

Honestly, it doesn't sound like Diane was out of line. Whether she made the mistake when placing the order, or if the mistake was made by Audi during production of the car, mistakes can and will happen especially when you're building a car with a lot of options. If you'd decided to go ahead and have her reorder the car to your specifications at the time the mistake was found, and had then asked for an additional discount, I'm fairly certain you would have received the answer you were looking for.

Markets change frequently in the automotive world. 3 months ago, I was whoring out Honda Pilots because I had 23 in stock with only 50 new cars in inventory total due to the situation in Japan. We're talking $1250 below invoice. Now I've got 1 in stock and there aren't many on their way currently. Now you're paying full MSRP at minimum if you want one.

You were given $500 over invoice by Barrier in 12/2010 when no one else would. 8 or 9 months later (4 or 5 months after the original car was delivered), you want her to sell the car for less than the original amount which was already less than anyone else wanted to sell it for. Beyond that, walking away from a car with $48k MSRP with no options whatsoever over $800 (Over invoice) is fairly ridiculous in my opinion. You were given a great deal the first time around. $300 more the second time around 8 months later is still a fantastic deal. As far as I know, Audi has been selling like crazy just like BMW, thanks to the shortages on the Japanese luxury brands.

Moving forward, I too have a friend that works as a sales rep at Barrier Audi, and if you'd like to give it another shot with someone other than Diane, feel free to pm me and I'll provide you with his info.

1. At the time the mistake was discovered by me, she freely admitted that she did not enter the order herself and someone did it for her and omitted the leather option.

2. With that said in #1, there was no attempt by the sales or Barrier Audi in general to make things right. I didn't bother hunting these clowns down since I do have better things to do as a resident. Even if they offered to reorder the car at that point, it would probably have been an MY2011 model.

3. As the customer, I can care less how THEIR market has changed over the last few months. We agreed upon a price and they failed to deliver. I want them to rectify the situation and show some sincerity in making things right to keep a potential long term customer. It's just that simple and they don't care to achieve that.

4. It's a custom ordered car and not a car sitting on their lot that I am trying to buy, so N=1 at all times, just my ordered vehicle. They are just acting as the agent for Audi GmBH to sell me the car and they just so happen to make money during the transaction. Let's be real, even at invoice, the dealership are still making money from manufacturer hold backs.

5. It was a fully loaded car with every single option (MSRP > 60K) originally. I don't know where you see it's a no option car.

6. I don't see why it is "ridiculous" to walk away from invoice + 800. Instead, I find it ridiculous that Washingtonians are accustomed to not negotiating for a car and would pay whatever the dealer ask for. Even in Wisconsin, I was able to negotiate invoice pricing on my first car, a Mercedes Benz C320. I have never paid more than 500 over invoice in all the cars that I have bought new so far.

7. Invoice + 800 might be a great deal for you but it ain't worth jack to me.

I have wandered over to greener pasture and gotten a better car for a price that I am willing to pay, so thank you but no, thank you to your offer for the "hook up". I will never buy another car in-state.

[R3dn3k Flyby]

Originally Posted by Kev

1. At the time the mistake was discovered by me, she freely admitted that she did not enter the order herself and someone did it for her and omitted the leather option.

2. With that said in #1, there was no attempt by the sales or Barrier Audi in general to make things right. I didn't bother hunting these clowns down since I do have better things to do as a resident. Even if they offered to reorder the car at that point, it would probably have been an MY2011 model.

3. As the customer, I can care less how THEIR market has changed over the last few months. We agreed upon a price and they failed to deliver. I want them to rectify the situation and show some sincerity in making things right to keep a potential long term customer. It's just that simple and they don't care to achieve that.

4. It's a custom ordered car and not a car sitting on their lot that I am trying to buy, so N=1 at all times, just my ordered vehicle. They are just acting as the agent for Audi GmBH to sell me the car and they just so happen to make money during the transaction. Let's be real, even at invoice, the dealership are still making money from manufacturer hold backs.

5. It was a fully loaded car with every single option (MSRP > 60K) originally. I don't know where you see it's a no option car.

6. I don't see why it is "ridiculous" to walk away from invoice + 800. Instead, I find it ridiculous that Washingtonians are accustomed to not negotiating for a car and would pay whatever the dealer ask for. Even in Wisconsin, I was able to negotiate invoice pricing on my first car, a Mercedes Benz C320. I have never paid more than 500 over invoice in all the cars that I have bought new so far.

