Throttle - Jumpy, jerky, touchy...

2jzn54 · 06-18-2013, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PKinsella

I would like to have what you're smokin', sir, haha.

you haven't looked at any dynos have you... lol

PKinsella · 06-18-2013, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daily Three

you haven't looked at any dynos have you... lol

Actually, I remembered the LS3 numbers wrong. Torque is about 430 as well.

2jzn54 · 06-18-2013, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PKinsella

Actually, I remembered the LS3 numbers wrong. Torque is about 430 as well.

and your tuned small twin turbo i6 is likely putting out 430 ft lb of tq..

PKinsella · 06-18-2013, 02:46 PM

Well, I guess it's dumb to be talking in bhp. We should be talking in whp instead of back-figuring. I think a stock LS3 C6 dyno's around 380hp 375 ft-lb, obviously dependent on a lot of variables. I'm under the impression that a JB4-only 335i is around 330-350hp, with a bit higher torque numbers (340-360?).
...but I'm no expert. I just know that my 335 sure doesn't feel as fast as my vette did (of course, there's 150-200lb weight difference too).

jeffb335 · 06-18-2013, 04:23 PM

op, have you looked into cleaning your intake valves? I recently did the DIY intake valve cleaning and spark plugs and the difference in low speed driveability was huge. So much so that my wife who only drives my car every few weeks came home after driving it and said "what did you do to your car, it shifts so smooth!". And for her to notice is saying something....

If you have over 40k miles you must look into this.

And yes, jb4 menu 10 (wastegate default position) and 12 (duty cycle), dial those back a ways to make the throttle more linear and less "touchy".

PKinsella · 06-18-2013, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb335

op, have you looked into cleaning your intake valves? I recently did the DIY intake valve cleaning and spark plugs and the difference in low speed driveability was huge. So much so that my wife who only drives my car every few weeks came home after driving it and said "what did you do to your car, it shifts so smooth!". And for her to notice is saying something....

How many miles are on the car? I can't imagine the intake valves being that bad at 39k miles!

Edit: just saw your edit!

jeffb335 · 06-18-2013, 04:32 PM

oh you have no idea.....start looking around and you will find many NASTY intake valve pics, here is mine at 42k (pretty much typical by the way):

Here they are almost done, (dirty job!):

Im running the BMS oil catch can now to reduce this in the future. There are some threads out there about this carbon build up, google intake valve cleaning or "walnut blasting" (what the dealer does)

3000GT MR · 06-18-2013, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daily Three

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3000GT MR

To big of a gap will do the same as described by OP. I just went through this scenario again when i was testing spark plug gaps with the ngk's. Did you gap them at all?

gapped them to recommended spec drove and checked them twice.. if i didn't gap them at all i can assure you the car would drive and sound like a big heap of misfiring crap and the car would barely put down enough power to get moving lol.

nonetheless i'll probably check the gap on each again this weekend and see if i can find any inconsistencies.

From my experience it was fine with the. 032-.035 up to 18psi and meth. Starting off drivability suffered as described. I've been able to go as big as. 032 with 20psi and 550cc/min of meth with some mods that I'm still testing. Cleaning the valves would also help a great deal as above suggested

TN335USN · 06-18-2013, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PKinsella

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashmostro

Adjusting your wastegate default position, and duty cycle helps with this over-sensitivity. The newest versions of the firmware allow you to adjust both through the steering wheel controls. Have you tried this?

This is exactly what I just did and I'm trying it out. It was at 70 and I moved it down to 60. I haven't had enough of a chance to try it yet, but I will report back.

And drjekl, I know that removing the CDV would help things. I'm going to look into doing that, as I haven't liked it from the beginning.

dont remove cdv just take it off push the innards out with a drill bit then it will still appear stock.

DJJimGreen · 06-18-2013, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PKinsella

I would like to have what you're smokin', sir, haha.

carlsontheflyer · 06-18-2013, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PKinsella

How many miles are on the car? I can't imagine the intake valves being that bad at 39k miles!

Edit: just saw your edit!

