[Hopeful]

Mr Singh posted the RRP in another thread. He'll be distributing this product to UK dealers soon apparently.

[katie.g]

Paul

i will be really interested in your honest assessment/ opinion of this upgrade, i know its something you will do. So often i see the standard system getting slated on this forum, and find myself wondering why am i the only one who likes the standard setup.

music is something i'm very passionate about, especially as this year my sports are curtailed by injury, i play guitar and piano and have always loved hi-fi gear. In the past in my house you would find components from Linn, Cambridge Audio, B+W, Mordant Short to name a few, just trying to demonstrate that i know what reasonable gear is.

however in recent yrs i am guilty of just chucking the ipod / iphone on a soundock and not really listening that carefully, albeit when i want a beautifull audio to listen to, and drift away its the iphone with B+W or Bose headphones

my thoughts are rightly or wrongly, that most people these days go for powerfull extended bass and treble type sounds with a really fast attack on transient sounds, not what you could call a natural sound repoduction,personally i find this quite exciting for a quick listen , but really tiring after a short while, i'm thinking in the past we used to judge our systems by their clarity, soundstage (3d stereo effect whereby you can place instruments as if they were actually being played in front of you)and true to life sound.

i know this sounds like i'm getting me knickers in a twist, but trying to get a point over without sounding like a know-all fuckwit is difficult !!

last night i'd read through your thread,and it was kind of on my mind, "do i need an upgrade ?" later i was trying to learn a song on guitar by John Mayer, i learn stuff by ear, not clever enough to read music, so i was listening on some computer speakers (bose companion 5) and was finding it really difficult to unravel a 3 part multi tracked guitar lick, the computer speakers were not able to reproduce the sound quite well enough, and i thought lets try this in the car. It was a real shock because the bog standard bmw set up reproduced the music brilliantly, i was instantly able to capture the three guitar parts and then play them on my own guitar

ok will get me bullet proof vest on to fend off those of you that are not going to like this post, my intention is one of support for all you upgraders and geniune interest into how others may judge / enjoy their sound equipment, i'm sure there is a lot i can learn from you all

will start by getting some studio speakers hooked up to me computer !

good luck Paul with the install

Katherine

[AlanQS]

Katherine, I think the main problems with the standard setup are lack of tweeters, bass, and power. I upgraded my car from standard firstly by fitting tweeters at the front. Since I usually play familiar songs, I immediately noticed that I could hear sounds in a track that had been previously missing so that was a plus 1 for me.

I then got the Alpine upgrade which gives a little more volume on the door speakers which is good for those times you are driving along and want to jack up the volume a bit.

The extra power made the subs a revelation - not just on rock songs where you could appreciate a pounding beat or bass line but in fuller sound types of music where there was a significant improvement in the richness of the sound. Otherwise the standard kit is O.K.

[mob17]

Whoever is thinking about adaptor thickness, i used 6mm thickness of plywood for mine.

[parapaul]

First update...

The bargain Cleansweep from the states isn't quite as much of a bargain as I'd thought - UPS left a card through my door the other day and I owe £53 in import duty It's still 1/3 cheaper than buying it in this country though.

[Hopeful]

How do they calculate it? I read that the average Customs Duty is 5-9% but that it varies by classification (and there are 14,000 of them!).

Did this also include the VAT?

[parapaul]

TBH I have no idea - it was just written on the UPS card as a fee for collection on delivery. I'll ask the courier when he brings it back, see if he knows.

[katie.g]

import from non eu countries is very hard to calculate as the scale of charges alters for the value of goods and type of goods

but there is customs duty / excise duty / import vat

duty can be avoided on goods valued at less than £135, but VAT is almost always going to apply

tobacco / alchohol, much higher rates to pay

i've brought in quite a lot of cycle wheels from the US in the past when the dollar / stirling rates were favourable, something which is occuring again now . The seller in the US has to fix a customs form to the package stating the value of the goods and the type of goods, so that UK customs can work out our duties to pay

often the seller in the US will put an incorrect low value on the form to reduce the amount of UK duty payable ( not something i would be involved in - honest )

however if this goes wrong it's us responsible for the error / fine, not the seller in the US.
Katie

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by parapaul

First update...

The bargain Cleansweep from the states isn't quite as much of a bargain as I'd thought - UPS left a card through my door the other day and I owe £53 in import duty It's still 1/3 cheaper than buying it in this country though.

Paul
£70 for Cleansweep + £53 for import duty. £123 already spent. Is it still 1/3 cheaper than buying in UK?

Mind you, I had to pay around £18-20 when I bought VEN4 LOC. But that is nothing compared to yours £53.

[parapaul]

Sam, the cheapest Cleansweep I could find from a UK seller was £350,so I'm still quids in

Parcel arrived from CAD this morning, hopefully UPS will call today too then I can get started...

[mob17]

I love receiving parcels

[parapaul]

Don't think anyone here is on my FB friends list, so for your benefit:

UPS are a bunch of incompetent idiots.

The parcel which they safely shipped from the States and thousands of miles ot the UK in a matter of days, they couldn't manage to get out of the depot and onto the lorry yesterday. It will be Monday now. Grrr...

[parapaul]

Finally got started today! I can't believe how long this gear had been sat in my garage just waiting, and it seems like every day off I've had in the last few months has been wet. Today started out sunny, but I ended up dodging the rain by lunchtime so didn't get as much done as I'd hoped.