7. Invoice + 800 might be a great deal for you but it ain't worth jack to me.

I have wandered over to greener pasture and gotten a better car for a price that I am willing to pay, so thank you but no, thank you to your offer for the "hook up". I will never buy another car in-state.

1. Mistake is mistake is mistake. Is it an inexcusable mistake? Not really. No one got injured. Some feelings got hurt. Is it frustrating? Most definitely.

2. If they never offered to reorder or asked what could be done to rectify the situation then that's unprofessional. Given the fact I've heard great things about Barrier's sales department, I find it tough to believe that they made no effort to make the situation right when the shit originally hit the fan. However, I wasn't directly involved obviously, so I can just state opinion.

3. That's what's hilarious about this business. The customers who walk out with a vehicle at cost or at damn near cost somehow think they got hosed. The customers that pay full price are the happiest people on the planet. Either way, you waited a while to give it another go. The market changed in that time. BMW had record sales in the month of August. That is most certainly due to all the Japanese brands have serious inventory issues due to the tsunami/earthquake. Again, I'm sure Audi was right there with them.

4. There's a reason other dealerships told you to pound sand when you advised you wanted a deal at $500 over invoice. If you submitted that offer to 2, 3, or 8 dealerships, they all accepted it, you chose Barrier, and they messed up, then yeah, get pissed. Hold back doesn't go to the sales staff, management, or anyone beyond that. It's there to cover the overhead of the dealership.

5. I understood that it was a fully optioned car. If you reread my statement, you'll find that I mentioned the car has a base MSRP of that. I wasn't going to take the time to custom build one on their website with every option to find out what the MSRP on yours was. My point was that a base one with no options is pushing $50k and you were bent out of shape over an extra $300 and/or having to pay a total of $800 over invoice.

6. Washingtonians aren't accustomed to anything. Some pay invoice. Some pay MSRP. Some pay MSRP plus adjusted market value. All prices are negotiable on everything. Given the competitive market and the current state of the economy, all dealers are rather competitive for business. If you got a bunch of no and one yes, that confirms your offer was extremely aggressive.

7. If I were purchasing a Kia with an invoice of $5k, was somehow wronged, and was then told to pay an additional $300, $500, or $800, I'd undoubtedly walk away. You've just confirmed that you walked away from a ridiculous deal on a $60k car over $300-$800. At most, that's $13 a month on an already sizable auto payment.



I'll use an outside source as further evidence...

Edmunds.com is known for suggesting rather aggressive pricing. They have their "True Market Value" tab. The pricing is generally ridiculous.

2012 Audi S4 Sedan Premium Plus quattro
Invoice: $44,865 with destination

MSRP: $48,175 with destination

True Market Value: $48,344 with destination

So, a website that generally has vehicles listed well below MSRP is advising that a person getting a "good" deal on a new S4 should pay just over MSRP, nearly $4k above invoice.





Summation:
You submitted an aggressive offer to several dealers.
Barrier stepped up and made it work when no one else would.
A mistake was made.
Based on your logic, I'm going to guess you were not the easiest customer to deal with.
You waited 6 months.
Came back looking for a better deal than the crazy one you were originally offered.
Were told that the best they could do at that point would be $300 more than your original price which is still a ridiculous deal.
You scoffed at an extra $300 on a $60,000 purchase.
You've now taken time to come online and blog about your experience.

[Eko]

Originally Posted by jattditutti

Nico? Probably the best sales person there.

lol yes nico.

So we have three people here who recommend nico

either way, again its unfortunate you had such a bad run in with barrier. Its your choice who you want to buy from. Just wanted to offer what i could to help.

[Eko]

oh and kev just out of curiosity what did you end up picking up?

[E90MCF]

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

1. Mistake is mistake is mistake. Is it an inexcusable mistake? Not really. No one got injured. Some feelings got hurt. Is it frustrating? Most definitely.

2. If they never offered to reorder or asked what could be done to rectify the situation then that's unprofessional. Given the fact I've heard great things about Barrier's sales department, I find it tough to believe that they made no effort to make the situation right when the shit originally hit the fan. However, I wasn't directly involved obviously, so I can just state opinion.

