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      08-25-2014, 02:27 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by deadmn1337 View Post
JB4 only auto clears. So if your car feels weird turn auto clear off and check the codes that pop up. Then go back to auto clear once it is running well. Otherwise get a Cobb and you won't have that problem at all.
So I need the BMW downpipe fix which appears to no longer be available for some reason?
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      08-25-2014, 02:55 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by beetle6986 View Post
So I need the BMW downpipe fix which appears to no longer be available for some reason?
I heard VRSF was making a DP fix not sure where they are on that though. It is not recommended to run with the dp fix in permanently as it changes what the ECU sees and doesn't allow for proper adjustments.
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      08-25-2014, 03:21 PM   #69
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I'm surprised that BMS hasn't coded something better in though.

I got the light again this afternoon so looks like auto clear is going to have to be turned on soon for me. I've had a couple of wierd things happen though, but they have come after some modifications like the alpina flash, etc. so I'll be checking out the codes in the near future before turning on auto clear.
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      08-25-2014, 05:49 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by deadmn1337 View Post
It is not recommended to run with the dp fix in permanently as it changes what the ECU sees and doesn't allow for proper adjustments.
Do you have any details on this? The O2 sensors close to the tubos are the widebands used by the car to make tuning adjustments. I thought the O2 sensors at the other end of the downpipes (after the cats if you have any) were simply to check if the cats are working. I didn't think the car would make any adjustments based on the feedback from those sensors.
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      08-25-2014, 05:59 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beetle6986 View Post
Do you have any details on this? The O2 sensors close to the tubos are the widebands used by the car to make tuning adjustments. I thought the O2 sensors at the other end of the downpipes (after the cats if you have any) were simply to check if the cats are working. I didn't think the car would make any adjustments based on the feedback from those sensors.
I don't just because I didn't go that direction. Search around in the Turbo section and there are quite a few threads about it, or talk to Tiago directly.
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      09-23-2014, 11:53 PM   #72
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This may be a stupid question, If I get access to a full lift, whats the best way to lower the subframe and support the engine? Anyone know how a shop handles the subframe drop? I can't seem to figure out a good solution... other than doing the install on jack stands.
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      09-24-2014, 06:03 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by bnd View Post
This may be a stupid question, If I get access to a full lift, whats the best way to lower the subframe and support the engine? Anyone know how a shop handles the subframe drop? I can't seem to figure out a good solution... other than doing the install on jack stands.
Harbor freight type bar/hoist over the fenders holds up the engine from the top, then once unbolted the subframe basically just hangs there by the suspension. It doesn't really need to be supported by anything. You have to make sure there is no tension on hoses etc but it is not that difficult, even on jack stands.
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      09-24-2014, 08:43 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by ajsalida View Post
Harbor freight type bar/hoist over the fenders holds up the engine from the top, then once unbolted the subframe basically just hangs there by the suspension. It doesn't really need to be supported by anything. You have to make sure there is no tension on hoses etc but it is not that difficult, even on jack stands.
Thank you! That's good to know... I may just try this on jack stands since I won't have access to a hoist.
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      10-21-2014, 01:17 PM   #75
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Thank you! That's good to know... I may just try this on jack stands since I won't have access to a hoist.
FYI: Tried this on jack stands and ramps. Clearance isn't horrible if you're smaller frame, but the install was horrible. I recommend taking this to a shop unless you are an avid mechanic with a lot of experience. I had to cut bolts with a dremmel, drill out bolts after snapping bits, couldn't break o2 sensors loose and to top it off, couldn't drop the subframe per this thread. I removed the discussed 3 bolts per side to drop the subframe only to gain about 1" extra clearance, which was not enough. At this point I was spent, called the tow truck and had my shop finish it.