You don't have to imagine. Take a look at my valves at 36k miles. Try not to do it on a full stomach.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=852945

2jzn54 · 06-20-2013, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3000GT MR

From my experience it was fine with the. 032-.035 up to 18psi and meth. Starting off drivability suffered as described. I've been able to go as big as. 032 with 20psi and 550cc/min of meth with some mods that I'm still testing. Cleaning the valves would also help a great deal as above suggested

.022 is what i believe was recommended for tuned cars for the one step colder plugs. thats what i'm gapped at right now.

did the valve cleaning a while back.. might be time to revisit.

Lowering OL values/WGDP has helped me quite a bit..

PKinsella · 06-20-2013, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlsontheflyer

You don't have to imagine. Take a look at my valves at 36k miles. Try not to do it on a full stomach.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=852945

Thanks for the link. I guess I never thought about the fact that there isn't gas cleaning the intakes constantly, being direct injected. I would say it's definitely worth having a catch can!
How do I get BMW to clean this under warranty??

2jzn54 · 06-26-2013, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PKinsella

Thanks for the link. I guess I never thought about the fact that there isn't gas cleaning the intakes constantly, being direct injected. I would say it's definitely worth having a catch can!
How do I get BMW to clean this under warranty??

hey before you try any hardware fixes/maintenance ask terry for the "tweaked" firmware.. 23c.. removed fuel pressure biasing, which might be the cause of your issue.. i tried it out and it fixed the jerkiness 100&

ashmostro · 06-26-2013, 05:36 PM

Wait, i don't see any threads for 23c on the other site... Pm me? Thanks!

2jzn54 · 06-26-2013, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashmostro

Wait, i don't see any threads for 23c on the other site... Pm me? Thanks!

You'll need to contact terry via email for it

WRichieX · 06-26-2013, 11:17 PM

I had the same problem when I first got my car. I just thought that I was getting used to the car so I just changed the way I drive. Haven't happened since then. However, it's nice to know that there are actual solutions for this.

ashmostro · 06-26-2013, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daily Three

You'll need to contact terry via email for it

Thanks!

Ryan71385 · 06-27-2013, 01:25 AM

Does this happen even when your clutch is warmed up? It takes about 10-15 minutes of driving before your gearbox is warmed up and is able to accelerate more smoothly. If you run map 1 or even map 2 does it do the same thing? Try turning off the jb4 (map 0) and see if it responds the same way. Ive been driving manuals for a long time and I know if the gearbox isn't warmed up you shouldn't be tromping on it too hard until it is. I have an '08 335i E92 6MT with jb4 with other performance mods. If you haven't already, you might want to look into getting a throttle body spacer. This will definitely smooth out throttle response. Let me know what you find. If it doesn't clear up on the other maps you may want to contact Terry and send in your jb4 for further troubleshooting. I hope some of this helps. Good luck

V8bait · 06-27-2013, 01:57 AM

This is common for the 6mt. I personally think it has to do with throttle by wire and the mappings in the computer. If you get even the slightest wheel spin it freaks out and pulls throttle, hit a bump it pulls throttle, I don't know what it is. But it does it stock too. Wastegate adjustments can get me pretty close, I've just learned to dive first gear differently in this car. Super light or very aggressive, not much in between.

PKinsella · 07-05-2013, 05:45 PM

I haven't looked at this thread in a while! Yes, it does it without the JB4 in it, just not quite as bad. I'm just going to have to get used to it I guess. I just got the usb cord for the JB4, so I will be updating the firmware finally. Hopefully that will fix the issue with my cruise control as well (it wouldn't work at all with the JB4 installed).