3. That's what's hilarious about this business. The customers who walk out with a vehicle at cost or at damn near cost somehow think they got hosed. The customers that pay full price are the happiest people on the planet. Either way, you waited a while to give it another go. The market changed in that time. BMW had record sales in the month of August. That is most certainly due to all the Japanese brands have serious inventory issues due to the tsunami/earthquake. Again, I'm sure Audi was right there with them.

4. There's a reason other dealerships told you to pound sand when you advised you wanted a deal at $500 over invoice. If you submitted that offer to 2, 3, or 8 dealerships, they all accepted it, you chose Barrier, and they messed up, then yeah, get pissed. Hold back doesn't go to the sales staff, management, or anyone beyond that. It's there to cover the overhead of the dealership.

5. I understood that it was a fully optioned car. If you reread my statement, you'll find that I mentioned the car has a base MSRP of that. I wasn't going to take the time to custom build one on their website with every option to find out what the MSRP on yours was. My point was that a base one with no options is pushing $50k and you were bent out of shape over an extra $300 and/or having to pay a total of $800 over invoice.

6. Washingtonians aren't accustomed to anything. Some pay invoice. Some pay MSRP. Some pay MSRP plus adjusted market value. All prices are negotiable on everything. Given the competitive market and the current state of the economy, all dealers are rather competitive for business. If you got a bunch of no and one yes, that confirms your offer was extremely aggressive.

7. If I were purchasing a Kia with an invoice of $5k, was somehow wronged, and was then told to pay an additional $300, $500, or $800, I'd undoubtedly walk away. You've just confirmed that you walked away from a ridiculous deal on a $60k car over $300-$800. At most, that's $13 a month on an already sizable auto payment.



I'll use an outside source as further evidence...

Edmunds.com is known for suggesting rather aggressive pricing. They have their "True Market Value" tab. The pricing is generally ridiculous.

2012 Audi S4 Sedan Premium Plus quattro
Invoice: $44,865 with destination

MSRP: $48,175 with destination

True Market Value: $48,344 with destination

So, a website that generally has vehicles listed well below MSRP is advising that a person getting a "good" deal on a new S4 should pay just over MSRP, nearly $4k above invoice.





Summation:
You submitted an aggressive offer to several dealers.
Barrier stepped up and made it work when no one else would.
A mistake was made.
Based on your logic, I'm going to guess you were not the easiest customer to deal with.
You waited 6 months.
Came back looking for a better deal than the crazy one you were originally offered.
Were told that the best they could do at that point would be $300 more than your original price which is still a ridiculous deal.
You scoffed at an extra $300 on a $60,000 purchase.
You've now taken time to come online and blog about your experience.

Telling it like it is!

[Kev]

Mr. R3dn3k Flyby,

You seem to be heavily invested in this and have the urged to put me down for whatever I say, so it's probably futile to continue with this disucssion. You are more than welcome to continue to state your opinion. Here is my last reply.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

1. Mistake is mistake is mistake. Is it an inexcusable mistake? Not really. No one got injured. Some feelings got hurt. Is it frustrating? Most definitely.

A mistake that was made on a custom ordered car to my specification which involve a 4-month wait is inexcusable. She could have confirmed the order once again once the car started production before Audi GmBH closed the order for any further changes.

If I committed a similar mistake and omitted some thing in my line of work, I'll be in court in no time.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

2. If they never offered to reorder or asked what could be done to rectify the situation then that's unprofessional. Given the fact I've heard great things about Barrier's sales department, I find it tough to believe that they made no effort to make the situation right when the shit originally hit the fan. However, I wasn't directly involved obviously, so I can just state opinion.

So, you don't have any ACTUAL interaction with their sales department, right? How are you supposed to state an "opinion" based on hearsay? I believe there a 3 sides to a story, my side, the other party's side, and then the truth, which usually lie some where in between. From my side, it was clear to me they made an effort to see if the leather could be upgraded after the fact. Once they found out they couldn't, they stop short on offering any other ways to make it right for me. The communication just abruptly stopped when I told her that I won't be taking delivery of the car.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

3. That's what's hilarious about this business. The customers who walk out with a vehicle at cost or at damn near cost somehow think they got hosed. The customers that pay full price are the happiest people on the planet. Either way, you waited a while to give it another go. The market changed in that time. BMW had record sales in the month of August. That is most certainly due to all the Japanese brands have serious inventory issues due to the tsunami/earthquake. Again, I'm sure Audi was right there with them.

