Small Turbo failure on my 2009 X5 35D

ninja_zx11 · 03-14-2022, 05:19 PM

Hi all,

Posting here as its related to M57 diesel engine.

My X5 was driving flawlessly until last week when suddenly I got limp mode @ 180k Kms (~112k miles). At first I thought that it would be vacuum hose, pressure converter or electric switchover valve issue but upon doing diagnostic using ISTA, it was concluded that small turbo is toast.

I am registering Zero boost. Even little vacuum (~930 Millibar) at idle and revving the engine up to ~1500 RPMs. MAP sensor is fine as it registers pressure by pressuring via Mittyvac pump. Turbine Control valve (that bypasses exhaust from the small turbo) and Compressor bypass valve are seems to be working fine as tested their actuation and movement by ISTA. So this points to small high pressure turbo failure.

I have been trying to locate the weird sound from the last 3~4 months (like a sheet metal vibrating against solid metal) only at idle which was coming from the area around vacuum pump. So this points that turbo blades might have been hitting the housing and making that noise.

It feels that it was too early for the turbo to fail. I am suspecting that it was related to the fuel dilution issue which I had when i bought this 4 years old CPO vehicle. While doing my first oil change @ 75k kms , I noticed that oil level was way too high. Issue was diesel was leaking into the oil via damaged seal of High pressure fuel pump. After couple of fights with the dealer, I was able to get my HPFP replaced under CPO warranty and it fixed that rising oil level issue. So now I am relating my turbo failure to that oil dilution problem that I had. Vehicle was driven with oil dilution issue for its first 70k kms.

I am going to remove the small turbo and see what's going on. I believe its shaft must have seized.

lnxguy · 03-16-2022, 02:01 PM

If those blade were hitting the housing, it would have popped a long time ago. Although I guess you'll find out when you pull the turbo.

ninja_zx11 · 03-16-2022, 02:17 PM

Yeah I am in the process of taking the turbo out and inspect. Removing vacuum system for the small turbo removal on X5 is really pain in the back. Getting help from my friend Yozh.

ninja_zx11 · 03-21-2022, 10:51 PM

Small turbo is out and its shaft is totally seized. Wasn't able to turn it and there is a oil film inside the exhaust port too. Blades look intact and doesn't look like blades made any contact with the housing. Oil lines seems okay and not plugged.

Large turbo seems okay as it turns freely and no play.

So what could make turbo shaft to seize? Bad Crankcase ventilation?? or something else. Any ideas please? Thanks.

lnxguy · 03-22-2022, 08:30 AM

JLine is usually the biggest culprit.

335dlci · 03-22-2022, 08:41 AM

How's the valve cover gasket?

ninja_zx11 · 03-22-2022, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335dlci

How's the valve cover gasket?

Not sure about that. No oil leak but if you are saying about the internal air leak from the Valve cover Gasket, then I don't know. I guess this can be diagnosed by measuring crankcase pressure using Manometer.

335dlci · 03-22-2022, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ninja_zx11

Not sure about that. No oil leak but if you are saying about the internal air leak from the Valve cover Gasket, then I don't know. I guess this can be diagnosed by measuring crankcase pressure using Manometer.

Yes I'm saying exactly that..

ninja_zx11 · 03-22-2022, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335dlci

Yes I'm saying exactly that..

I will rig up a DIY manometer with water hose and will check the pressure after replacing the CHRA of my small turbo.

Any suggestions about using non-nickel plated CHRA on a stock X5 35D with a working low pressure EGR? Asking because on X5 35d small turbo, compressor blades are nickel coated due to low pressure EGR but on 335D, blades are not coated. There is no CHRA available with nickel coated compressor blades. So I am just thinking to non coated CHRA on my X5 35D. CHRA is not expensive though. Any thoughts?

335dlci · 03-22-2022, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ninja_zx11

I will rig up a DIY manometer with water hose and will check the pressure after replacing the CHRA of my small turbo.

Any suggestions about using non-nickel plated CHRA on a stock X5 35D with a working low pressure EGR? Asking because on X5 35d small turbo, compressor blades are nickel coated due to low pressure EGR but on 335D, blades are not coated. There is no CHRA available with nickel coated compressor blades. So I am just thinking to non coated CHRA on my X5 35D. CHRA is not expensive though. Any thoughts?

I wouldn't waste my time checking it. I would replace it if it hasn't been done.

ninja_zx11 · 03-22-2022, 11:19 PM

Totally different issue found!!

Found a broken metal piece (which I guess from the high pressure EGR) stuck inside the exhaust side of the turbo. After removing the piece, shaft is turning fine and no play. But seals were passing little oil. Not sure if seals leaked oil after the metal piece got stuck. That metal piece carved out shape in the blades but all blades are intact.