There's loads of DIY guides around already so just some pics from throughout the day:

Speakers to be fitted:



Old vs. new:





Template for fixing the new speaker to the door - 6mm MDF:



Speaker fixed to the bracket:



Speaker fitted to the door card:



8" subs:



Ground Zero supply specially made adaptors for BMW fitment. These are superb - cast from metal, with terminal adaptors and foam top and bottom to ensure a good seal:



Old vs new:





It's as simple as removing the 4 torx screws and dropping the new sub assembly in:



And the finished product:





I deliberately didn't order the new sail panels with tweeter housings, I wanted the option to aim the tweeters if I needed to.

And the sound? Even with just the speakers replaced, no extra processing or amplification, it's so much better already!

The components remind me just how much of my music I'd been missing out on, and the 8" subs hit loud and hard with just the HU output. I reckon they'll improve even more as they run in, and hopefully I'll get the DSP and amp sorted one day next week.

Love it all over again!

[makkan00]

Finally you managed to get the ball rolling.
Which amp and DSP are you going for?

Paul, everything looks excellent. Only one problem mate, if you drill and fit the tweeters like that, they are off axis. I am under the impression that you are audiophile and you know the importance of on axis vs off-axis.
However with BMW tweeter housing, tweeters are on-axis. You will feel the difference when you will listen to music in a car with on axis tweeters vs off-axis.


Awaiting for further progress!

[Gazza0210]

Parapaul,

I've just installed the same ground zero subs in my E90 and got a set of Rainbow components upfront from Cad to go with it. I haven't installed the components yet but have put the subs in and I was pleasantly surprised as to just how good they sound in those little boxes. I would have put up some pics that I took on my iphone but had it nicked from work the other day.

Next part of the project is a fibreglass box moulded into the side of the boot to give some really low tones. I will get pics with this project and upload when completed.

[parapaul]

Mak, you're right about the tweeter axis. I've often found with car audio that off-axis sounds better to me, the tweeters are usually too bright for my taste. These are silk domes which will help soften the sound a little but I wanted the option to deliberately aim them off.

[parapaul]

Day 2: Another 8 hours work, scraped hands, bloodied knuckles, and much swearing but it's done!

Everything went exactly as expected! No surprises, nothing that made my car any different to the others on all the DIY threads I've studied. It just took a while because I wanted it right, and I double checked everything as I went along.

The speaker connectors in the passenger side sill were a breeze. Plenty of wire to work with. Driver's side was another matter though - it was a complete ballache. In retrospect I think it would have been easier to take the seat out, there was just NO give in the wires that side and they were in a really awkward place.



Then I ran wires back to the boot area, tucked them under the door sill trims and followed the car's existing looms. Then I stripped the boot out...



Which took AGES! I've fitted the Cleansweep in the hollow beneath the toolkit/first aid kit. Perfect size.



All in and powered up:



Everything connected and making it sure it works before hiding it all away again:



And I was genuinely surprised when it worked first time I've done loads of ICE installs and something always goes wrong... Not this time though, I must have taken enough time and care to get it right first time.

I have to give credit to Bavarian SoundWorks and their DIY PDF - I was really struggling to work out how to connect to the battery but they got me going again.

http://www.bavariansoundwerks.com/pr...stem_Guide.pdf

The Cleansweep was straightforward to install and setup, the instructions were crystal clear and it all worked as expected. I haven't had a chance to listen to much music yet but first impressions are VERY good. The amp gains were set with an oscilloscope so I know they're spot on - something you just can't check with a multimeter.

It's crystal clear, and christ on a bike it's loud! The 8" Ground Zero subs are giving easily as much bass as any 12" or 15" I've used previously in a box in the boot. It really makes a huge difference having them so close to the speakers, not 8 feet behind.

[Dizzle]

Fantastic work Paul, looks like a great setup.. good effort on the installation too.

Out of interest pre amping wirh just the speaker swap out I'm assuming distortion was no more? And the rears are still standard?

[AWBimmer]

That looks great Paul and excellent write up. Would love to hear the sound someday! Are you enjoying the upgrade?

[Telly Addict]

Very interesting thread Paul and good to see you finally got it finished! Quick question though - how easy were the sail panels to do? I take it you just hole cut them and the tweeters came with mountings? Did you have a template for them?

[parapaul]

Originally Posted by Dizzle

Fantastic work Paul, looks like a great setup.. good effort on the installation too.

Out of interest pre amping wirh just the speaker swap out I'm assuming distortion was no more? And the rears are still standard?

Thanks

Distortion with just the new speakers was noticeably less. I'd recommend just a speaker upgrade as an improvement in its own right. And yes, the rears are still standard. With the fader set neutrally they give just the right amount of rear fill now.

[parapaul]

Originally Posted by Telly Addict

Very interesting thread Paul and good to see you finally got it finished! Quick question though - how easy were the sail panels to do? I take it you just hole cut them and the tweeters came with mountings? Did you have a template for them?

Sail panels were surprisingly straightforward. There was no template for the tweeters but one of my hole saws was exactly the right size for the mounting bracket. I used the bracket itself as a template and then it was just a case of measuring to make sure they're in the same place both sides.