I don't really care about what or how the market has changed. I only care about getting a car at the price that I want to pay. Plus, this time it is really about whether they are willing to take care about a mistake that they had committed and had not had a chance to correct it. Yet, they busted their chance once again.

"The customers that pay full price are the happiest people on the planet." --> that's probably a reflection of yourself and I would really suggest you to keep that to yourself and no one else.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

4. There's a reason other dealerships told you to pound sand when you advised you wanted a deal at $500 over invoice. If you submitted that offer to 2, 3, or 8 dealerships, they all accepted it, you chose Barrier, and they messed up, then yeah, get pissed. Hold back doesn't go to the sales staff, management, or anyone beyond that. It's there to cover the overhead of the dealership.

Actually, University Audi accepted an offer at 750 over invoice, and Sunset was able to do match Barrier, plus all the Norcal and SoCal dealers were willing to match the deal. So, I do not understand where you could have inferred that other dealerships told me to "pound sand" as you pointed out so astutely. The reason I picked Barrier was the interaction I had with Diane during the initial order process and the proximity of the Barrier dealerships to my current residence, so I don't have to schedule a weekend off or vacation time for pick up of the car.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

5. I understood that it was a fully optioned car. If you reread my statement, you'll find that I mentioned the car has a base MSRP of that. I wasn't going to take the time to custom build one on their website with every option to find out what the MSRP on yours was. My point was that a base one with no options is pushing $50k and you were bent out of shape over an extra $300 and/or having to pay a total of $800 over invoice.

You do like to pick strong phrase like "pound sand", and "bent out of shape", don't you? It is really not about how much extra it would have cost. It really is the principle of taking care of your customer and owning up to your own mistakes. They have demonstrated none of that. Based on your reasoning, I could also have easily said that Barrier got bent out of shape for an extra profit of $300 and lost the possible long term customer. It's really a two-way street, isn't it?

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

6. Washingtonians aren't accustomed to anything. Some pay invoice. Some pay MSRP. Some pay MSRP plus adjusted market value. All prices are negotiable on everything. Given the competitive market and the current state of the economy, all dealers are rather competitive for business. If you got a bunch of no and one yes, that confirms your offer was extremely aggressive.

See above for what "deals" I got, so it's not really that aggressive after all.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

7. If I were purchasing a Kia with an invoice of $5k, was somehow wronged, and was then told to pay an additional $300, $500, or $800, I'd undoubtedly walk away. You've just confirmed that you walked away from a ridiculous deal on a $60k car over $300-$800. At most, that's $13 a month on an already sizable auto payment.

It was supposed to be a cash purchase any ways, so it won't involve any auto payments at all. I could use those extra $300 to get the windows tinted at Accutint Seattle though. As I stated before, it is not about how much money, it's about their attitude of not wanting to correct their mistake and take care of their customer that irks me.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

I'll use an outside source as further evidence...

Edmunds.com is known for suggesting rather aggressive pricing. They have their "True Market Value" tab. The pricing is generally ridiculous.

2012 Audi S4 Sedan Premium Plus quattro
Invoice: $44,865 with destination

MSRP: $48,175 with destination

True Market Value: $48,344 with destination

So, a website that generally has vehicles listed well below MSRP is advising that a person getting a "good" deal on a new S4 should pay just over MSRP, nearly $4k above invoice.

In medicine, we talk about evidence-based medicine all the time, but in the end, it really depends on what you read, and how do you apply it. Using another "outside source", i.e. CarsDirect.com as "evidence", here is what I got:

MSRP PRICING:
$48,475
INVOICE PRICING:
$45,736
Target Price: $47,536
Pricing as of 9/13/11 in zip code 98040

which suggests that you shouldn't be paying for MSRP. I wonder what gives? My take is don't believe in what you see online.

Originally Posted by R3dn3k Flyby

Summation:
You submitted an aggressive offer to several dealers.
Barrier stepped up and made it work when no one else would.
A mistake was made.
Based on your logic, I'm going to guess you were not the easiest customer to deal with.
You waited 6 months.
Came back looking for a better deal than the crazy one you were originally offered.
Were told that the best they could do at that point would be $300 more than your original price which is still a ridiculous deal.
You scoffed at an extra $300 on a $60,000 purchase.
You've now taken time to come online and blog about your experience.