My car is a 2008 E92 N54 XI. The tech that worked on my car use to work on BMW and knew exactly what to do. He removed 3 bolts that were not discussed to drop the subframe, 8 bolts total(only 2 of which were mentioned on this thread), while supporting the engine, which provided the clearance necessary to pull the old out and put the new in (VRSF 3"). In order to move the mid pipes out of the way, there's more than just removing the small brace held by one bolt, you need to remove a rear plate with braces further back near the x-pipe. This plate has 4 torx bolts per side and was the cause of 3 bits snapping and two drill outs. Anyway, these were two key points that were missing from this thread install or at least as it relates to a 2008 e92 XI... Good luck and be extremely patient, otherwise save yourself the huge hassle and let a shop do it in 5 hours. Takes a shop 5 hours to do it on an E92 XI, I was present for half of it...
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      10-21-2014, 03:09 PM   #76
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I would also like to add that VRSF seems to make quality fitting downpipes as well as providing quality gaskets and bolts. Fitment was perfect, no rattles, no leaks, no issues. Car feels smooth, slightly more powerful with reduced spool times. Once I've had some more time to adapt and play(add E30 mix), I'll write a longer review with my opinion. Can't notice a sound difference in the car as much, sounds a bit deeper at idle and until it stops raining here I won't be able roll the windows and hear her while she's running. Had to start it up without downpipes for a moment and it sounds like a race car beast!!
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      10-21-2014, 04:26 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnd View Post
I would also like to add that VRSF seems to make quality fitting downpipes as well as providing quality gaskets and bolts. Fitment was perfect, no rattles, no leaks, no issues. Car feels smooth, slightly more powerful with reduced spool times. Once I've had some more time to adapt and play(add E30 mix), I'll write a longer review with my opinion. Can't notice a sound difference in the car as much, sounds a bit deeper at idle and until it stops raining here I won't be able roll the windows and hear her while she's running. Had to start it up without downpipes for a moment and it sounds like a race car beast!!
ohhhhh how i hope i never have to install/ uninstall again.... it was horrible but +1 for vrsf perfect fit and beat price and quality
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      10-21-2014, 07:09 PM   #78
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I dunno my VRSF install had signifcant fitment problems. Where the pipes cross each other at the front I had to ding the longer one in so they weren't touching. Also had to put a big ding in the long pipe so the rear O2 sensor from the other pipe could pass over it. Also wasn't crazy about the carbon steel fasteners. From the onset the long pipe was at a slight upward angle no matter how they were adjusted. Pipes were def seated as the vclamps fully closed no problem. When I did the CPE's on the 335I the fitment was perfect...I should have paid the extra for CPE's. They've been on for 4 weeks and there are no leaks. Happy with increase torque and faster spool esp with a first gear brake launch....
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      10-21-2014, 07:11 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnd View Post
FYI: Tried this on jack stands and ramps. Clearance isn't horrible if you're smaller frame, but the install was horrible. I recommend taking this to a shop unless you are an avid mechanic with a lot of experience. I had to cut bolts with a dremmel, drill out bolts after snapping bits, couldn't break o2 sensors loose and to top it off, couldn't drop the subframe per this thread. I removed the discussed 3 bolts per side to drop the subframe only to gain about 1" extra clearance, which was not enough. At this point I was spent, called the tow truck and had my shop finish it.

My car is a 2008 E92 N54 XI. The tech that worked on my car use to work on BMW and knew exactly what to do. He removed 3 bolts that were not discussed to drop the subframe, 8 bolts total(only 2 of which were mentioned on this thread), while supporting the engine, which provided the clearance necessary to pull the old out and put the new in (VRSF 3"). In order to move the mid pipes out of the way, there's more than just removing the small brace held by one bolt, you need to remove a rear plate with braces further back near the x-pipe. This plate has 4 torx bolts per side and was the cause of 3 bits snapping and two drill outs. Anyway, these were two key points that were missing from this thread install or at least as it relates to a 2008 e92 XI... Good luck and be extremely patient, otherwise save yourself the huge hassle and let a shop do it in 5 hours. Takes a shop 5 hours to do it on an E92 XI, I was present for half of it...
Sorry to hear you had trouble with this, this is definitely not a job for first timers or folks not comfortable being under cars for a few hours (or all day). Coupe of points for people who will still try it themselves. These DIY's assume a basic level of familiarity with tools and these cars, they are not complete & exhaustive as far as steps tools etc.

You do not need to remove the rear brace to drop the exhaust. Yes I have a e92 XI. You can just take off the bolts on the exhaust/muffler hangers under the trunk and then the diff. The rear section of the exhaust is then hanging loose (support the muffler area on jack stands or wood blocks) and once the single bolt hanger/clamp thing at the mid pipe junction is off, and the DP flange bolts are loose, you'll have enough room to push the rest of the exhaust back a couple of inches and get the DP's out. The OP for this post was replacing his exhaust same time, he did not need to worry about it.

The subframe will drop on its own very easily and just hang there 4-6" down if you remove all the bolts holding it to the unibody, and the motor mount bolts on both sides.

Removing the O2 sensors it is best to have one of those special side cut O2 sockets.