06-18-2013, 02:46 PM	#26
PKinsella Enlisted Member 5 Rep 48 Posts Drives: 2009 BMW 335i e92 Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Louisville, KY iTrader: (1)	Well, I guess it's dumb to be talking in bhp. We should be talking in whp instead of back-figuring. I think a stock LS3 C6 dyno's around 380hp 375 ft-lb, obviously dependent on a lot of variables. I'm under the impression that a JB4-only 335i is around 330-350hp, with a bit higher torque numbers (340-360?). ...but I'm no expert. I just know that my 335 sure doesn't feel as fast as my vette did (of course, there's 150-200lb weight difference too).
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06-18-2013, 04:23 PM	#27
jeffb335 102 Rep 952 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: California iTrader: (0)	op, have you looked into cleaning your intake valves? I recently did the DIY intake valve cleaning and spark plugs and the difference in low speed driveability was huge. So much so that my wife who only drives my car every few weeks came home after driving it and said "what did you do to your car, it shifts so smooth!". And for her to notice is saying something.... If you have over 40k miles you must look into this. And yes, jb4 menu 10 (wastegate default position) and 12 (duty cycle), dial those back a ways to make the throttle more linear and less "touchy".
	Appreciate 0 Quote

06-18-2013, 04:32 PM	#29
jeffb335 102 Rep 952 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: California iTrader: (0)	oh you have no idea.....start looking around and you will find many NASTY intake valve pics, here is mine at 42k (pretty much typical by the way): Here they are almost done, (dirty job!): Im running the BMS oil catch can now to reduce this in the future. There are some threads out there about this carbon build up, google intake valve cleaning or "walnut blasting" (what the dealer does)
	Appreciate 0 Quote

06-26-2013, 05:36 PM	#37
ashmostro Brigadier General 1254 Rep 4,088 Posts Drives: 2020 M4cs \| 2022 M550i Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Falls Church, VA iTrader: (27)	Wait, i don't see any threads for 23c on the other site... Pm me? Thanks!
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06-26-2013, 11:17 PM	#39
WRichieX Major 79 Rep 1,076 Posts Drives: 07 335i e93 6MT Join Date: May 2013 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0) Garage List 2007 BMW 335i E93 [0.00]	I had the same problem when I first got my car. I just thought that I was getting used to the car so I just changed the way I drive. Haven't happened since then. However, it's nice to know that there are actual solutions for this. __________________ 07 BMW 335i E93 6MT (Praying neighborhood doesn't get flooded...again) 04 Infiniti G35 Coupe 6MT (Flooded) 08 Audi TT 2.0T DSG (Flooded) 03 Subaru WRX 5MT (Flooded)
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06-27-2013, 01:25 AM	#41
Ryan71385 New Member 0 Rep 7 Posts Drives: 2008 BMW 335i E92 Join Date: May 2013 Location: Philadelphia, PA iTrader: (0)	Does this happen even when your clutch is warmed up? It takes about 10-15 minutes of driving before your gearbox is warmed up and is able to accelerate more smoothly. If you run map 1 or even map 2 does it do the same thing? Try turning off the jb4 (map 0) and see if it responds the same way. Ive been driving manuals for a long time and I know if the gearbox isn't warmed up you shouldn't be tromping on it too hard until it is. I have an '08 335i E92 6MT with jb4 with other performance mods. If you haven't already, you might want to look into getting a throttle body spacer. This will definitely smooth out throttle response. Let me know what you find. If it doesn't clear up on the other maps you may want to contact Terry and send in your jb4 for further troubleshooting. I hope some of this helps. Good luck
	Appreciate 0 Quote

06-27-2013, 01:57 AM	#42
V8bait Lieutenant 406 Rep 574 Posts Drives: e92 335i 6mt Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Houston iTrader: (1)	This is common for the 6mt. I personally think it has to do with throttle by wire and the mappings in the computer. If you get even the slightest wheel spin it freaks out and pulls throttle, hit a bump it pulls throttle, I don't know what it is. But it does it stock too. Wastegate adjustments can get me pretty close, I've just learned to dive first gear differently in this car. Super light or very aggressive, not much in between.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

07-05-2013, 05:45 PM	#43
PKinsella Enlisted Member 5 Rep 48 Posts Drives: 2009 BMW 335i e92 Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Louisville, KY iTrader: (1)	I haven't looked at this thread in a while! Yes, it does it without the JB4 in it, just not quite as bad. I'm just going to have to get used to it I guess. I just got the usb cord for the JB4, so I will be updating the firmware finally. Hopefully that will fix the issue with my cruise control as well (it wouldn't work at all with the JB4 installed).
	Appreciate 0 Quote