I find your summation inaccurate and do not agree with it. You seem to be fixated on money instead of the principle that is involved. Please keep your opinion to yourself. Thank you. Case closed.

[R3dn3k Flyby]

Originally Posted by Kev

Mr. R3dn3k Flyby,

You seem to be heavily invested in this and have the urged to put me down for whatever I say, so it's probably futile to continue with this disucssion. You are more than welcome to continue to state your opinion. Here is my last reply.

Not heavily invested. We're going to disagree on the matter. The good news is, this is the internet. It's not serious business. The better news is, this forum is used for discussion, so whether you want it or not, you created a thread, and you're going to get my opinion.

Originally Posted by Kev

A mistake that was made on a custom ordered car to my specification which involve a 4-month wait is inexcusable. She could have confirmed the order once again once the car started production before Audi GmBH closed the order for any further changes.

If I committed a similar mistake and omitted some thing in my line of work, I'll be in court in no time.

Mistakes can and will happen. People are imperfect. Is the mistake frustrating? Sure. Based on your signature information, I can assume you are in the medical field. Comparing a mistake made while ordering a custom built car to a mistake made while providing someone with anesthesia is asinine. Now, had Barrier ordered the wrong car and then proceeded to physically drop it on you, that would undoubtedly be an inexcusable mistake. No one was injured. Some feelings were hurt.

Originally Posted by Kev

So, you don't have any ACTUAL interaction with their sales department, right? How are you supposed to state an "opinion" based on hearsay? I believe there a 3 sides to a story, my side, the other party's side, and then the truth, which usually lie some where in between. From my side, it was clear to me they made an effort to see if the leather could be upgraded after the fact. Once they found out they couldn't, they stop short on offering any other ways to make it right for me. The communication just abruptly stopped when I told her that I won't be taking delivery of the car.

No. I have no actual interaction with Barrier. I've owned one Audi. It was a B5 S4. It was purchased from a private party and I later sold it to another private party. However, if I were in the market for an Audi, I'd be on my way to Barrier. That's neither here nor there.

I can agree that the truth of the situation is somewhere between what you're stating and what Barrier would state.

Opinions can be based on a multitude of things. I could have a 12 year old say they like the bathrooms at Barrier and determine that my opinion of Barrier is a good one. Fortunately, I know quite a few people that have purchased vehicles there and I know one of the longtime employees of the dealership. So, my opinion isn't based on that of a 12 year old's love of the bathrooms.

Originally Posted by Kev

I don't really care about what or how the market has changed. I only care about getting a car at the price that I want to pay. Plus, this time it is really about whether they are willing to take care about a mistake that they had committed and had not had a chance to correct it. Yet, they busted their chance once again.

"The customers that pay full price are the happiest people on the planet." --> that's probably a reflection of yourself and I would really suggest you to keep that to yourself and no one else.

The fact that you don't care about the market changing is irrelevant. The market has changed. Every customer only cares about getting the car they want at a price they want to pay. You're not unique. My statement about customers paying more and being happier is an industry wide fact. Ask any sales person at any dealership, and they'll answer the same way. It's not a reflection of myself or the way I assist customers. Year to date, I have a 97% approval rating from my clients thanks to the delivery surveys Honda does after the fact.

Originally Posted by Kev

Actually, University Audi accepted an offer at 750 over invoice, and Sunset was able to do match Barrier, plus all the Norcal and SoCal dealers were willing to match the deal. So, I do not understand where you could have inferred that other dealerships told me to "pound sand" as you pointed out so astutely. The reason I picked Barrier was the interaction I had with Diane during the initial order process and the proximity of the Barrier dealerships to my current residence, so I don't have to schedule a weekend off or vacation time for pick up of the car.

You don't understand why I inferred that?

Here's a line from your initial post:
"I started asking around for the best price. Diane M. at Barrier Audi was the only one who accepted my offer for a MY2010 S4 custom ordered for invoice + 500."