Etc.

Don't get me wrong it is a very time consuming job but I would not call it difficult. I Must have read 50 DP removal DIY's and related threads, and got up underneath the car several times looking at where stuff was getting it all straight in my head. Then collecting tools and so forth. I also sometimes get a little bit claustrophobic under a car, and once early on I started this job and just quit I was not comfortable under the car and could not get my head into it.

Anyway eventually I did it and now have dropped the subframe couple of times to do other stuff and tighten up DP's while under there, no big deal now.

Last point, you get stuck in the middle of a job, ask somebody here. It may be something very simple (like no need to remove rear brace) or it may not be. You never know. Even better, read the DIY several times, if there is a step missing or not understood ask before you go ripping your car up.

BTW there have been plenty of jobs I started, and in the middle just said screw it, I'll let a pro do this. Or I said, I have no idea what I am doing I need to read up more. Anyone says they haven't probably just forgot. Last one I remember at the moment was a Miata had an airbag light come on. Was due to a bad accelerometer, known issue. Except it was behind the dashboard and you needed to remove EVERYTHING to get to it. Started taking things apart and it just got hairier and hairier. Before I got to far into it I said, man I have no idea WTF I am doing (even with a factory shop manual) put it all back together and took it to a dealer.

Last edited by ajsalida; 10-21-2014 at 08:21 PM.
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      10-22-2014, 11:52 AM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajsalida View Post
Sorry to hear you had trouble with this, this is definitely not a job for first timers or folks not comfortable being under cars for a few hours (or all day). Coupe of points for people who will still try it themselves. These DIY's assume a basic level of familiarity with tools and these cars, they are not complete & exhaustive as far as steps tools etc.

You do not need to remove the rear brace to drop the exhaust. Yes I have a e92 XI. You can just take off the bolts on the exhaust/muffler hangers under the trunk and then the diff. The rear section of the exhaust is then hanging loose (support the muffler area on jack stands or wood blocks) and once the single bolt hanger/clamp thing at the mid pipe junction is off, and the DP flange bolts are loose, you'll have enough room to push the rest of the exhaust back a couple of inches and get the DP's out. The OP for this post was replacing his exhaust same time, he did not need to worry about it.

The subframe will drop on its own very easily and just hang there 4-6" down if you remove all the bolts holding it to the unibody, and the motor mount bolts on both sides.

Removing the O2 sensors it is best to have one of those special side cut O2 sockets.

Etc.

Don't get me wrong it is a very time consuming job but I would not call it difficult. I Must have read 50 DP removal DIY's and related threads, and got up underneath the car several times looking at where stuff was getting it all straight in my head. Then collecting tools and so forth. I also sometimes get a little bit claustrophobic under a car, and once early on I started this job and just quit I was not comfortable under the car and could not get my head into it.

Anyway eventually I did it and now have dropped the subframe couple of times to do other stuff and tighten up DP's while under there, no big deal now.

Last point, you get stuck in the middle of a job, ask somebody here. It may be something very simple (like no need to remove rear brace) or it may not be. You never know. Even better, read the DIY several times, if there is a step missing or not understood ask before you go ripping your car up.

BTW there have been plenty of jobs I started, and in the middle just said screw it, I'll let a pro do this. Or I said, I have no idea what I am doing I need to read up more. Anyone says they haven't probably just forgot. Last one I remember at the moment was a Miata had an airbag light come on. Was due to a bad accelerometer, known issue. Except it was behind the dashboard and you needed to remove EVERYTHING to get to it. Started taking things apart and it just got hairier and hairier. Before I got to far into it I said, man I have no idea WTF I am doing (even with a factory shop manual) put it all back together and took it to a dealer.
I have a basic level of understanding and am comfortable under the car, just a little surprised that after 4 pages of a thread no one talked about needing to remove other bolts not discussed in the DIY. This DIY gave the impression that pulling three bolts per side would allow for the subframe drop, which maybe worked on the OP's car, not on mine. I just wanted to inform people of possible additional work based on a 2008 E92 XI.