Mik325tds · 04-16-2022, 09:03 AM

Wow. Good find! I wonder why that piece broke off and if that type of failure could eventually happen to many of us?
I just had my 335d turbos rebuild by Tim's turbo's through Whitbreadperformance (stage 2). He does quality work.

03-14-2022, 05:19 PM	#1
ninja_zx11 Private First Class 89 Rep 183 Posts Drives: X5 diesel 2009 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Langley BC,Canada iTrader: (0)	Small Turbo failure on my 2009 X5 35D Hi all, Posting here as its related to M57 diesel engine. My X5 was driving flawlessly until last week when suddenly I got limp mode @ 180k Kms (~112k miles). At first I thought that it would be vacuum hose, pressure converter or electric switchover valve issue but upon doing diagnostic using ISTA, it was concluded that small turbo is toast. I am registering Zero boost. Even little vacuum (~930 Millibar) at idle and revving the engine up to ~1500 RPMs. MAP sensor is fine as it registers pressure by pressuring via Mittyvac pump. Turbine Control valve (that bypasses exhaust from the small turbo) and Compressor bypass valve are seems to be working fine as tested their actuation and movement by ISTA. So this points to small high pressure turbo failure. I have been trying to locate the weird sound from the last 3~4 months (like a sheet metal vibrating against solid metal) only at idle which was coming from the area around vacuum pump. So this points that turbo blades might have been hitting the housing and making that noise. It feels that it was too early for the turbo to fail. I am suspecting that it was related to the fuel dilution issue which I had when i bought this 4 years old CPO vehicle. While doing my first oil change @ 75k kms , I noticed that oil level was way too high. Issue was diesel was leaking into the oil via damaged seal of High pressure fuel pump. After couple of fights with the dealer, I was able to get my HPFP replaced under CPO warranty and it fixed that rising oil level issue. So now I am relating my turbo failure to that oil dilution problem that I had. Vehicle was driven with oil dilution issue for its first 70k kms. I am going to remove the small turbo and see what's going on. I believe its shaft must have seized.
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03-16-2022, 02:01 PM	#2
lnxguy Lieutenant Colonel 357 Rep 1,723 Posts Drives: 2009 335D Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Barrie iTrader: (1)	If those blade were hitting the housing, it would have popped a long time ago. Although I guess you'll find out when you pull the turbo. __________________ '09 335D
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03-16-2022, 02:17 PM	#3
ninja_zx11 Private First Class 89 Rep 183 Posts Drives: X5 diesel 2009 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Langley BC,Canada iTrader: (0)	Yeah I am in the process of taking the turbo out and inspect. Removing vacuum system for the small turbo removal on X5 is really pain in the back. Getting help from my friend Yozh.
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03-21-2022, 10:51 PM	#4
ninja_zx11 Private First Class 89 Rep 183 Posts Drives: X5 diesel 2009 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Langley BC,Canada iTrader: (0)	Small turbo is out and its shaft is totally seized. Wasn't able to turn it and there is a oil film inside the exhaust port too. Blades look intact and doesn't look like blades made any contact with the housing. Oil lines seems okay and not plugged. Large turbo seems okay as it turns freely and no play. So what could make turbo shaft to seize? Bad Crankcase ventilation?? or something else. Any ideas please? Thanks.
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03-22-2022, 08:30 AM	#5
lnxguy Lieutenant Colonel 357 Rep 1,723 Posts Drives: 2009 335D Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Barrie iTrader: (1)	JLine is usually the biggest culprit. __________________ '09 335D
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03-22-2022, 08:41 AM	#6
335dlci Lieutenant Colonel 277 Rep 1,575 Posts Drives: 335d Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Socal iTrader: (0)	How's the valve cover gasket?
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03-22-2022, 11:19 PM	#11
ninja_zx11 Private First Class 89 Rep 183 Posts Drives: X5 diesel 2009 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Langley BC,Canada iTrader: (0)	Totally different issue found!! Found a broken metal piece (which I guess from the high pressure EGR) stuck inside the exhaust side of the turbo. After removing the piece, shaft is turning fine and no play. But seals were passing little oil. Not sure if seals leaked oil after the metal piece got stuck. That metal piece carved out shape in the blades but all blades are intact. Attached Images
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04-16-2022, 09:03 AM	#12
Mik325tds Major 807 Rep 1,191 Posts Drives: 335d M-Sport Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Greater Detroit iTrader: (0)	Wow. Good find! I wonder why that piece broke off and if that type of failure could eventually happen to many of us? I just had my 335d turbos rebuild by Tim's turbo's through Whitbreadperformance (stage 2). He does quality work.
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