Originally Posted by Kev

You do like to pick strong phrase like "pound sand", and "bent out of shape", don't you? It is really not about how much extra it would have cost. It really is the principle of taking care of your customer and owning up to your own mistakes. They have demonstrated none of that. Based on your reasoning, I could also have easily said that Barrier got bent out of shape for an extra profit of $300 and lost the possible long term customer. It's really a two-way street, isn't it?



See above for what "deals" I got, so it's not really that aggressive after all.

My posts would be boring if I didn't use "strong phrases".

When you're down to squabbling over $300 on a $60k purchase that they were going to have to reorder, track, deliver, etc, it's a one-way street. As mentioned, based on the things you say and how you advise it went down, I'm going to guess you're not the easiest customer on the planet to deal with.

Originally Posted by Kev

It was supposed to be a cash purchase any ways, so it won't involve any auto payments at all. I could use those extra $300 to get the windows tinted at Accutint Seattle though. As I stated before, it is not about how much money, it's about their attitude of not wanting to correct their mistake and take care of their customer that irks me.

Cash, finance for 12 months, finance for 84 months, whatever. My opinion stands that $800 over invoice is a fantastic deal on a $60k luxury vehicle.

Originally Posted by Kev

In medicine, we talk about evidence-based medicine all the time, but in the end, it really depends on what you read, and how do you apply it. Using another "outside source", i.e. CarsDirect.com as "evidence", here is what I got:

MSRP PRICING:
$48,475
INVOICE PRICING:
$45,736
Target Price: $47,536
Pricing as of 9/13/11 in zip code 98040

which suggests that you shouldn't be paying for MSRP. I wonder what gives? My take is don't believe in what you see online.

Either way, two websites known for suggesting very aggressive pricing are advising that you should pay at least $1000 more than what you were offered the vehicle for.

Originally Posted by Kev

I find your summation inaccurate and do not agree with it. You seem to be fixated on money instead of the principle that is involved. Please keep your opinion to yourself. Thank you. Case closed.

I find your statements inaccurate and do not agree with them. You seem to be fixated on what you want instead of what is realistic. You posted on a public board. Opinions will be given. Thank you. I rest my case.


-Devil's Advocate

[stubenhocker]

Cue the violins....

[98005xi]

pretty heated discussion on here - points made on both sides. i've been in sales (not auto) for many years and I'm also cheap as shit, but love nice stuff and have been yelled at by my wife for being too generous when tipping. lots of contrast for sure.

i tend to side with Kev on this one since i believe that auto sales is about the long term relationship more so than anything else. sales is not an easy occupation, but i'm a firm believer that the customer is just about almost always right. units moved is a stronger gauge of performance than pricing over invoice. at the end of the month/quarter/year, the only thing the boss/press cares about is who sold more cars.

just within this area, there are 3 prominent bmw dealers vying for business. it's too bad that my impression has been so soured by bellevue, that i'd rather drive over the 90 to seattle. i'm happy nonetheless and am more than happy to tell anyone who will listen. damage done by bellevue and word of mouth is a very strong influence.

others may or may not agree and that's just fine. redneck - interesting tidbits that you have shared with us (i love finding out more about what goes on in the background - so thanks). kev - just hope you wind up happy with your new car.

-alex

[TTG]

I am 100% with Kev on this one..... I have dealt with Barrier couple of times for Volvo, Audi and Porsche and they frikin act like they are doing you a favor by selling you a car....

Unfortunately, that has also been my experience with most local Audi dealers.... They think their over priced VW's are hot crap.

Kev, you have been around here for a while so I am not going to tell you how to buy a car. But you can just pretty much name your price on a car if you go over to the other side of the mountains or down south to our neighboring state.

I will always buy my car from the cheapest source that will give me the best price. I can care less about local economy, market and all of that other BS a car sales person talks about.

Let us know what you end up getting.

**Edit** Saw from your other post that you already got the car. Post some pics when you get a chance.

[yogi]

i gotta agree with kev on this one, barrier should have made it right. i had a bad experience with barrier in the past that i don't care to get into. im happy to buy and ship a car from out of state than support a shitty dealshit that doesnt look after their customers. yes a dealership is a business that has to turn a profit, but doing the right thing builds lasting relationships with customers that build onto profits and growth.

[reddemon73]

When I purchased my 04 Cabriolet, I went down to Beaverton Audi. Barrier sales person was playing game with me, switch and bait situation.