Your tips about removing some additional exhaust/muffler bolts seems like a beneficial piece of the DIY, so I see why the brace/plate removal could be bypassed. My tech dropped the exhaust since he was on the lift, so he removed the plate and brace, which I initially thought was a necessary for clearance. For those of us without a Bentley manual, the subframe drop would be a nice thing to elaborate on and add to the DIY. If I would have had more info on dropping the subframe and removing those muffler hanger bolts I probably would have made it through. I was just too tired and out of time to figure out what I was missing. I googled the crap out of XI downpipe installs and didn't find much... This seemed to be the best DIY that was praised by people. I don't hold anyone responsible but myself for the failure and appreciate the insight that I received for the install.
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      10-22-2014, 12:25 PM   #81
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I am not sure which additional bolts you're talking about WRT dropping the subframe and we have nearly identical cars. There are the (6) big hex head subframe bolts, and then the smaller torx head ones on each of the motor mounts (2 each side). 10 total and this is discussed here, there are pics on page 2. Did your car have more than that? Just trying to clarify if there really is an extra step for 08 e92 XI vs other years. My car is an 09 AT.
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      10-22-2014, 02:01 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajsalida View Post
I am not sure which additional bolts you're talking about WRT dropping the subframe and we have nearly identical cars. There are the (6) big hex head subframe bolts, and then the smaller torx head ones on each of the motor mounts (2 each side). 10 total and this is discussed here, there are pics on page 2. Did your car have more than that? Just trying to clarify if there really is an extra step for 08 e92 XI vs other years. My car is an 09 AT.
I'm wondering the same.
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      10-22-2014, 02:17 PM   #83
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Maybe the OP assumed anyone tackling this would be able to look and see what bolts were holding the subframe up lol. Let me see, this part won't drop and these bolts go through it into something else...I'm stumped. Not sure how this is the fault of the DIY?
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      10-22-2014, 09:53 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnd View Post
I have a basic level of understanding and am comfortable under the car, just a little surprised that after 4 pages of a thread no one talked about needing to remove other bolts not discussed in the DIY. This DIY gave the impression that pulling three bolts per side would allow for the subframe drop, which maybe worked on the OP's car, not on mine. I just wanted to inform people of possible additional work based on a 2008 E92 XI.

Your tips about removing some additional exhaust/muffler bolts seems like a beneficial piece of the DIY, so I see why the brace/plate removal could be bypassed. My tech dropped the exhaust since he was on the lift, so he removed the plate and brace, which I initially thought was a necessary for clearance. For those of us without a Bentley manual, the subframe drop would be a nice thing to elaborate on and add to the DIY. If I would have had more info on dropping the subframe and removing those muffler hanger bolts I probably would have made it through. I was just too tired and out of time to figure out what I was missing. I googled the crap out of XI downpipe installs and didn't find much... This seemed to be the best DIY that was praised by people. I don't hold anyone responsible but myself for the failure and appreciate the insight that I received for the install.
I was able to use this DIY for my 2008 e92 n54 335xi DPs install no problem. It took me nealy 5 hours including car cooled down time. I removed the said 10 bolts and my subframe dropped 4"-6". As for the 02 sensors I had a stubby 22mm opened ended wrench that worked wonders for me.
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      10-23-2014, 04:56 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajsalida View Post
I am not sure which additional bolts you're talking about WRT dropping the subframe and we have nearly identical cars. There are the (6) big hex head subframe bolts, and then the smaller torx head ones on each of the motor mounts (2 each side). 10 total and this is discussed here, there are pics on page 2. Did your car have more than that? Just trying to clarify if there really is an extra step for 08 e92 XI vs other years. My car is an 09 AT.
I must have misinterpreted wording and pics... Think I understand what I missed now. Can't believe I screwed that up... guess that's why no one pays me to work on cars.

Sorry for my frustration.
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      10-23-2014, 05:01 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnd View Post
I must have misinterpreted wording and pics... Think I understand what I missed now. Can't believe I screwed that up... guess that's why no one pays me to work on cars.

Sorry for my frustration.
Hey no problem happens all the time. Thanks for replying, just did not want others to think something was missing out of the DIY. It is probably the best one available for XI's. Hope you are enjoying all the new HP.
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      11-07-2014, 11:45 AM   #87
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N55 XI owners: Did mine on jack stands, no need to drop the subframe. It took me about 4 hrs using hand tools and a LOT of elbow grease. (Not a lot of experience working on BMWs)

Must have items for the swap:
Flexible head O2 sensor puller
A can of freeze-off
Flexible ratchet extensions and universal joints
A LOT of patience

Butt dyno noticed a small gain in power, car sounds way better, no bad smell.
VRSF downpipe fit perfectly!
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      11-08-2014, 02:23 PM   #88
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This thread will also come in handy for those that will need to replace their oil pan gasket, like myself

thanks!
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